Seahawks Insider

News, notes and quotes: Roster move with Harvin may be near

Post by Todd Dybas / The News Tribune on Dec. 24, 2013 at 2:24 pm with 37 Comments »
December 24, 2013 5:27 pm

Another day, another cryptic Percy Harvin update.

Pete Carroll was asked Tuesday if the Seahawks would soon have to make a move with Harvin and determine whether he can play this year.

“That may happen,” Carroll said.

A logical thought is the Seahawks could put Harvin on IR in order to bring back Walter Thurmond later this week.

Quick hits:

> Carroll said Russell Okung went through walk-through today and they expect him to be ready Sunday. Obviously, he’s crucial with Robert Quinn looming on the right side of the line.

> Asked what he sees mechanically when the running game is working well, Carroll said, “When you make a lot of yards.”

He went on to say that they will remain committed to the run and that commitment is really important. “Stay with it, keep pounding it. Get Marshawn his carries. Make sure he gets his reps. To do that, it sometimes counts on other aspects of the game.”

Carroll was asked about what determines how and when they use a fullback, and he was intentionally vague in his answer.

“That’s just gameplan,” Carroll said. “It has to do with mixing the game for them, making them defend different aspects of the run game.”

The next question, this is what Carroll said about rushing:

“It doesn’t have to necessarily do with how many yards you make, it’s the effect that you have in making first downs. If we’re making first downs with the throwing game off it and we’re making third downs, it doesn’t matter. Just setting the style we want to play at.”

So, to recap, the indicator the running game is working how they want is when it gets a lot of yards and the running game’s success doesn’t necessarily have to do with how many yards you get. Got it?

> Carroll reiterated Michael Bowie played well at right guard. Bowie said he was a little surprised that they started him there and thought there was a lot he could do better. He mainly went against Darnell Dockett and Calais Campbell.

“It was a new experience for me, but I stepped up the challenge,” Bowie said. “You’re dealing with bigger, stronger guys, it’s a lot more communication (at guard).”

In regard to facing Dockett and Campbell: “You’ve just got to stick in there, man. Hang in there,” Bowie said.

> K.J. Wright is on schedule if not ahead in his recovery, according to Carroll. “We’re real encouraged he will be back as soon as someone can (from that injury).”

> Jermaine Kearse still has an ankle problem. Derrick Coleman has a shoulder “thing,” Carroll said. Richard Sherman will also be limited in practice because of “wear and tear.”

> Carroll said he’s waiting to hear from the NFL about the interception that ended Sunday’s game. He thought it was clear it hit the ground and sent it to the league to review.

> Michael Robinson said it seems the Rams have become progressively more talkative the past couple year. If you’ll recall, Golden Tate said the same thing when explaining his taunting penalty earlier in the year against the Rams.

“I’m a talker, we’re men here,” Tate said. “We’re competing on the football field. They’re out here trying to give concussions and tear ACLs on me. There’s going to be a little chatter. I’m just going to keep it within the rules. If I score, I won’t being waving bye to them as I’m running by them. I’ll just score the touchdown and get back in the huddle and try to score another one. Going to stay away from the penalties.”

Tate went on to say that since he’s been in Seattle, the Rams have been a chirpy group and that he thinks the Seahawks can be a chirpy group as well. “I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it,” Tate said. “I think we both have a lot of respect for each other. When you’re playing this game, it’s tough not to start talking a little bit. You get in trouble when you act like me and start to wave and draw more attention to yourself. After the game, regardless of who I’m going against, I go to them and make sure to say, hey, keep it on the field, much respect, good luck the rest of the season and stay healthy.”

Tate had a small wrap at the base of his left thumb. He said it’s “a sprain or something” and wasn’t out of the ordinary for a receiver at this point in the season.

 

 

Leave a comment Comments → 37
  1. Looks like Percy won’t be the offensive saviour I hoped he’d be in the playoffs. Bummer.

  2. Todd – When they put Percy on IR maybe you could ask them if they think he’s going to be 100% for training camp? Or is he year-to-year?

  3. Dukeshire says:

    “So, to recap, the indicator the running game is working how they want is when it gets a lot of yards and the running game’s success doesn’t necessarily have to do with how many yards you get. Got it?”

    Yes, that does make sense. Rushing for X amount of yards is only one indicator of success. How it can wear down a defense after having an o line beat them down for 3+ quarters, allowing for different play call options later in a game. Like the old adage: first quarter rushes lead to fourth quarter results.

  4. thursday says:

    That turn of phrase makes it sound less dire than how it was going on around Twitter. However, I think I’m at the point where I want to see some definitive decision made because all this conjecture is getting tiresome.

