Seahawks Insider

Morning links: More on Sherman softball game

Post by Eric Williams on July 8, 2013 at 7:54 am with 104 Comments »
July 8, 2013 7:54 am
Seattle Supersonics legend Shawn Kemp signaled his pleasure, in classic "Rain Man," form after hitting one out during the  home run derby competition during the Richard Sherman Celebrity Softball Game Sunday July 7 , 2013 at Cheney Stadium in Tacoma. Dean J. Koepfler / Staff Photo
Seattle Supersonics legend Shawn Kemp signaled his pleasure, in classic “Rain Man,” form after hitting one out during the home run derby competition during the Richard Sherman Celebrity Softball Game Sunday July 7 , 2013 at Cheney Stadium in Tacoma.
Dean J. Koepfler / Staff Photo

Here’s my story that ran in today’s paper from Richard Sherman’s celebrity softball game.

Seahawks safety Kam Chancellor had this to say about roughly 7,000 fan packing into Cheney Stadium for the event.

“The fans can’t wait for football to start,” Seahawks safety Kam Chancellor said. “We can’t wait for training camp to start. We’re ready to get out there and compete with our teammates, and see what they’ve been working on this whole offseason, and to see if they’re ready to compete for a championship this year.
“And I know the fans are ready to see it.”

Check out a photo gallery from the event here.

KCPQ-13 has video from the event here.

Rob Rang of provides the lowdown on the six players available in this year’s supplemental draft, which will be held on Thursday. One player to watch for is UNLV defensive end James Boyd. The LA native was recruited to USC by Pete Carroll in 2009, where he played quarterback, tight end and defensive end before transferring to West Los Angeles Community College in 2011. At 6-5 and 255 pounds, Boyd could add depth at defensive line.

Mike Freeman of CBS Sports provides training camp story lines for every NFL team. Here’s what Freeman has to say about Seattle. “Adderall issues aside, the Seahawks will be the trendy pick to win the Super Bowl. It’s easy to understand why.”

Rebecca Wright of the Windsor Star reports that Seahawks rookie tight end Luke Willson returned home to sign autographs at the place he got his start.

Len Pasquarelli writing for the National Football Post has a good roundup of NFL News in this week’s Sunday Blitz.

Danny O’Neil of 710 ESPN Seattle takes a closer look at the Seahawks defensive line.

Morning links
Leave a comment Comments → 104
  1. yankinta says:

    It makes me smh,, that some of our own Seahawks Fans are ashamed to have won that game on that last call. They don’t even know the NFL rule book,, they just listen to the talking heads on TV and think we won it unfairly,,, smh,, I guess there are a ton of uneducated fans for every team and we have some too,,,

    Read more here:

  2. raymaines says:

    Len Pasquarelli reminds us that Andrew Luck and the Colts had a -30 point differential last year but still made the playoffs. That means they squeaked by in the games they won and got blasted when they lost. This year they have a more difficult schedule (they play the NFC West, Denver, and Cincinnati) and I don’t think they’ll be in the playoffs again this year. Like, as if any of us really care about the AFC South.

    Another thing about the “Fail Mary” thing. The replay official in the booth was a regular, honest-to-God, NFL official and he thought at the time (and presumably still does) that it was a good call. GB fans can go suck a cheese stick.

  3. yankinta says:

    raymaines, Colts had the easiest schedule last year. This year they have a 4th easiest schedule (Even if they’re playing NFC West). The HYPE for Luck will die and all these so called experts will have to agree with ME. lol,, that Andrew Luck is just average QB, Top 20 QB. He’s not a Top 10 and will never be Top 10 QB.

  4. jawpeace says:

    I have read several articles saying the Hawks are mocking GB fans with having Easley. LOL that is pathetic. Sherman did a real good thing with the fund raiser and a offered some love to a man who got so much wrong hate from the world. And they focus on that instead of the youth and vets that he helped. I am with Raymaines go suck a cheese stick!

  5. FleaFlicker says:

    Richard Sherman’s degree in Communications certainly isn’t going to waste. The man has a gift for working the media. The Fail Mary ref? Selling out Cheney for a charity fundraiser? Recruiting cross-sport athletes? Getting RW to coach the opposing squad? All of it, simply brilliant.

