Seahawks Insider

Morning links: RB Coleman earning praise with his play

Post by Eric Williams on Aug. 15, 2013 at 7:12 am with 38 Comments »
August 15, 2013 7:13 am
Seattle Seahawks running back Derrick Coleman (40) tries to break the tackle of San Diego Chargers defensive back Sean Cattouse (40) during the second half of an NFL preseason football game Thursday, Aug. 8, 2013, in San Diego. (AP Photo/Denis Poroy)
Seattle Seahawks running back Derrick Coleman (40) tries to break the tackle of San Diego Chargers defensive back Sean Cattouse (40) during the second half of an NFL preseason football game Thursday, Aug. 8, 2013, in San Diego. (AP Photo/Denis Poroy)

Dave Boling of The News Tribune has a cool story on Seattle Seahawks running back Derrick Coleman. The second-year pro out of UCLA has had a hearing disability since the age of three, and uses hearing aids in both ears.

However, Coleman still can pick up quarterback changes at the line of scrimmage, and has been one of the pleasant surprises with his performance during training camp. Specifically, Coleman has shined on special teams.

Boling: “On his pro-day workout, he ran a 40-yard dash in 4.5 seconds, unusually swift for a 230-pound bruiser. He signed with the Minnesota Vikings as an undrafted free agent in 2012 but was released during training camp. The Seahawks added him to their practice squad in December.

The practical obstacles are overcome, mostly, by Coleman being near the quarterbacks in the huddle, and the quarterbacks being certain he can see them when they call the play.

As for the snap count, Coleman moves when he sees the ball snapped. He says he had only one false-start call his entire college career. Audibles that change the play at the line of scrimmage could be a problem, but Coleman reduces his vulnerability to mistakes by being able to read the situation just as the quarterback does.”

My story today examines Pete Carroll’s continued search for a consistent pass rush group with Cliff Avril’s return to practice on Wednesday.

Clare Farnsworth of Seahawks.com highlights some of the big plays during Wednesday’s practice.

Danny O’Neil of 710 ESPN Seattle offers a roster analysis of the offense, along with which players are on the bubble.

Curtis Crabtree of KJR-AM offers some notes from practice, including the continued battle for playing time at defensive tackle between Jesse Williams and Jordan Hill.

Bob Condotta of The Seattle Times gives us a run down of Richard Sherman’s interview with reporters on Wednesday. Sherman says Seattle’s defense is right where they want to be heading into the second preseason game.

ESPN’s Mike Sando talks with Seattle’s O’Brien Schofield, who says the change of scenery from Arizona to the Pacific Northwest has given him a new sense of purpose.

Pat Kirwan of CBS Sports mined some interesting nuggets from his visit with good friend Pete Carroll in Seattle. Among them, Kirwan believes Seattle can get to 50 sacks this season with new additions Cliff Avril, Michael Bennett and O’Brien Schofield. Kirwan also says Percy Harvin is optimistically looking at a Week 12 return, but more realistically will be back if Seattle reaches the playoffs. Interesting read.

The NFL Total Access talks with Seattle MLB Bobby Wagner in this video link.

Seahawks cornerback Richard Sherman has signed and one-year endorsement deal with CenturyLink.

Rich Cimini of ESPN New York talks to former Seahawks receiver Braylon Edwards, who believes he can still play at an elite level. Hmmm.

Joe Fortenbaugh of the National Football Post lists Brandon Browner and Michael Bennett among his top 25 NFL players heading into contract years. I’m surprised Golden Tate is not in this list.

Don Banks of Sports Illustrated says some stories this time of year are overhyped, including Minnesota receiver Greg Jennings’ reportedly dissing his former team Green Bay.

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Morning links
Leave a comment Comments → 38
  1. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    cracks me up talking to raider/niner’s fans,” we are better than Hawks because we have won superbowls” that is the weekest thing any fan could say. just had a niners fan say “well how many superbowls have the hawks won?” when he lost the argument with me. my reply” what’s that got to do with anything?” his reply” until they win 5 superbowls they are not any good” “really”? stupid people with week arguments should not blog.

