Seahawks Insider

Carroll on Harvin: Surgery a possibility

Post by Eric Williams on July 25, 2013 at 1:35 pm with 86 Comments »
July 25, 2013 1:44 pm
Seattle Seahawks receiver Percy Harvin talks with head coach Pete Carroll at the opening of training camp on Thursday (Lui Kit Wong/The News Tribune)
Seattle Seahawks receiver Percy Harvin talks with head coach Pete Carroll at the opening of training camp on Thursday (Lui Kit Wong/The News Tribune)

Seattle Seahawks head coach Pete Carroll responded to a report by Ian Rapoport of the NFL Network that receiver Percy Havin is seeking an second opinion on a hip issue early next week, and that the possibility of surgery has not been ruled out.

Harvin was one of six Seattle players placed on the physically unable to perform (PUP) list to begin training camp, joining tight end Zach Miller (foot), defensive end Chris Clemons (knee), defensive lineman Greg Scruggs (knee), Robert Turbin (foot) and cornerback Tharold Simon (foot).

Linebacker Korey Toomer (knee) was placed on the non-football injury list.

“Percy’s got a hip issue that we’re dealing with, that came up while he was working out during the summer,” Carroll said. “And we’re trying to figure it out. We’re going to do everything we can to make the right decision to help him, and take care of him in every way.

“He was working out just a week or so ago, and going full speed. But it was bothering him enough, and we took some looks at it. And we’re going to try and figure out what ar the right procedures to take care of him, and get him back on the field.”

Carroll confirmed an earlier report by the league website that Harvin’s injury could be a possible labrum tear in the receiver’s hip, and did not rule out the possibility that the team’s main offseason addition might require surgery that could put him on the shelf for a significant period of time.

“It may be; we’ll find out,” Carroll said, when asked about the possibility of surgery. “We’re going to go ahead and do it step by step right now. I know he was working full speed just a few days ago, but we need to take care of him. So we’re going to take every precaution to do that.”

Asked about his level of concern regarding Harvin’s injury, Carroll had this to say: “Right now we need to get more information. We don’t know enough right now. So we’ll just wait and see. The good part is it’s really early, and we have a lot of time to get him ready.”

The Seahawks made a big offseason trade to secure Harvin’s services from Minnesota, giving up a first and seventh round selections in this year’s draft, and a third-round pick in 2014.

Seattle signed Harvin to a six-year, $67 million deal, including $25.5 million in guaranteed money.

Harvin missed the final seven games of 2012 with a high-ankle sprain suffered against Seattle last year, but never showed up on the injury report last year in Minnesota with a hip issue

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Leave a comment Comments → 86
  1. Uh oh.

    That’s all I can say. Hoping for good news.

  2. Every year we get players who at the last minute need surgery to fix something they should have had fixed months before it gets old.

  3. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Get him healed up!
    Being healthy around playoff time is most important imo.

  4. Dukeshire says:

    MauMau – In fairness, Carroll noted this is something that developed this summer, and as of a week ago was going full speed. Sounds unlikely that there was anything to fix months ago.

  5. yankinta says:

    Is the 2014 3rd round pick we gave up for him, conditional?? I really hope so. If he misses enough games, maybe we’ll only have to give up 4th round pick for him…

  6. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Good to see that Scruggs is on PUP. That means there’s still a chance he will play later this year.

  7. Well that’s a downer for first day of TC. Hopefully, the news gets better from here. Good thing we hung onto all of these receivers…

  8. Well, it’s always a huge risk when you give up a lot of money and picks for a smallish WR who has had health problems and has not managed a play from scrimmage over 51 yards.

    In the end, I don’t see Harvin as making a difference to the Seahawks Super Bowl Hopes. All the Seahawks need is for Bennett and Avril to help close some games out. Their offense was nearly unstoppable last year without Harvin and will be better regardless. If the Defense can mature and play up to it’s reputation, everything will be fine.

  9. MoSeahawk12 says:

    repeat from last thread. Totally agree with papuwal.

    Wilson made plenty of plays last season without Percy and still has Rice, Tate, Baldwin, and Lynch. I don’t think the team or players will worry much about this, yet.
    As fans of course we want to have all the toys on the field and have envisioned video game type of play with Wilson and Percy together.
    As coach Pete said in the press conference, it’s waaaay to soon to guess. The team will be smart with all it’s players and prepare for a long season. The good news is that today was only the first day of camp.