    Only a few more weeks before we have real football to discuss….

  6. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Rain Man still looks intimidating. Imagine someone his size talent, (in his prime) becoming a lock down CB? I don’t know if WRs would even get three yards past the line of scrimmage. And imagine how many blocked kicks there would be. Lol.

  7. Yankinta – you are wrong, by NFL Rules – it was NOT a catch

    Here is Rule 8, Section 1, Article 3, Item 5.

    Item 5: Simultaneous Catch. If a pass is caught simultaneously by two eligible opponents, and both players retain it, the ball belongs to the passers. It is not a simultaneous catch if a player gains control first and an opponent subsequently gains joint control. If the ball is muffed after simultaneous touching by two such players, all the players of the passing team become eligible to catch the loose ball.


    The important question now becomes what defines control. The following example in the casebook shows that control can be achieved while IN THE AIR and not on the ground as Yankinta and the replacement Ref incorrectly believes:

    A.R. 8.29: First-and-10 on A20. B3 controls a pass in the air at the A40 before A2, who then also controls the ball before they land. As they land, A2 and B3 fall down to the ground.

    Ruling: B’s ball, first-and-10 on A40. Not a simultaneous catch as B3 gains control first and retains control.


    In this case, B3 is Jennings of Green Bay and A2 is Golden Tate. The end result is Jennings Ball.

    But this Ref did not know the rules and neither did Phil Luckett at the Vinnie Testaverde helmet game I attended back in 1998 so it’s all good.

  8. pabs–Once one of the players had both feet and/or a limb on the ground, WITH possession of the ball, it was instantly over. However, the Ref could not see who had the ball as they were falling. Tate came down with it once they were on the ground, and appeared to have possession just before getting both feet down.

    Also, there was a still shot going the rounds from behind the end zone that clearly showed Tate with two feet down and majority control of the ball, and the defender with only one foot down and less control. This shot totally reversed my own view, which was I could see how the ref called it TD but in my heart it was a Pick. Now I see it Tate’s way.

    The ref saw it as a Tie and/or Tate’s when two feet went down. That means anyway you slice it, it was Tate’s ball as tie goes to offense.

    The defender had control in the air, and the ref decided Tate took it from him for at least co-control and had at least co-control when he planted two feet (and he had two feet down before the defender) on the ground and therefore had possession. Also, Tate ended up with it. TD.

    I couldnt believe the outrage over an early season game from the rest of the US. Disgusting. There was less outrage over the thrown SB, where the Stealers never were called for offensive holding and at least 5 major calls were blown, all of them game-changing, with only one going Seattle’s way (Stevens really did fumble).

    As you say, we were robbed by the Testaverde no-TD TD, and before that we lost the playoffs due to being robbed of a last-second John L Williams 4th down TD vs Raiders. Markbreit stole that one from us-seems that weasel always officiated Raiders/Hawks games, and always made at least one huge pro-Raider blown call.

    GB fans can whine all they want–it doesnt change anything. And we’ll beat them next time by a wider margin, and they will still whine…

  9. Victor Cruz just signed an extension with the Giants for about 8 million a year (counting his already guaranteed 2.9 mill this year). Thats what we’ve been paying Rice.

    Yeah, Cruz drops passes and is a slot WR not a FL, but he’s certainly more dynamic than Rice.

    Good deal for the Giants, and Cruz isnt exactly poor. I thought he’d get a good bit more, but it works.

  10. I don’t see where either of you two have cited how the Approved Ruling I quoted from the casebook doesn’t apply here. That Approved Ruling is exactly this play. Scott should have quoted the Approved Ruling before giving his “education.”

    I imagine they structured the meaning of “control” the way they did to eliminate situations where the ball is thrown up as high as possible, a defender catches it while in the air and an offensive player simply puts his hands on the ball for a cheapo catch as they land. And it makes perfect sense.

    I was also at the Ravens free timeout game in 2003 so I know all about mis-interpretation of the rules, which is exactly what happened here.

  11. yankinta says:

    lol, a cheapo catch? Is that in the rule book or is that your own opinion, cuz your opinion doesn’t count.