  5. yakimahawk says:

    No Harvin will hurt us a lot in the playoffs. They are already squatting on our receivers because the lack of deep threat. I am also looking forward to see how Wilson reacts to his 3 game mediocre peformance. Every good to great QB goes through this but this is if not one of the most important games of his career based on this years expection. This is a horrible match up for Seattle and with Harvin looking like his old self the Hawks (though I pray not) could have a early exit this year unless this offense and Wilson find their rythym again…QUICKLY

  6. Agree w/Duke – – there are also plenty of times when 3-4 yard gains set up easy 1st down passes. What hurts are the 0-1 yard gains, too many of those of late.

    I don’t really think the Percy thing has been a distraction (thankfully) to the team, but what a frustrating disappointment it has been for us fans.

    btw, re Chuck’s note on the last piece, I was on the game chat when the question was asked about Rice/Harvin on the sidelines, and the sense I got was that Harvin was actively rehabbing on a schedule, which is why he wasn’t there (as opposed to Rice who is still in the healing phase). maybe Todd can clear that up at some point.

  7. That game long punishment delivered by the running game is why I would like to see more of M. Rob in the game than a 3rd WR. He is going to deliver blows all day long. The yards per carry might not show a difference running behind the FB but the bruises to the defense are for real. I may be wrong but it seems like we have cut down on our usage of the FB from last season to this season.

  8. wallinator says:

    Great Seahawks talk w Big Time Guest Tony Ventrella from Monday night – On the Double w The Double S Xpress at http://www.bbsradio.com/content/episode-double-2013-12-23-190000

  9. What PC said makes absolute sense. It is the credible threat of running that leads to greater success passing. Lynch is a very credible threat, but to keep that up PC has to keep feeding him, even if he is not producing yards. As long as Lynch is sucking the safeties in, and making the play-action pass work, he is still being successful. I thought Lynch did his part Sunday; it was Wilson and the passing game which fell apart.

  10. montanamike2 says:

    Tate has an injured thumb?

  11. chuck_easton says:

    The anger with Harvin is indeed the frustration of the situation. The FO went for the home run. If they connected we’d all be saying how brilliant the move was. Problem is they struck out swinging.

    Now Seattle has a boatload of money tied up in a player that has given nothing to this organization, isn’t around that much according to guys that are with the team on a daily basis, and continues to be unable to practice when everyone from the coach on down says there is nothing structurally wrong, just Harvins ability or inability to deal with the pain of practice.

    You add to that Harvin’s rep from the Vikings about being a pain towards the coaches and team medical staff. Harvin’s un availability to the guys covering the team so they can give a better answer than Dave’s ‘we don’t know anything about Harvin because we never see him or talk to him’ and Carroll’s weekly vague or confusing responses to questions and you have a situation where people are going to fill the void.

  12. ReneragMexicoHawk says:

    I think 2 of the PI calls against the Hawks were the product of the Cardinals flopping when barely feel a little contact. More teams gonna try this given the reputation of our corners. What’s your opinion?

  13. yakimahawk says:

    I think the Hawks can make a run of it this year but if they dont I am getting some peace about it. Our expectations and everyone’s were huge this year. I did not realize the Hawks are the 3rd or 2nd youngest team in the NFL…It now makes sense of all the stupid penalties and immaturaties, which as Duke said may be their unraveling. Would be great if we won it all but we may need a year or two of maturity and game sense.

  14. I just think we get called tighter due to Reputation – which is kinda funny for years Revis got the call because he was “elite” Randy Moss got more TD’s from uncalled Offensive PI’s than any other WR I have ever seen – because he was “just so amazing” but our guys are mean and pathetic so they get the calls against them – I don’t get it.

  15. Todd Dybas says:

    Hey, folks. A couple quick things off some of the questions/statements in here:

    Chuck, that answer about Harvin was from me.

    In regard to Harvin being on the sideline or not, the likely scenario is he has rehab to do and Rice, who is already out for the year, does not (at that time) since he’s not actively trying to get back on a weekly basis. I’m not going to assume anyone’s intent or judge them without talking to them or having better clarification of what is happening with them. Since Harvin is not available to talk, unfortunately, we don’t have clarification on that. We have to settle for Carroll’s vague answers. No player who is injured and not practicing is available to reporters. It’s not exclusive to Harvin.

    And, in regard to Carroll’s answers about the rushing, I’m with you that there is sustained value of continuing to run beyond pure yards, though I am going to go through fourth quarters to see if there are any indications of that. There certainly were not Sunday. I’ll be interested in the season-long totals. Mostly, I thought it was a good example of the roundabout Carroll does when he talks.