  10. Dukeshire says:

    By “playing up to their reputation” I presume you mean less passively on 3rd and passing and in one possession late game scenarios, which was overwhelmingly a Bradley issue, not a maturation issue with the players on the field

  11. chuck_easton says:

    Georgia,

    The problem with that is thus.

    Healing time for this surgery is 3 to 4 months. If he has it means he wouldn’t be ready until November to December.

    If he starts the year on PUP he is not eligible to come off PUP until after the October 13th game. The team then has two weeks to evaluate him to either activate him or place him on IR.

    That takes the team to Nov 1. If Harvin still isn’t ready he can go on IR with the returnable at a later date or he can go on Season ending IR.

    My guess is Harvin is lost for at least the first 10 to 12 games. If Seattle isn’t in playoff contention at that time he is out for the year.

    This is quickly becoming a bad trade. 12 million towards the cap this year and we may not see him play a snap.

  12. That is one part of what I mean. The second part of what I mean is not going on the road and getting destroyed by the likes of Titus Young, Kevin Kolb and Ryan Tannehill. Tannehill will probably end up as a decent QB but he was spotty last year. He should not have done what he did in the 4th quarter of the Seahawks game.

    If they could have handled just one of those 3 (ie made them play as poorly as they played during the year), they would have won the Division and in my opinion, the Super Bowl.

  13. I think it goes both ways Duke. Bradley did hold his defense back sometimes, but he had a lot of young guys and some holes in coverage, so he was conservative with blitzes.

    This year, they add Winfield, a couple of better pass rushers, and have more maturity and experience from guys like Wagner, who couldn’t always be counted on to cover well last year. Quinn should be able to send a LB or S or CB on a blitz more often, and do other things with the rush schemes too. But I think if Bradley were still here, given what Quinn now has to work with, we might expect the same.

    Same was true with our offense last year. Early on it was very conservative, end of year it was wide-open. Same coaches, more experienced players being taught more plays and then cut loose.

  14. Knowing this front office, why wouldn’t it surprise me if Harper ends up a much better value than Harvin in the long run? I have no opinion on Harper, but simply stating how well the front office does in unearthing legendary value in the draft while routinely overpaying for good but not elite players in Free Agency.

  15. With the depth on our roster, we can deal with injuries now and through much of the season. The time that injuries will be killers will be in December (finishing the Season with Niners, Giants, Cardinals, Rams) and then the playoff, of course.

    Being healthy in December-January is more important than being healthy now..

  16. abqhwkfn says:

    Mr. Baldwin, time to step up. I was never impressed with this group of receivers even with Percy in the lineup. I hope the lack of production was due to game plan and RW developing early last year. We shall see.

  17. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Chuck- Even if it is a bad trade we still have Russell Wilson, and many other mid round steals.

    http://www.seahawks.com/videos-photos/videos/Training-Camp-Press-Conference-Russell-Wilson/641f1412-8e7e-42bc-961e-77dae2e19ea3

  18. abqhwkfn says:

    I too am hoping Harper makes a big splash soon. Overhauling the receiver position is something Id like to see. Preferably with much bigger athletes.

  19. abqhwkfn says:

    Eric, whats up with Zach Miller and Turbin? Any idea as to when they might see the field?

  20. abqhwkfn says:

    If Percys injury was a week or so ago, how come they still don’t know if its a torn labrum or not?

  21. doubledink says:

    probably just did the MRI within the last 2 days. They want a 2nd opinion.

  22. GeorgiaHawk says:

    abqhwkfn- We have many proven players on this team that may have a minor ding here or there.
    No need to put them out there in training camp if they are already proven players.
    Let them heal and be ready for the real games.

  23. simpsonian says:

    Depending on the severity of the tear, it might be something that he could wait until after the season for. Labral tears are sometimes hard to diagnose so it’s not surprising that it popped up like this. He’ll need to get some imaging done to confirm the tear.

  24. Dukeshire says:

    I’ll be interested to learn who is now returning kickoffs.