    Cheapo catches are legitimate catches as stated in the article,,, Go re-read that part that starst with, “In the 2010 AFC Divisional playoffs, Antonio Brown had a huge catch on a 3rd and 19 late in the game. He never got two hands on the ball, as you can see in the picture……..”

  12. GeorgiaHawk says:

    or someone else who will educate me. Why does Danny O’Neil say that Scruggs is not expected to play this year? Does that mean there is a possible chance that he will? I thought he was put on IR with no hope to play this year. Maybe I’m wrong and they will put him on PUP.

  13. yankinta says:

    And to point out more flaws in your argument, IF Tate simply puts his hands on the ball after Jenning caught it, why was Jenning (who is a LOT BIGGER) unable to pull it away from Tate, 5 feet 8, 180 lbs,, at any point of the play, even after the whistle was blown????

  14. GeorgiaHawk says:

    It looked to me like Tate had more than just one hand around the ball when he landed before Jennings had landed.
    It’s just that 99% of the time the main stream media chooses to show the front view that shows Tate with one hand on it and Jennings with two hands on the ball, however you can’t tell that Jennings has his feet down from that view, which can fool the masses and the *^$&@sses.

    I will view it again after a few beers this evening to get a more Beerational opinion.

  15. So what exactly is your contention with the Approved Ruling I quoted? That Approved Ruling is part of the rule book and it takes into account this exact play. It seems fairly straightforward.

    And to address 2 of your other points –
    1). Tate is 5’10 and 202 pounds and a fantastic athlete. Jennings is 6’0 195 so that’s not “a lot bigger.”
    2). You don’t need 2 hands on the ball to establish possession. One hand is perfectly fine for control. But I have no idea how that Antonio Brown play is related to this play.

  16. Georgia – Jennings established control first (while in the air). Tate would have had to have taken the ball away from him before they hit the ground for Tate to have legally caught the ball. Putting both hands on the ball while in the air and not separating the ball from Jennings still results in the catch for Jennings.

  17. pabs–your quote doesnt prove Tate was not in at least shared possession at the instant the first of them got TWO FEET and/or a limb down in the endzone. Most would agree it was picked in the air, but that its arguable if one or both of them had sole possession or they had joint possession when the feet hit.

    As I said, the pic from behind the end zone clearly shows Tate with two feet down and the defender with one, and Tate having control of the ball. Now, its possible this was only a split second, and the defender had possession rather than Tate just after this, but it was enough to convince me that the call was correct.

    Watching the whole play from slow-motion cameras, its a tough, tough call and I had originally called it in GB’s favor, but who knows what those ref’s saw; the camera angles we saw arent what they saw.

    The replay official saw nothing conclusive to overturn the call.

    Tough Titty for GB.

  18. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    lol, guys who cares?

  19. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Pabs- Yes Jennings established Two handed control in the air first, however Tate established one handed control first.
    Not an easy call to make no matter how you look at it. Grey call.

  20. Ok Pabs, read the example one more time. The Ref must have believed Tate gained sole control of the ball before they hit the ground, and once they hit, Tate retained sole control. Again, the pic from behind the end zone backs this up.

    Its still a play that was a tough call, and I’d a been pissed if I were GB too. Except the only TD they got in that game was because the refs kept the drive going on third down by calling a bogus PI penalty. So without bad officiating going their way, they wouldnt have been in position to get ‘robbed’ by the Fail Mary in the first place, becuase they would have lost…

  21. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Can/will anyone answer me if Scruggs has any chance of playing this year?

  22. yankinta says:

    lol GeoriaHawk, No, they will play it safe and Keep Scruggs on IR because his type of injuries are difficult to come back from and they want him to be 100% next year….that’s my understanding.

    pabuwal, Tate touched/caught the ball first before Jennings Did. Dude, did you even read the article or you’re just being ignorant??