  2. RDPoulsbo says:

    From yesterday’s post bbnate, sorry to slight your broken golden boy, but you are the one denying the facts. Carp DID lose out to Breno before injuring himself.
    When Carp was hacking and wheezing while out of shape his at the end of his rookie year TC, this happened:
    Cable makes no excuses for his unit’s poor play. He says one rookie, offensive guard John Moffitt, is playing well. And he will try to get his other rookie, offensive tackle James Carpenter, up to speed by the team’s regular-season opener against San Francisco in 11 days.

    But if that doesn’t happen, Cable is not shy about using other options, including reserve tackle Breno Giacomini.

    http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2011/08/31/morning-links-o-line-a-work-in-progress/

    So yes, before the season started, Carp lost out to Breno for the RT spot after it was very apparent that he was too slow to pass protect against nickle DEs. Gallery getting injured just before the season started was a convenient excuse to attempt to salvage the situation, but the fact remains he had already lost his RT spot in TC. If he won it, then someone else would have been playing LG.

    Yes, they tried again later in the season, but it was very apparent that he was to slow to pass protect against nickle DEs and has never been tried at RT since.

    And I really don’t care if about cap cost between RT and LG. He was drafted to start at RT, or as Pete said on the day he was drafted, “this is a statement of what we’re going to do.” You look at that right side of the line and you see neither Carp or Moffitt after 3 years. At least Moffitt has a chance to beat out Sweezy, but it sounds like that’s not happening either. And in year 3, he still has barely played, much less to the expectations of a 1st round pick.

    JS/PC have done a great job drafting, but that doesn’t mean every pick pans out. Carp happens to be one of those guys.

  3. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    RD, couldn’t agree more on Carp. what’s funny is they hit so well on later picks rather than early ones. maybe it is they take more chances on a higher pick than on later rounds. maybe it’s something like” can you imagine if we can get this guy to.. ” vs.” this guy is a great value great fit ”

    i have said before i don’t care where they hit as long as they do. this front office hits more than it misses so all is good.

  4. RDPoulsbo says:

    At the same time, you have Okung, Thomas and Irvin as good 1st round picks. I’ve said before that Okung’s previous injuries were not because he was injury prone, but came due to some of the terrible cut blockers whiffing and hitting his knee or from cheap shots. Irvin is just now rounding out his game after leading rookies in sacks.

    I think Carp and Moffitt were both Cable picks, which highlights both his greatest strength and weakness as a coach. He’s not very good at identifying talent, but he excels at honing the talent he has.

  5. abqhwkfn says:

    I think the message sent by drafting both Carp and Moffit was received. This is going to be a run first smash mouth football team. The players drafted along with Carp and Moffit fit the same mold. The point being to make the parts interchangeable and create competition. There is always injuries and always picks that dont work out. Overall this team has done an excellent job drafting players. The weakness seems to be in adding overrated free agents.

  6. SaigonSun says:

    Georgia, this one’s for you,

    Finishing what you start.

    I’m passing this on because it worked for me today.

    A Dr. on TV said to have inner peace we should always finish things we start & we all could use more calm in our lives.
    I looked around my house to find things I’d started & hadn’t finished.

    So I finished off a bottle of Merlot, a bottle of Chardonnay, a bodle of tickyla, a butle of wum, tha mainder of Valiuminun scriptins, an a bocksa chocletz. Yu haf no idr how fablus I feel rite now.

    Sned this to all who need innerr piss. An telum u luvum – an I luvum too.

  7. montanamike2 says:

    I think pretty much the same on Cable RDPoulsbo.

  8. montanamike2 says:

    We draft excellent!

  9. RDPoulsbo says:

    The Coleman story is pretty cool. I don’t think he’d have worked in Holmgren’s system with all the complex audibles. It’s hard to see him make the 53 with the numbers game, but it’s possible he could get picked up by another team. A bit of trivia: the huddle was invented by Gallaudet University, the national school for the deaf so players could gather around and see the sign for the next play.