  25. walliworld says:

    An early wrinkle in the Year of the Hawk…we’ll be talking Percy Harvin with a guy who covered him in Minnesota, former KSTW Sports Director Rod Simons. Tune in Monday at 7pm to On the Double with The Double S Xpress at http://www.double-s-xpress.com & all shows OnDemand http://www.double-s-xpress.com/shows.html @DoubleSXpress

  26. RDPoulsbo says:

    Let’s first find out a little more before we go throwing Harvin onto the IR. Maybe it just requires downtime maintainence like Lynch’s back or non-surgery treatments. If it is 8-12 weeks to recovery after surgery and he has it before the end of the week, a worst case scenario is missing 2-6 games of the regular season.

    If there’s one place I’m not so worried about depth, it’s at WR. Baldwin’s healthy this year and they don’t use a lot of 4-wide sets. There’s plenty of weapons still while waiting to to get Harvin back.

  27. SandpointHawk says:

    Dukeshire ~Good point I hadn’t though about since hearing this…

  28. SignalCaller03 says:

    Depth and talent are two different things at the WR position. Harvin is a game-changer, and will be absolutely missed. For those saying otherwise they are mistaken. This is a huge blow if he can’t play week one.

  29. abqhwkfn says:

    Georgia, I guess my question should be will they be ready for week 1?

    simpsonian, I do medical imaging for a living. A labral tear is there or its not and clearly visible with contrasted MRI. They can also perform an injection into the hip joint with local anesthetic to see if the pain subsides. If not then there is most likely a tear. Im sure the Hawks have a top notch medical staff. In my opinion, a diagnosis should have been made by now.

  30. sluggo42 says:

    I’m pissed.

  31. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Letting go of Washington may come back to haunt us.

  32. abqhwkfn says:

    Has Percy Harvin had hip issues in the past? I dont recall hearing anything of the sort. However, labrum tears are usually a tell tale sign of degenerative disease. Which is not good.

  33. simpsonian says:

    @abqhwkfn did carroll say he’d had imaging already?

  34. chuck_easton says:

    Abqhwhfn,

    Thanks for the professional insite. I read in another article it was revealed in an MRI done this week. The question is the teams medical staff think Harvin can play through it. Harvin is seeking a second opinion. That is a red flag. Usually it is the team medical staff saying surgery is necessary and the player wants a second opinion to see if they really need the surgery or if they can play through it.

    The fact that Harvin is wanting the surgery tells e it is his intention to get the surgery and miss the season.

    RDPoulsbo, the recovery time is 12-16 weeks, not 8-12. Three to four months not two to three months.

  35. Dukeshire says:

    Yes, we know there has already been a diagnosis. The question it seems is whether it requires surgery or not, and from that view stems the second opinion. At least as far as I can read.

  36. RDPoulsbo says:

    No one’s discounting Harvin’s assets to the team. Just saying quit running around like chicken littles declaring the sky is falling. The team has plenty of options to get by successfully until he gets back. It’s not like he ruptured his achilles, he’ll be back with plenty of football to play even under the worst of scenarios.

  37. abqhwkfn says:

    simpsonian,
    Im pretty sure anyone worth 60+ million to your organization will have imaging done ASAP.

    Chuck,
    That is not good news. Perhaps he could play through it. but something tells me Harvin is not that type of player. Which is why I was not a fan of this trade from the get go. Hopefully I am wrong and he plays his a?? off this year and makes a fool of me..

  38. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Chuck, if Harvins recovery time is 12 to 16 weeks than we should have him available by week 10.
    What’s so wrong with that?

  39. dirtbiker_joey says:

    Not worried. Defense and running game were, are, and always will be the strength of this PC-coached team. The defense is in-arguably elite, and added some nice pieces in the offseason; the offensive backfield is the deepest unit on the squad. Harvin is an awesome added bonus weapon for the offense (and return game), but certainly not a cornerstone of the team. Whether he is ready from day 1, or comes back later to give the team a boost during their playoff run, we are still stacked, committed, and on track for our first Lombardi Trophy!

  40. MoSeahawk12 says:

    Exactly RDPoulsbo!! This team held it’s own last year with a rookie QB and a well rounded supporting cast. The media has been saying that we signed Harvin as a win now move to get to the Superbowl. These guys know full well they can get there on there own and that Percy was another exciting piece of the puzzle. If they can’t win without him and by no means do we know that at all, then they don’t deserve to get there anyway. There are plenty of other players that would hurt our chances more than Percy.