  23. SandpointHawk says:

    Not that it matters but…

    “In summary, Tate made a one handed catch by stopping the descent of the ball with his left hand; his left hand remains in contact with the ball through the catch. 1/60th of a second later, Jennings started a move to wrest the ball away from Tate before Tate could hit the ground, but he never pulls it out of Tate’s left hand. Tate had two hands on the ball and two feet on the ground before Jennings had established contact with the ground (even though only one hand is required for a catch). Tate had already made the catch/completion (controlling the ball, two feet inbounds, and a football move) at the moment that Jennings established two feet, but before Jennings had completed the catch. Well after Tate had completed the three acts necessary for it to be ruled a catch, and after a touchdown had occurred, Jennings wrested the ball away.”

  24. Georgia – Scruggs had ACL surgery on his right knee in May, but the does not list the team ever putting him on IR. If that’s true, they could put him on PUP list and move him to the active roster after game six. I have a hard time seeing how they would need him though, unless Bennett or Avril or Irvin get injured.

  25. Stevos–With our anemic pass rush, you simply cant have too many weapons. Look for Seattle to hold out hope as long as possible that Scruggs can come back this year, but I think the odds are stacked against him unless he’s related to Adrian Petersen somehow…

  26. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Thanks Stevos,
    I wasn’t sure if they had placed him on IR yet. I don’t want them to rush him back, (like Yankita says they don’t want to do) however I thought he was playing really well at the end of last year and maybe, hopefully we could see him back sometime later this year.

  27. yankinta – you sound like those Steeler fans that think the officiating was fine in XL. Why can’t fans just accept they benefited off a bad call and move on?

    STTBM – most fans and Easley (as well as that article yankinta keeps citing) seem to think that the player who got both feet on the ground first dictates who gets possession in the case of “Simultaneous Catch.” Both players have to control the ball as they reach the ground but who hits the ground first is irrelevant.

    I can see how Easley did not have every single rule AND Approved Ruling memorized for that game. It’s impossible. But he’s still insisting he was right.

  28. raymaines says:

    So who needs Rob Rang or even a scouting department? I found our right tackle for the next decade and all he costs is money.

    Greg Scruggs has not yet been put on either the PUP or IR list so it’s still possible he could play this year. It’s also possible the sun could rise in the west tomorrow morning and I could win the lottery later today.

  29. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Do you think the great Hasselbeck will help Lucks development?

  30. yankinta says:

    pabuwal, lol that’s what you sound like,,, you’re stating opinions, that article states facts,,, you have no arguments against any of these facts…..still stating opinion. No one care about your opinion or my opinion, cuz Opinions don’t count. :)

  31. Yankster–The Shame On link was awesome. Still, it didnt have the awesome still shot I was talking about in an earlier comment. That shot, which was all over facebook, was conclusive that Tate had control and possession with two feets down with the DB still airborn…

  32. Pabs–Who hits the ground first is not irrelevant. Tate had one good hand on the ball first, and controlled the ball all the way to the ground and on the ground, with that hand. Also, he gained control of the ball with two hands–at least simultaneous possession–by the time his feet hit the ground, while the DB was still airborne. The instant a player has possession of the ball with two feet or any other part of the body other than the hand in the endzone, its a TD.

    So the feet touching WITH possession is hardly irrelevant.

  33. Because Tate had control of the ball the entire time, he didnt even have to have sole possession when his feet hit for it to be a TD–even simultaneous possession would have resulted in a TD the instant Tate’s feet hit the ground, as simultaneous possession goes to the offense.

  34. It actually is irrelevant in the case of simultaneous catch. That Approved Ruling is pretty clear here.

    Georgia – Hasselbeck can point out things that Luck might be missing during the games, but I think having a fully healthy Ahmad Bradshaw and not having to throw the ball 40 times a game will help more.

  35. And yeah, the worst of it is the Chancellor PI was totally bogus, and kept the drive going on GB’s only TD of the game. They never would have been in the game at the end without bogus help from the ref’s.

  36. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Interesting read raymaines,
    I hear he played for the Sea Wolves. Sounds close enough to the Seahawks, however I would rather have a certain RG that plays in Pittsburgh now.

  37. The best part about the Replacement Refs is they made so many bad calls they were able to even out in the same game. Anyone remember that silly Roughing the Passer Call on Green Bay when Wilson threw an INT on the second to last drive deep in Seattle territory?