    — Todd

  16. Todd Dybas says:

    For some more context, here’s everything Carroll said on the rushing:

    (On what convinces him that the running game is going the way that he wants it to…) “When you make a lot of yards. Yeah. When you’re being really good, it’s all working. You’re asking me all of those things… that’s what’s happened and when you’re effective. I think you’re asking me more of what we have to do get effective? Maybe, maybe not. The commitment to it is really important and then we just stay with it and keep pounding and get Marshawn [Lynch] his carries. We got to make sure he gets his reps. To do that, sometimes it counts on other aspects of your game and then converting on third downs so that you get enough plays. We had 50 plays or something. 52 plays, that’s not enough. So we’re trying to get real good tempo at the line of scrimmage, come running off of the football, land marking well, finishing down field with all aspects. That’s the tight ends and the wide receivers; everybody is there available to make the most of the plays. We know that 24 is going to hit it, we’re not too concerned about that part of it. He’s been as consistent as you could hope for. So just being more consistent and precise on all aspects gets you what you want.
    (On what dictates whether he uses a fullback or not…) “That’s just the game plan. We mix it up; take advantage of different opportunities and situations. I’m going to be really vague with this answer, but it has to do with mixing the game for them, making them have to defend different aspects of our run style and our passing game.”
    (On where he draws the line when the running game is not working…) “Well it doesn’t have to necessarily do with how many yards you’re making, it’s the effect that you’re having in making first downs. If we’re making first downs with the throwing game off of it and we’re converting on third down, it’s a matter of just setting the style that we want to play at; keeping a balanced attack. We don’t want to get where we’re just throwing the football. So we have fallen into that very many times and we don’t want to. By design, we’re going to keep hammering away until the run play goes and sometimes you don’t make a lot of yards, but you’re still being effective and that’s in mixing to get the pass game where you want it.”

  17. Bobby K: Year to Year…snort…I haven’t had that good a laugh in a long time.

    All hat and no cattle.

    Those University of Florida products have definitely been disappointments around the league lately.

  18. ReneragMexicoHawk says:

    Thanks xcman

  19. Lynch’s ypc goes down as his attempts go up.

    1-10 4.7
    11-20 3.6
    21-30 3.3

    Q1 5.5
    Q2 3.9
    Q3 3.4
    Q4 3.4

    http://www.nfl.com/player/marshawnlynch/2495663/situationalstats

  20. Yeah BobbyK … Year to year… haha! Maybe someone can goad Jim Moore into asking that one. He doesn’t seem adverse to asking irritating questions. Anyone hear him interview Mike Leach last year? Yikes!

    Run game comments make sense, but they sure didn’t wear down the Cards last weekend.

    I’d hope that when the playoffs arrive the ref crews back off a bit and let them play. Seems like this is generally the case.

    Merry Christmas All!

  21. Hey Todd: kudos for all the work on x-mas eve. We appreciate you going the extra mile!

    Obviously I don’t have any inside info, but I’d like to believe that the reason we don’t see PH is because he’s working his arse off trying to get back on the field. Time will tell….

  22. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Merry Christmas everyone.

  23. montanamike2 says:

    You too Georgia.

  24. yakimahawk says:

    Would like to see the numbers when Okung and Breno have been back in…The Rushing yards per attempt may be lower, which is scary!

  25. MikeFromNewJersey says:

    I think we will see Percy in the playoffs. Pete’s comments dont mean anything.

  26. Singularitarian says:

    I hate to sound like Yakinta, but the second I heard that he was missing practice after his first game back, I went ahead and predicted his surgery did not take properly and everybody called me stupid

  27. “Todd – When they put Percy on IR maybe you could ask them if they think he’s going to be 100% for training camp? Or is he year-to-year?”

    Bobby, I think you get a very good indication of what they think about his injury, his attitude, and/or work ethic going forward early this off-season. They have to cut him within 5 days of the new league year or he is guaranteed another 11 mil.

    Everyone, PC is never going to give you detailed explanations about specific scheming, on-field performance, or injuries. He’s not going to put that out there for other teams. I don’t know how many times someone has to bang their head into the wall before they figure out that it hurts?

    Harvin’s teammates have said nothing but good things about him, not that that means that none of them has a problem with him. Chuck has shown consistently that he has no interest in the truth or fairness when it comes to Harvin. He had his opinion of Harvin when the Hawks traded for him, and everything that has happened since has been manipulated by him to fit his preconceived notions. He has no idea what the health issue with Harvin is. He has NO IDEA whether or not Harvin has structural damage right now. His doctors may not even know for sure. Just because you have an MRI DOES NOT mean that they catch everything all the time. They’d have to open it up to know for sure.

  28. “I hate to sound like Yakinta, but the second I heard that he was missing practice after his first game back, I went ahead and predicted his surgery did not take properly and everybody called me stupid”

    I never called you stupid. I said that some of what you said was stupid, which it was unless I am completely remembering wrong. I also said it was unsubstantiated speculation, which it was and still is.