    It’s not like we’re the 9ers and lost our clear cut #1 receiver and are going to have to heavily modify the gameplan. We scored plenty of points with the crew we have and now they have a year of experience together. The O-line coming together with Carpenter is way more critical to success than a luxury receiver at this point. As good as he can be, when we get Percy that will just be a bonus.

  41. Harvins history tells us he is not going to play through pain – This was the knock on him in Minny, he is a game changer, but he actually has to be in the game to effect it. Not sure this type of personality will fit on this team – time will tell

  42. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Who needs Harvin when we have Baldwin?

  43. abqhwkfn says:

    there you go Georgia.. Thats what im saying.

  44. Our ST’s need Harvin. There is not another guy READY right now – someone is going to have to step up BIG

  45. MoSeahawk12 says:

    I follow D Baldwin on twitter and I gotta say the guy is seriously focused and has been for months. He definitely has the Eye of the Tiger. I think we see the Baldwin from two years ago and not the one from last year.

  46. Dukeshire says:

    The issue in potentially losing Harvin isn’t who will / can play the slot. It’s the (potential) loss of such a dynamic talent: receiver, backfield, and special teams. Be brings a versatility to this offense that no one else can. The offense is loaded IMO regardless, but minimizing what a player like Harvin can open up for them is shortsighted.

  47. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I think Baldwin and Tate can do a decent job on STs.

  48. sluggo42 says:

    Well, Baldwin is a mighty fine consolation prize, this is true.

    However, this is like getting the hot wheels trike of every 5 year olds dreams, and on Christmas morning, the first time he sits down on it, the wheel falls off, and it has to be returned to the store, but they are out of stock for 4 months…

    It kinda leaves a bitter taste in the mouth. Sure ya got lots of other great toys and lots of underwear from granny, but damn, my hot wheels broke…

  49. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    here’s a break down on hip labrum injuries

    How Does a Tear Occur in the Hip Labrum?
    There are two general types of hip labral tears: degenerative tears and traumatic injuries.

    A degenerative tear is a chronic injury that occurs as a result of repetitive use and activity. Degenerative labral tears can be seen in the early stages of hip arthritis.

    A traumatic hip labral tear is usually an acute injury as a result of a sports injury, fall, or accident. Hip labral tears can be seen in association with episodes of hip dislocation or subluxation. They are commonly associated with sudden, twisting maneuvers that cause immediate pain in the hip.

    In general, the treatment of a hip labral tear usually starts off with some simple steps. Typical early treatments of a hip labral tear include:

    Rest
    The torn labrum in the hip can cause inflammation around the joint. Allowing the inflammation to settle down may alleviate the symptoms of the labral tear and allow return to activities.

    Anti-Inflammatory Medications
    Anti-inflammatory medications can be helpful in diminishing some of the inflammation in the joint. If the inflammation subsides, the symptoms may resolve.

    Physical Therapy
    Physical therapists can use various techniques to improve hip function by strengthening and balancing the muscles around the hip joint.

    Cortisone Injection
    A cortisone injection is useful not only as a treatment of the labral tear, but it can also be performed at the same time as a diagnostic injection the help determine the cause of the hip pain.

    If these treatments fail to alleviate the pain associated with a hip labral tear, a hip arthroscopy procedure may be considered. During a hip arthroscopy, your surgeon places a small camera into the hip joint to see the labral tear. Your surgeon can also evaluate the cartilage of the joint, important ligaments, and other structures.

    Treatment of the labral tear usually consists of shaving out the torn portion of the labrum. In some larger tears, located in an accessible area of the joint, a repair of the labrum may be attempted. Recovery from a hip arthroscopy depends on the extent of work that needs to be completed, but usually lasts 6 to 12 weeks.

    Are there downsides to hip arthroscopy?
    Hip arthroscopy has become very popular recently, but surgeons are just getting to know this procedure and constantly refining their techniques. While the incisions are small, there are potential complications of this procedure that should be considered before treating a labral tear surgically. Hip arthroscopy is relatively new to most surgeons, and while early results have shown this can be a successful treatment, it is still being developed.

    Jonathan Cluett, MD, is a board certified orthopedic surgeon in Massachusetts. His subspecialty interests are in the areas of sports medicine and arthroscopy.