    The Cardinals game earlier in the year had a bunch of calls like that in the 4th quarter as well for both teams.

  38. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Agree Pabs.

    Just wish Hass was back here helping Wilson instead.

  39. I think Moon is giving Wilson plenty of help and it’s worked out well so far. Wilson has reached out to McNabb as well. He’s smart enough to take the best advice everyone has to offer and make it even better when he puts it into play.

  40. GeorgiaHawk says:

    As bad as the replacement refs were, I would trade for them in a heart beat to be the refs in the 2005 Super Bowl.

  41. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I hope Moon isn’t giving Wilson driving lessons, and I hope McNabb isn’t giving Wilson eating lessons.
    Chunky soup was the beginning of both McNabb’s and Hasselbecks decline in their careers imo. Lol.

  42. pabuwal says:

    I only wish the Seahawks could have overcome Leavy like the Giants did 2 years ago during the Divisional Playoff round in Green Bay (against a 15-1 team no less). And Leavy screwed the Giants just as hard in that game as he did the Seahawks.

  43. RDPoulsbo says:

    Are you guys arguing over a play that’s been decided 9 months ago? Seriously?

  44. raymaines says:

    All of that silliness happened in the third week of the season and if Packer fans are still cranky about their seeding in the playoffs they could also whine about allowing an epic comeback and losing a close game to the Colts two weeks later, getting blasted by the NYG’s week 10, and letting AP run all over them the last game of the season.

    And the second seed that they coveted was occupied by the same 49ers that beat the pudding out of them week 1 and beat them again in the playoffs by 14 points. In other words, the GB season went about as well as a person could reasonably expect and it’s time to quit looking back and start looking forward to next year.

    Speaking of next year: Training Camp starts in about 16 days, 20 hours, and 41 minutes.

  45. Pabs–Agreed.

    RDPoulsbo–What else is there to discuss?! Ideas?!

    And its not an argument unless someone gets humpty about it. Im not humpty….

  46. pabuwal says:

    Its July 8 and the only football news out there is Kaepernick wearing the wrong hat. And the topic is related to the thread.

  47. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Half seriously on my part. However give us some other topics to talk about RDPoulsbo.
    It’s the offseason. Would you be happy if this blog just shuts down until training camp?

  48. GeorgiaHawk says:

    BTW- I love chunky soup! That $hits bad for you though.

  49. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I bet nate loves chunky soup too.

  50. “Stevos–With our anemic pass rush, you simply cant have too many weapons.”

    Slave – Yeah man, I agree. But I truly think that “anemic pass rush” will soon become a thing of the past in Seattle.

    Avril, Bennett, Bruce Irvin in year two, LBs who are growing up and can be trusted to mind their gaps, and a more agressive DC in Dan Quinn… all this adds up to a pass rush better than we’ve seen before. And I liked Gregg Scruggs, but I don’t think he can make this roster or help this team if these other guys are healthy.

  51. Stevos–Im hoping. Irvin getting suspended and Avril having a boo-boo was not the offseason I was hoping for though. Scruggs will have a tough time making the roster, but injuries do happen, and remember, Bennett has an injury he will play through, and Avril has had nagging injuries as well. Seattle will try to rotate guys to keep them healthy and fresh, but the more talented players the merrier.

    If we cut Scruggs, Im pretty sure someone like JAX or the Raiders will scoop him up.

  52. I think Korey Toomer is going to surprise a lot of people this preseason. Dude’s very athletic.

    Hell, even Bradford and a couple other young LB’s I think are good enough to start for a bunch of teams in this league, and they may not even make the team.

  53. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Abraham, Martin and John.

    Written by Dick Holler.

    Song by Dion.

    “Has anybody here seen my old friend ACID”
    “Can you tell me where he’s gone?”
    “He was right about Curry being a huge bust on this blog.”
    “But with Wilson he was wrong.”
    “You know, we just looked around and he’s gone.”

    “Anybody here seen my old friend RadeOn?”
    “Can you tell me where he’s gone?”
    “He pissed a lot of folks off,”
    “when he said Wilson sucks.”
    ” Now we look around and he’s gone.”