    Oh, and has Braylon Edwards’s 1 good year a long time ago didn’t make him elite.

  10. PugetHawk says:

    I really enjoyed reading Kirwans article. Lots of things you don’t always hear about. Great work Pat!

  11. RD, Why are you so keen on calling Carp a bust? You’ve been calling him out for 2 days straight now?

  12. RDPoulsbo says:

    I’ve been calling him that for more than 2 days and I’m certainly not the only one. I’ve also been saying Moffitt is a disappointment, but not ready to call him a bust just yet. At least he’s still competing for the starting job.

    First and foremost, he’s constantly injured and never in shape. He has been in the doghouse since he first arrived at camp in 2011 because he’s been overweight. He’s losing camp battles whenever he’s been in the mix. He was too slow to play RT, the position he was supposed to play to begin with. He tore his ACL in a non-contact drill in practice and had a ton of trouble getting back from it. I take it as a sign that was still overweight and out of shape. Now he’s injured again. In his 3rd year, he’s been barely serviceable when he as played. Is this what you’d expect from a 1st round pick?

    AJ Jenkins in SF is fun to laugh about because he too is proving to be a 1st round bust that can’t perform when he’s on the field, but that doesn’t mean I should give Carp a pass just because he’s a Seahawk.

  13. wazzulander says:

    I’m glad to see Coleman get recognized. He definitely was a standout performer in the SD game. He looks like a 110% effort guy in his running, blocking and kick coverage, I’m really pulling for him to make the team.

  14. Dukeshire says:

    RDPoulsbo – The reason Carp started the 2011 season at LG and Breno at RT was due to an injury to Gallery.

  15. RDPoulsbo says:

    With all due respect, go back and look at what happened during the 2011 TC. Carp was outplayed by Breno throughout. Breno was already given the starting job before Gallery went down and Carp was moved to LG for week 1, after practicing exclusively at RT. The FO did their best to try and spin it, but the timeline of what happened is documented on this very blog. They tried their best to make it work like you’d expect them to do with a 1st round pick, but it never did. His pass protection was nothing short of horrendous.

    http://www.footballoutsiders.com/under-pressure/2011/under-pressure-whos-getting-beat

    That’s Carpenter tied for 4th most sacks given up through week 9 in 2011, right when he tore his ACL pushing air.

  16. Dukeshire says:

    I understand that Breno was coming on and that Cable really liked him. That’s not in question. The fact is however, that Carp was shifted to LG for the opener because of Gallery’s injury. That may have given Breno all he needed to stick at RT, but let’s not be too revisionist here.

    If you are saying that Breno was named the starting RT prior to Gallery’s injury, I’d like to see that. Because if that’s the case, my memory is cloudy.

  17. SandpointHawk says:

    Got to agree with Dukeshire on this one. If you have some inside info RDPoulsbo please feel free to share with source…

  18. RDPoulsbo says:

    My 1st post was admittedly garbled. Maybe this will help. I was saying Carp effectively lost the starting RT position in preseason and would never have started at either position had Gallery not been injured.

    PC wouldn’t name Carp the starting RT before week 1 when Gallery’s injury was uncertain.
    http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2011/09/03/carroll-gallery-wilkerson-questionable-for-opener/

    PC wouldn’t name Carp the starting RT after week 1 when Gallery was going to return.
    http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2011/09/14/gallery-rice-and-hawthorne-on-the-practice-field/

    I guess this might be the best to quote Eric from one of his articles:
    Carpenter, 22, was out of shape and lost, so much so that Seattle head coach Pete Carroll opened up the right tackle position to backup Breno Giacomini, and tinkered with moving the Alabama product to left guard with Robert Gallery unavailable for the team’s regular-season opener because of a sprained knee. Carpenter ended up starting at left guard next to Okung against San Francisco.

    http://www.thenewstribune.com/2011/09/30/1845907/rookie-carpenter-gets-comfy.html

    Now people can claim all they want he was going to start Week 1 at RT if not for Gallery’s injury, but why would you move your starting rookie RT to LG for the opening week of the regular season after not practicing there at all through TC? The answer is you don’t unless that rookie RT lost his starting job.