  50. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Potential means little if not manifested. We know what a healthy Baldwin brings, or a healthy Tate and Rice. We really don’t know yet what Harvin brings.
    Could be that he disrupts the chemistry on this team. Could be that he helps take us to a higher level. Time will tell.

  51. With the Group of guys that are hurt to start it’s best to keep them off the field till they are really ready to go, still hate late surgeries but it is what it is.
    It will allow some of the young guys to get more reps and be more involved than they might have been and make the competition better in the long run.
    Scrugs injury is bad deal for him, he has a lot to loose with all of the new D liners coming in.

  52. doubledink says:

    hawkfaninoklahoma,

    you forgot to include HGH. :)

    Does anyone else on the roster have KO return experience? The ball travels in the air differently than when punted, so that is a different skill to catch.

  53. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    thurmond has KR experience

  54. Dukeshire says:

    Well, we do know what Harvin brings after his 4 years in Minnesota (and remember, Bevell worked with him for 2 of those). But I’ll agree that we can’t say with certainty how he’d fit in here.

    I do get a kick however out of so many here now contradicting their views on what they believed Harvin would bring to this offense, up until this morning. It’s a long season everyone, and there will surely be more injuries to deal with along the way. Let’s not get too carried away in any direction just yet.

  55. SignalCaller03 says:

    Agree with Duke. A superbowl appearance requires good talent, good coaching, and good luck. Anytime you lose a dynamic player of Harvin’s talent, those chances take a hit. Though not insurmountable, a huge blow to the season, 1 freakin practice into it.

  56. SignalCaller03 says:

    Guess that’s not agreeing with Duke totally. It is a long season, but the way this was handled on the first day of practice, just smells funny.

  57. freedom_X says:

    If this injury had to happen, I prefer that it be early in preseason. The odds are better the player can come back, and if not, the team has more time to compensate or patch the gap.

    The worst time is when the injuries happen at the end of preseason (remember the past O-line and WR debacles – lost Michael Bennett and gave up a 5th for the immortal Keary Colbert because of desperation.) I think the waiver wire pickings are better in mid-season.

  58. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I have always been a huge Baldwin fan. Nice to have the Harvin dynamic going on here, however Baldwin will do just fine in my book.

  59. chuck_easton says:

    Next man up!

    Come on Baldwin!

  60. Dukeshire says:

    Understand, I’m not a “Harvin or else” guy. lol. I’m just saying that losing (potentially, hopefully not) that kind of talent does not make a team better. It’s a bummer, but as I have said, they are loaded, it’s not the end of the world.

  61. GeorgiaHawk says:

    To be honest if I had to pick between the two it would be Baldwin. Not that I don’t like Harvin, he has potential talents. However Baldwin has the Wilson factor. Smart, great work ethic, good athlete. great role model.
    Why did we even trade for Harvin?

  62. doubledink says:

    We traded for Harvin because he is arguably the most dynamic playmaker in the league. This impact is very serious, although I am not panicking, neither am I dismissing this. A couple of fumbled kickoffs and/or <10 yard return average can have a huge impact on this team.

  63. doubledink says:

    and to think we didn’t get squat for Leon Washington…

  64. Southendzone says:

    This doesn’t mean shit for this season. I never felt we needed Harvin or his 60M contract in the first place.

    This injury no matter how serious won’t translate to wins and losses in 2013. It will be future years when they gave up 1st and 3rd for nothing and have cap taken up by his contract.

    This trade was called by nearly everyone a high risk/reward. Hawks took a gamble and this is what we got. I can live with it.

  65. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    for the sake of argument let’s say he is done this year but comes back

    100% in december and completely dominates thru play offs. i can live

    with that

  66. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    wow two thoughts got mixed up sorry guys

  67. wabubba67 says:

    doubledink–Leon Washington no longer has much value with the new rules regarding kickoffs (specifically the placement of the ball before the kick). He is an undersized RB, who is not durable enough to be on every down and has trouble blocking/catching. RBs with that skill set are nearly a dime a dozen.

    Donovan McNabb (who I dislike a bit) on the Harvin injury on NBC radio, “I played with Harvin…if anything is wrong, he’ll have surgery (chuckles knowingly).”

    Not sure what the laugh meant. Was it that Harvin is particular about the long-term health of his career, or that he is constantly looking to be on the sidelines (migraines in MN)?