    “Anybody here seen my old friend BobbyK?
    “Can you tell me where he’s gone?”
    “I thought I saw him throwing up over the hill”
    “When Jackson came back to town”.

  54. SandpointHawk says:

    Dude give it a rest.

    RadeOn came on the blog and ate big time crow..several times….

    BobbyK has stated for the record TJack is a fine back-up.

    That said, I would never defend ACID

    However your baiting needs more work for both of the other two old timers…

  55. bbnate420 says:

    Good lord.

    Yankinta, even though I basically agree with your overall position, you still are confused about the difference between a fact and an opinion. And you don’t help your position when you get facts like Tate’s height and weight wrong or intentionally try to distort them to support your position. That article comes down to opinion ultimately. He does support his argument, but it’s not 2 plus 2 equals 4. You could argue that everything is an opinion as everything is mediated by our senses, but that is an epistemological argument.

    Look, this play was a judgement call. You said it yourself pabuwal, it comes down to how control is defined. There is no absolute right either way here. Why can’t people just deal with it and let it go? This certainly wasn’t as cut and dry or egregious as either the Testaverde or Roethlisberger phantom TDs IMO. Especially the Roethlisberger one since they had replay!

    The Hawks could whine about being robbed of a game and playoff position in 2012 as well. That horrible roughing the passer call on ET versus the Dolphins certainly played a large role in the Dolphins winning the game. The Hawks would’ve been the #2 seed had they won another game. I think having the Divisional Round at home would’ve certainly helped.

    Georgia, I don’t like chunky soup actually. I like the chunky ladies. ;-)

    jawpeace, suck a cheese stick indeed. LOL.

  56. Georgia – slow offseason, eh? lol…

    STTBM – Im rooting for Toomer too. I liked him at Idaho, and guessed right that Carroll would draft him, but then he looked pretty lost when I watched him in Seahawks camp last year. We need his speed and length on the outside. He’s another reason our pass rush could be the bomb.

  57. Okay you guys, enough arguing about Golden Tater Tot’s catch/non-catch in the Green Bay game.

    I’m wiping that game off the books and scheduling a replacement game. We’ll schedule it August 23rd at Lambeau. Winner gets bragging rights. Case closed.

  58. bbnate420 says:

    STTBM, curious as to how Cruz is “certainly more dynamic than Rice.”? Rice averaged 2.3 yards more a catch than Cruz last year. He averaged a TD on 8.75 % of his targets in 2012. Cruz averaged a TD on 7 % of his targets in 2012. Both Rice and Cruz average a TD on 7 % of their targets for their career. Rice averages 14.7 yards a catch for his career. Cruz averages 15.6. And Rice has played 73 career games to Cruz’s 32. Maybe not dynamic though certainly important, Rice averages a first down on 43 % of his targets to Cruz’s 40.5 %. I think you’re undervaluing Rice again. Though this Rice discussion is in danger of becoming more tired than the Tate catch.

  59. Dukeshire says:

    It’s not in danger of becoming, it’s has been, for some time.

  60. When we originally signed Jackson – I thought he sucked and wouldn’t ever even make a good back-up. For this team – he is a fine back-up. Granted, I’d rather have signed Matt back but there are far worse options out there to back-up Wilson. I’ll take Jackson backing up Wilson any day over Quinn or some of the other options available. Still doesn’t mean I’m a big fan – but the team could definitely have done worse.

  61. bbnate420 says:

    Duke, to be fair at least it’s comparing Rice to Cruz instead of Tate this time.

    BobbyK, what’s going on? You’re not going to defend your boy Rice?

  62. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Anything to drag you back in. Lol. Minus the Jackson thing, you have a great insight to this blog.
    My girlfriend is hitting me right now gotta go.

  63. montanamike2 says:

    I think we spanked them (GB) and an amazingly bad call reversed the game when we had some real momentum and were near the endzone, until that bad call on Kam. In my mind that call there was the real game changer, i don’t feel bad for the win and that was an amazing play. To put all the GB naysayers to rest we need to keep kicking their arse until it shall never be in doubt whom the better team is.

  64. GeorgiaHawk says:

    montanamike2, Agree!!!