  29. “Lynch’s ypc goes down as his attempts go up.

    1-10 4.7
    11-20 3.6
    21-30 3.3

    Q1 5.5
    Q2 3.9
    Q3 3.4
    Q4 3.4″

    This is undoubtedly influenced by the fact that they run the ball at the end of the game or when they have a significant lead to run out the clock when the other team KNOWS they’re going to run. Aside from that, I think the stat probably still has some legitimacy. Not sure how much.

    Am I remembering wrong or didn’t pabuwal say that Lynch wasn’t a good player when they traded for him? Serious question.

  30. abqhwkfn says:

    Harvin was a bust from the get go. Forget about him. Let him walk. It will be the same old song and dance throughout his career. just has its been to this point.. Headaches, sore hip, bad ankle, blah, blah, blah… Cut ties and move on. BEAT THE RAMS! thats all that matters right now…

  31. wabubba67 says:

    tiny bbs,

    In three posts going after three regulars here. That has to be some type of Christmas record or are you just getting your quota taken care of before 2013 ends?

    Merry Christmas, Peace on Earth.

  32. Living in Minnesota, I have never heard anything good about Harvin the teammate. He wasn’t known as a person of any type of positive character coming from high school. Fine, that was a long time ago – I’ll give him a pass. All of us did dumb things then (same with college).

    Urban Meyer ripped Harvin, in front of Harvin, to Brad Childress before the Vikings took him in the draft. He basically talked about how Harvin needed to grow up (but said, because he was young, he could turn it around… probably mentioned something about choking coaches as bad too). Talent won and the Vikings took him, but the reason Harvin fell as far as he did was his character. If Harvin would have had the brain of Wilson, he would have easily been a top 10 pick instead of dipping to the twenties.

    Obviously, Harvin hated Childress and almost beat him up on two occasions. Then Harvin hated Leslie Frazier because Harvin is Harvin. I may not think Frazier is a great coach, but I will tell you that guy has earned my full respect as a person of character and a good human being. If you can’t get along with Frazier – who can you get along with? Mr. Happy? Well, if he gives you over $11 million per season – I guess that’s a start.

    Harvin was not a well liked teammate in Minnesota as a person (or Florida, or high school). That’s well known, unless since he’s a Seahawk now so all his negative history doesn’t matter anymore (but he’d be hated if he was a 49er). Anyone who listened to talk radio shows here in MN, read the newspaper, etc. could read between the lines and figure it out if they had half a brain in their heads and this was before he demanded any trades (or to get paid).

    Some Viking players would go out in Mankato and I’ve got friends who would see them out. Guys get repuations for the type of person they are. AP is loved. He’s a good dude. Moss was an arrogant jerk (no surprise there). Culpepper wasn’t a great guy in terms of being like AP, but he wasn’t a bad guy. I don’t know of anyone who has anything positive to say about Harvin. Or have heard anything good about Harvin. These aren’t people who have agendas to want to hate Harvin either and many of this was when Harvin was entrenched as a Viking and people loved his talent and didn’t think it would go anywhere else either.

    Harvin has been paid and I’m not saying his injury isn’t/wasn’t significant… but where there’s smoke, there’s usually fire. I wish he was healthy and could play because there is no doubt that he is one of the best football players in the NFL when you judge on talent. There’s also no denying that if the FBI was hired to pry into the past of every player and write a report as to who has the most garbage on them that Harvin wouldn’t rank among the good guys of the sport either. He may not be an Adam Jones, but he’s no Russell Wilson, Zach Miller, Brandon Mebane, Red Bryant, Micheal Robinson, Doug Baldwin, etc. either.

  33. For the record, if Harvin can come back for the play-offs, I’m going to be happy as heck because I know how great he is. He’s a difference maker and I love that about him since he’s on our team.

  34. HeinieHunter says:

    You can’t predict injuries so its hard blame the FO for the Percy Harvin situation. The one small preview we had of him was spectacular to say the least. When he finally plays then get on him if he doesn’t produce. Until then give him the benefit of the doubt. No one questions that he’s injured.

  35. wabubba, good to see that you’re still an illiterate, uncomprehending buffoon. You’d clearly see that I wasn’t “going after” 3 regulars if you weren’t retarded.

    I didn’t “go after” BobbyK in the slightest. I simply answered his question.

    I didn’t “go after” pabuwal either. I simply stated what I believe is context for the stats he posted. And I said I believe they still have validity.

    I did “go after” people that question the toughness of NFL players from the safety of their keyboard and plain make things up about players’ injuries. And rightly so IMO.

    You should seriously consider learning how to read and/or laying off the sauce.

  36. wabubba67 says:

    The delusionally paranoid always claim their innocence. 1-800-GET-HELP, tiny bbs.

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