  68. Leon set a franchise record for return yards last season I believe.

    Our offense will be fine as long as the WR’s we have stay healthy!! ST’s is another issue. I don’t like the lack of experience we have there. There is a reason that Tate has not been returning punts. Talk about risk/reward – hopefully his maturity on the offense will translate to the return game. Too many times the ball was bouncing through his hands or making an ill advised NON fair catch. He has been given chances to get on the field in that position in the past and could not earn it.

    Baldwin >= Harvin ?!?!? really, not even the FO believes that or they wouldn’t have traded for him and paid him.

  69. chuck_easton says:

    Wabu,

    The knowing laugh is what Vikings fans were saying as well. Great player, but will take himself out of a game due to a hangnail.

    Harvin isn’t the type to play through pain let alone to play with an injury. He will have the surgery before he plays with a injury even if there is little chance of aggrivating the problem.

  70. GeorgiaHawk says:

    “Baldwin >= Harvin ?!?!? really, not even the FO believes that or they wouldn’t have traded for him and paid him.”

    The FO has done very well, however they are not always right. (See Whitehurst and Flynn.)

  71. GeorgiaHawk says:

    To be honest my first impression of Harvin was a very talented injury prone malcontent. Someone that would throw their qb, (see Ponder) under the bus for his own personal gain.

    I hope I am totally wrong about this talented dude.

  72. Why in the world didn’t seattle do a full body MRI on this injury prone guy prior to the trade? Not a great way to start the very first day of practice especially if this could
    have been avoided. :-(

  73. Southendzone says:

    Here are all the offensive players i would be MORE concerned about if I heard they had a potential season ending injury:

    Wilson
    Okung
    Unger
    Lynch
    Miller

    maybe even M. Robinson because I think he helps the run game tick. Soooo, little to no concern here. It will just be fun watching the national media freak out over this.

  74. To be honest if I had to pick between the two it would be Baldwin. Not that I don’t like Harvin, he has potential talents. However Baldwin has the Wilson factor. Smart, great work ethic, good athlete. great role model.
    Why did we even trade for Harvin?

    A little different tone than when we made the trade:

    It is great though to finally have a true #1 WR for Wilson and further fortify what is now the strength of this team. More weapons for Wilson is a good thing.

  75. HeinieHunter says:

    This BS about a Super Bowl contender is way over the top. Are we a good team? Yes, but we don’t know where our pass rush is coming from, and last year Atlanta exposed how bad it really was. We are counting on guys who were hurt last year to come storming back this year. Carp, Clemmons, and now Harvin is lame. I think we’ll make the playoffs but to get to the Super Bowl we will need the home field advantage in the playoffs. That will not be easy. Carolina away, SF here. Starting 0-2 is not likely but not out of the question. “One game at a time” please. Okay , now bust my chops.

  76. bbnate420 says:

    Good lord, the precipitous fall from surefire SB winners to the season being over before it even starts came before even I envisioned. And that’s saying something considering the bipolar nature of this blog. I guess Harvin is Deion Branch before even missing one game. Just step back from the ledge until we actually know what’s going on.

    A lot of Harvin’s reputation amongst Vikings fans for being soft came from missing games due to migraine headaches IMO. Anyone that has ever had a serious migraine headache would tell you that it’s BS to question him for that. I’d bet every dime I have that none of the armchair whiners complaining about that would play with a serious migraine.

    BTW, Chuck, they actually have approx. 6 weeks from the start of week 7 to activate Harvin.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physically_Unable_to_Perform

  77. chuck_easton says:

    Thanks for the clarification on that bbnate.

  78. “,,,here’s my number, so call me maybe,,”

    We were warned, so there’s that. In any case someone wanted a second opinion meaning there was a first someone did not like. It appears Harvin got the news that the team thought he could rest and play and Harvin wanted the second opinion. Then a former significant player scoffs that Harvin will want the surgery.

    Our FO is aggressive and we thank them for it most of the time but it’s not their fault if a player wants to respect their body when history tells us the NFL and many fans really do not. If they are guilty of anything it is the “little big man” complex hooked on to their own statures. Something makes me think the two of them watch the Ghostbusters and rejoice with fists in the air when the “little guy” nails Dana on the rooftop.