    After further review ,(after four beers) the play on the field stands. TD Tate!!!

  65. raymaines says:

    There have been times in the past I’ve felt like this:

    But things seem to be all sunshine and rainbows now. Hang in there Browns fans.

  66. GeorgiaHawk says:

    SandpointHawk- Give it a rest, I actually like,(overall) what BobbyK brings to this blog.
    The others are just entertainment to me. Church was yesterday.

  67. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Let’s see some team try and shut him down!

  68. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Wrong post!

    I tried to post Earl Thomas, however no such luck.

  69. nate – My opinion hasn’t changed one bit since I wrote this about Sid Rice. I know he’s a number one and one of the best. Others know he’s not. They aren’t going to change my mind and I’m not going to change theirs.

  70. bbnate420 says:

    Georgia, you could give RADEoN a break. He did eat crow many times. He and I went at each other pretty viciously. We squashed it. I know he committed the mortal sin of doubting Touchdown Jesus.

    BTW, have you accepted Russell Wilson as your personal lord and savior?

  71. sluggo42 says:


    I go golfing for a day, and all of this… Seriously.

    But one heck of a read! Thanks!

  72. edstang45 says:

    People still snivlin about the win over GB….sheesh…I though cheese heads were only ones left whinning. Great piece about SoftBall game, dang if Kemp is lookin that old I must be a sight, thankfully I broke all mirrors years ago. Can’t wait for Camp to start Go Hawks

  73. bbnate420 says:

    BobbyK, I don’t know. I bet STTBM comes in here and recants his Cruz/Rice post. ;-)

  74. madpunter88 says:

    I am so annoyed that the last several threads on this charity softball game here and on PFT have been hijacked by fools still arguing the final play of a game that ended 9 months ago in a season already long concluded. Like a lot of fans I was intrigued by this softball game and was interested in discussing it further. It is impressive how much organization went into the game and how many Seattle fans attended. It says a lot about Richard Sherman, Russell Wilson, et. al. as well as the Seahawks fan base. These are great charities that deserve all the support.

    Yet rather than discussing the game or even talking about Sherman, whether you love him or hate him, this blog has devolved into episode 759 of re-litigating the end of that football game. It has been discussed ad nauseam and will never be settled. Let it go.

    We expect that out of the national media but this is one place one would hope to not find the banal arguments about whether it was a catch or not. The bottom line is the rules are far from clear, the video evidence is at best ambiguous, the game is over, it ended up having little to no impact on playoff seeding, and it is merely a historic footnote to the season.

    Also, I thought it was great that Easley came back, and that he and the players had a little fun about that. The guy has taken a tremendous amount of undeserved grief. Let him have a light-hearted moment.

  75. montanamike2 says:

    Slow time of the year.

  76. Watching Andre Roberts strike out was funny, t.o. was clowning him hard. Tate was a freak athlete in the infeild and Shawn Kemp going deep was cool. Also lawyer getting all the U.W. fans all chantin. All around awesome day. Only downer, concessions were slow as hell and way to overwhelmed and I couldn’t find a Richard Sherman hat.

  77. bbnate420 says:

    I don’t think Cheney Stadium has 7,000 people there too often.

  78. Seahawks22360 says:

    Great point Madpunter88. I was at the softball game, and it almost seemed like Mr. Easley was just happy to be in a place where he’s liked. He was more than thrilled to pose for pictures. Hell, I even had him sign my football haha. I highly recommend going next year to everyone!

  79. Seahawks22360 says:

    TruBlu- the VIP section concessions were on point:)

  80. Lucky guy. Yeah, I waited until saturday to get tix. I hope they do do this again, I’ll definitely try and do the vip, shoot maybe save up 1,200 and actually play, but I bet next year it’s going to be way more publicized and will sell out way before game day. Still, tight as hell. Go hawks.