  19. Dukeshire says:

    That’s a reasonable take, for sure. But on draft day Cable and Carroll both noted one of the things they liked most about Carpenter was his versatility. I guess another way of thinking about it is whether Carpenter would have been benched entirely if Gallery had been healthy? That seems highly unlikely to me, but as we both know, Breno was pushing for that RT spot regardless.

  20. RDPoulsbo says:

    It’s hard for them to admit made a poor pick, especially when their top 2 picks that year were in positions of dire need. 2011 was brutal and that was when Carp was healthy while giving up the 4th most sacks and most by a RT before getting injured.

    Moving Carp to LG is undoubtedly a salvage operation. Draft picks are an especially important resource while there’s a flat cap. Guards just don’t get drafted in the 1st round unless they’re a “can’t miss” Probowl type guy. Besides, the Hawks insisted on listing him as a T, not G, or G/T that year. Even McQuistan is still being listed as G/T even though he started at LG all last year and a good portion of 2011.

  21. Dukeshire says:

    I’m not following your logic here. They drafted him knowing, and flat out telling us, they liked Carpenter’s versatility. That is, his ability to also play guard. Salvage operation would imply desperation. They only thing desperate about Carpenter at this stage is his inability to stay healthy.

    As far as where the Seahawks web site lists his position, that has no bearing on how Carroll and his staff see him, or any other player.

    And lastly, your acknowledgement that he in fact did play tackle after filling in for Gallery at guard would seem to undermine the argument that Breno beat him out for the RT position, prior to Carps injury.

    We do know that Carpenter’s future here is at guard, not tackle, now, regardless. Breno has developed far beyond what I thought he’d be capable of after he first got here from GB. In any case, as I too mentioned a thread or two back, we both see Carpenter currently as a bust.

  22. RDPoulsbo says:

    Carp lost his starting job in TC. That was especially apparent after his craptacular performance against Denver. Did he regain it? I guess you could say so, but he still sucked as much as he did in the preseason. It begs the question, was it forced? He didn’t play LG when Gallery went down again. McQuistan got those starts instead. Yes they liked, his versatility, but they stressed that he was going to be their RT after he was drafted.

  23. So if they missed on Carp that is 100% on Cable – he pushed and pushed HARD to draft him. I like Cable but hopefully someday soon his guys will actually be able to mesh/play well starting week one not starting week 8-10, like it has been for the last few years.

    If Wilson is running around because there is no pocket the OL isn’t ready and that is a DIRECT reflection on Cable. These are his guys now – yes a hold over or 2 but it’s his unit and they better start to show well, as a whole, not just 2 of them.

  24. RDPoulsbo says:

    To add one more thing, was Gallery signed to a 3 year, $15 mil contact to be a backup? Was Moffitt drafted in the 3rd round to be a backup? If no on both, then Carpenter was certainly not drafted in the 1st round to be a guard.

  25. GeorgiaHawk says:

    No doubt in my mind that Carpenter & Moffitt were handed starting positions in their rookie year.

    If it was the case that we had nothing better it still doesn’t change the fact that they down right sucked.
    The FO could have gone out and picked up better talent/experience in free agency.
    It probably cost us a couple games and not making it to the playoffs too.
    Oh well, Can’t have everything go your way.

  26. bbnate420 says:

    “To add one more thing, was Gallery signed to a 3 year, $15 mil contact to be a backup? Was Moffitt drafted in the 3rd round to be a backup? If no on both, then Carpenter was certainly not drafted in the 1st round to be a guard.” -RDPoulsbo

    RD, I’ll start off by making it clear that I’m not trying to be personally insulting, but this is specious reasoning at best. Signing or drafting someone to be a starter versus a backup has NOTHING to do with the difference between drafting a OG or RT in the first round. NOTHING.