  79. bbnate420 says:

    I guess everybody has already forgot that Baldwin was injured most of last year?

  80. Bad news on Harvin. We will be fine without him, but you dont trade away a first round pick and pay a guy $11 million a year to get hurt for half the year before he takes one snap in Training Camp. Sad.

    The fact is, Harvin has yet to make it through an entire season, for various reasons. Yes, much of that was migraines, but with him its always something.Thats the risk you take signing a little guy to a big-money contract. It doesnt always work out.

    Yes, Baldwin was hurt with multiple injuries last year and never really got going/on track. And we all bitched about it; its not his toughness we question, but his durability. But Baldwin wasnt drafted, and doesnt cost much; Harvin cost a lot–we could have had a shot at Cordarrelle Patterson–both in draft picks and cap space, so its a bigger deal to lose him. Plus, Harvin is a far better player at this point–and undoubtedly a far greater athlete–than Baldwin.

    But we still dont know if/how long Harvin will be out. It is likely that even if he escapes surgery until after the season, it will affect his play negatively.

    Wow, not much luck in Seattle since the Atl game: Clemons hurt, Scruggs hurt, McCoy hurt, Harvin hurt, Avril hurting, Bennett hurting, Irvin suspended…ah, welcome to a Seahawks fans world…par for the course I suppose…

  81. Questioning Harvins toughness is off-base, IMO. This is a guy who practices despite debilitating migraines so bad he puked onfield. He’s certainly tough. But durable?! Nah, not so far. And thats just as big, if not even bigger, than a lack of toughness, because you cant teach durability, but you can teach toughness.

  82. bbnate420 says:

    Injuries happen in football. Not sure we had anymore than usual this off-season. We as Hawks fans are just consumed by the ones on our team. I doubt the Whiners are crying for us.

  83. Just looking at last regular season, in 16 games, LW played 73 snaps on SEA’s offense (that’s a little under twice as many plays as Matt Flynn played – not many). Of those 73, LW carried the ball 25 times, went out for a pass (or threw the ball) 30 times, run-blocked 7 times, and pass-blocked 11 times. LW also returned 27 KOs (avg 29 yds, 1 went for 98 yds and a TD) and 41 punts (8.7 yd avg return, no TDs). Other returners for SEA: Obo returned a KO for no yds, Baldwin returned a KO for 3 yds, Tate fair caught a punt, and Brandon Browner lost a yard on a PR.

    Meanwhile in ’12, in 9 games, PH played 427 snaps on MIN’s offense. Of those, PH ran with the ball 22 times, went out for a pass (or threw the ball) 279 times, run-blocked 125 times, and pass-blocked once. PH also returned 16 KOs (avg 35.9 yds, 1 went for 105 yds and a TD) and 0 punt returns. (Per Eric, the missed games came from a high ankle sprain, not migraines). There were 27 other MIN KRs that PH didn’t do. MIN’s Marcus Sherels took over both KR and PR duties, so they could kinda afford to lose PH. MIN’s KR avg dropped from 35.9 to 26.4.

    In ’11, in 16 games, PH played 623 snaps on MIN’s offense. Of those, PH ran with the ball 52 times, went out for a pass (or threw the ball) 402 times, run-blocked 166 times, and pass-blocked 3 times. PH also returned 16 KOs (avg 32.5 yds, 1 went for 104 yds and a TD) and 0 punt returns.

    In ’10, in 14 games, PH played 650 snaps on MIN’s offense. Of those, PH ran with the ball 18 times, went out for a pass (or threw the ball) 389 times, run-blocked 243 times, and never pass-blocked. PH also returned 40 KOs (avg 23.3 yds, 1 went for 95 yds and a TD) and 0 punt returns.

    In ’09, in 16 games, PH played 521 snaps on MIN’s offense. Of those, PH ran with the ball 15 times, went out for a pass (or threw the ball) 358 times, run-blocked 148 times, and never pass-blocked. PH also returned 42 KOs (avg 27.5 yds, 1 went for 101 yds, with 2 kick return TDs) and no punt returns.

    Not just that PH is better than LW for this offense, but that I think PC could have expected PH to play both the slot (and outside) WR near every down, plus handle every KO. The labrum “tear” musta come outta the blue. Sure hope it can be handled like M.Bennet’s(?)

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