    As far as me ignoring facts, you have provided none that I can see. All I see you providing is opinions and quotes that have either been misconstrued or taken out of context.

    Carp did not lose out to Breno in TC. He started the 1st game at LG with Gallery out and then STARTED THE NEXT 8 GAMES AT RT over Breno. They didn’t try again later. They started him at RT the very next week as Gallery was back. And every week after that until he tore his ACL. That’s a fact. Not an opinion. Breno started the last 7 games of 2011 after Carp tore his ACL. Now you can speculate that Carp started over Breno simply because they drafted him in the first round. You could be right or wrong. It’s just speculation. But it’s a fact that Carp started over Breno at RT his rookie year. I’d love for you or anyone else to explain how someone got beaten out by someone when they were starting over them?

    “But if that doesn’t happen, Cable is not shy about using other options, including reserve tackle Breno Giacomini.”

    This does not mean that Carp had lost his position to Breno. It meant what he said, that they weren’t above using other players if Carp didn’t get up to speed by week one. You’re making an awfully big assumption.

    “this is a statement of what we’re going to do.”

    This is another quote that you have misconstrued IMO. It says nothing about them expecting Carp to stay at RT. It was saying that drafting o-lineman with their first 2 picks showed that they wanted to be physical and run the ball.

    http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2011/09/30/morning-links-carpenter-making-the-grade/

    Here’s a thread and article about Carp improving at RT by Eric if you want to use him as a source.

  27. bbnate420 says:

    RD, if you think that someone is a bust simply because they aren’t playing the same position they played their rookie year, then I don’t know what to say to you? That’s completely nonsensical to me. As xcman said, KJ Wright used to play SLB. And he played some MLB as a rookie. Now he’s a WLB. I guess he’s a bust then? Mike Rob was drafted as a RB. He’s now a FB. I guess he’s a bust? BB played S when he first was in the NFL with Denver. I guess he’s a bust? Devin McCourty was drafted as a CB. I guess he’s a bust?

    The RT position has no more value in the NFL than the OG position. You could easily argue less since OGs are paid better. It’s clear that people in the NFL value OGs at least as highly as RTs by the way they draft and pay players. I don’t get why you wouldn’t care that the position he moved to is at least as highly valued as the one he played before?

    http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/fulldraft

    Here’s a history of the first round. It’s clear to me that RTs aren’t drafted higher generally. Both OGs Cooper and Warmack were drafted before Fluker in 2013. Riley Reiff and DeCastro were drafted back to back in 2012, and many look at Reiff as a potential LT. I could go on and on.

    http://www.overthecap.com/top-player-salaries.php?Position=RT

    http://www.overthecap.com/top-player-salaries.php?Position=G

    Here are the salaries again.

    It has nothing to do with Carp being my “Golden Boy”. It has to do with having an accurate picture of reality and not revising history incorrectly. I think he has been a bust or disappointing, however you want to put it. But it’s mainly because of his ACL injury so far. He was brought back too quickly.

    It seems to me like you want to look for any shred of evidence to support what you want to believe rather than basing your opinion on the available evidence.

  28. RDPoulsbo says:

    Nate, his complete failure as a RT is just one reason I’m calling him a bust, though you seemed to want to call me out by saying it was a fallacy that he moved to LG week 1 of his rookie year because he was being beaten out. I’m asking you to use your critical thinking skills. With Gallery and Moffitt both projecting as starters and coaches happy with projecting as starting guards, plus the coaches being completely unhappy with Carp playing tackle, there was zero chance they would have moved him if he didn’t fail as a RT.

    As I’ve mentioned above, he is constantly overweight and out of shape, even as a guard. That also happens to be why he failed as a RT. He’s rarely on the field, let alone playing to expectations at any position. He’s being outperformed by several guys, including a guy who played offense for the first time last year. You’re sounding a lot like people defending Kelly Jennings as a 1st round pick because he was just a low 1st round pick. Admittedly, Jennings was more productive for the team though.

  29. bbnate420 says:

    Ask most people here, RD. Did Carp start week 1 of 2011 at LG because,

    A) Carp was beaten out at RT by Breno

    or

    B) Gallery was injured at LG?

    And competing with Gallery at LG doesn’t really mean shit. Carp was the future on the o-line. He was Gallery wasn’t given much guaranteed money. They were hardly committed to him.

  30. bbnate420 says:

    RD, the ONE year that Gallery and Carp were here together, Carp started 8 out of the 9 weeks he was healthy over Breno at RT, with week 1 while Gallery was injured at LG. Of course who starts has NOTHING to do with who won the position battle, right??????????????????

  31. RDPoulsbo says:

    Yeah, and you put your rookie starting RT that needs all the experience he can get at his position over at LG with less than a week of practice all right after being called out by the coaches because of his competence…right. Keep parroting the party line.

    Meanwhile, he’s constantly getting injured by his own doing because he’s overweight and out of shape.

  32. bbnate420 says:

    You’ve yet to explain weeks 2-9. Gallery was at LG. Carp started at RT. Breno was on the BENCH! You’ve yet to explain that away.

  33. RDPoulsbo says:

    Did he lose the camp battle? Sure looks looks he did because he wasn’t starting where he practiced all offseason. You sure seen to have forgotten just how much he was in the doghouse back then. Did he regain his spot? I guess that’s what you’d call that, while leading all RTs in sacks given up until he you’re his ACL in a non-contact drill.

    How did that happen btw? Was he lunging with no body control because he was out of shape? Or was it that his knee just gave out because he was overweight?

  34. RDPoulsbo says:

    PC/JS are no different than other FOs. They weren’t willing to admit their 1st round pick was a bad one and tried forcing the issue. Bad picks happen and Carp hasn’t come close to meeting any expectations you’d have for a top pick.

  35. bbnate420 says:

    I put my info out there. You put yours. People can decide. I see no further point in arguing with you about it.

  36. bbnate420 says:

    “Did he lose the camp battle? Sure looks looks he did because he wasn’t starting where he practiced all offseason.”

    This proves that you don’t know what you’re talking about. Carp and Moffitt had NO REAL off-season when they were rookies in 2011. Carp came into the 2011 camp as the RT and started 8 out of nine games he played there. The one he didn’t was when he played LG for Gallery.

  37. RDPoulsbo says:

    I thought there was no further point in arguing?

    There was TC and preseason right? Besides, what were players doing during the lockout? Sitting around, playing Madden and drinking beer? It seems most everyone else came to TC in shape. You’re parroting the party line, I take issue with that interpretation it because it defies all logic. If Carp won the starting RT spot, he and McQuistan would have started as he did when Gallery went down the 2nd time. As for this year, it’s very hard to imagine he’s going to win the LG spot this time while spending his time in the training room. That’s 0-2 in camp battles.

    You still haven’t taken issue with my many other reasons why I consider Carp a bust. Your premise that I’m wrong seems to be based on the fact that both positions average about the same amount of money. I don’t disagree, but I reject that premise on the very basis that he hasn’t performed at a level to justify that salary to begin with at either position.

  38. bbnate420 says:

    They don’t average the same. OGs make more. Simple reading comprehension. You still haven’t explained how one person beat out another when they were on the bench? You can’t. Carp started the first preseason game in 2011 at RT. He started 8 games out of 9 his rookie year at RT, ALL WHILE BRENO WAS HEALTHY. He ONLY played LG the first game in 2011 due too injury.

    I said that I think Carp is a bust or disappointing. This is due to injury IMO though. It seems you don’t even read the responses. I was never arguing whether or not Carp was a bust. I have said many times that he is due to injuries.

    Carp stayed at RT in 2011 from week 2-10. Then he was injured. No one took his spot while healthy.

    You claim that Breno took over for Carp during the 2011 TC. Yet you offer ZERO proof. Carp started every preseason game at RT, and he played 8 of the 9 games he played in 2011 at RT. It’s sad at this point.

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