  81. on the “catch”

    1. Easley admitted that NOBODY really saw the play full speed and EVERYTHING that happened
    2. He should have talked to his fellow officials
    3. The Replay was NOT clear enough to overturn
    4. The NFL said the replay was not clear enough to overturn

    Therefore: BITE ME to anyone who wants to keep whining! The refs are HUMAN mistakes may or may not be made EVERY game. it’s life

    Sorry off of my soap box

  82. sluggo42 says:

    The game sounds like it was a total blast

    Nate dog, I just finished your little chat with arogers12 whiner. Made me laugh pretty hard.
    Did Eric ban him already?

  83. bbnate420 says:

    Sluggo, I don’t know. His posts are still there. I’ll ignore him from now on. Maybe should’ve to begin with, but I just couldn’t help myself. I try to refrain from personally insulting any legitimate posters now, but a Packers troll is another story. As jawpeace said, go suck a cheese stick.

  84. Dukeshire says:

    I had a dream last night, that Seattle won the Super Bowl this coming season. I was at a friends bouse before the game, but then at the airport when it was over. Really odd but sure felt good. lol

  85. yankinta says:

    lol Dukeshire, you’re so obsessed!! just like me, lol

  86. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I had a dream Russell Wilson was my personal lord and savior.

  87. yankinta says:

    bbnate420, those weren’t facts I was trying to refer to. I was saying what the article provides were facts and a ton of pictures. Seeing is believing.

    My point about comparing the size of Tate and Jennings still stand even though I may not have looked up the actual stats on them, because Jennings still couldn’t pull the ball away from Tate, even with his 2 hands on it versus Tate’s one hand on it. There’s no need to speak of the Lord’s name in vain. We’re talking about Football, after all….

  88. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I’m still waiting for RadeOn’s apology to DanielleMND. Remember what you said about Women and football?

    The other stuff with being wrong about Wilson and other draft picks last year is no big deal to me anymore. He ate crow, I know that.
    Who hasn’t eaten crow around here from time to time. In fact it’s our favorite dish on this blog.
    I ate crow about Unger and Tate, and I hope to be eating crow soon with Carpitt.

    BTW- I wasn’t trying to put BobbyK and RadeOn at the same annoying level as ACID. I know BobbyK has some good things to add here. RadeOn, I just haven’t heard much of him at all to form an opinion either way. Wish he posted more.
    I do apologize though if my baiting techniques seem a little strong sometimes.

  89. “epistemological”. bbnate, you win the prize for longest and most obscure word ever used on this blog. Congratulations!

    Also, I would say IMO its hard to argue with the statement that Cruz is a more explosive WR than Rice, especially at this point in time. While the stats wont show it necessarily (except Cruz has far more receptions), there are plenty of reasons why they are misleading.

    Cruz gets a lot of targets the same way Tate does–Short, quick throws near the line of scrimmage that allow his natural athleticism to gain the yards. A short throw where he picks up 8 or 10 yards after the catch is a lot more “explosive” in my mind than a 12 yard hitch with a 2-yard after the catch. Rice isnt fast enough to make those kinds of plays. Nor is he fast enough to stretch defenses deep like Cruz does, on a regular basis: Rice is just fast enough to get separation after his skilled route-running tricks a DB, but not fast enough to blow past them when they know its a go-route.

    Just watching the moves and speed of Cruz vs Rice, in my opinion there is no comparison. Cruz is by far the more athletic, explosive player. He also caught a LOT more balls than Rice the last couple years.

    I just cant understand anyone thinking Rice is even close to Cruz in terms of explosiveness the last couple years, and Ive watched them both. Its kind of apples to oranges, as they both play different positions in different offenses, but based on the eye test, Cruz is on a level far above Rice in everything except technique and hands.

    Cruz drops a lot of passes though. Rice drops few, though his drops have been big ones.

    Please dont try to make me out to be a Rice “hater”, as Im far from it. I cheer him on and rejoice when he steps up. He’s just not able to produce consistently, and he’s lost speed, and that prevents him from producing like an elite WR IMO (and Im not talking stats here). Hell, Darrell Jackson was better at getting first downs when they had to be made, when everyone in the stadium knew he was getting the ball, than Rice is. And Jackson wasnt a true number one, but he never had a Tate to play opposite him (K-Rob for one year).

    Jackson will go down as a far more valuable player throughout his career than Rice IMO. And thats even if you discount the stats, which admittedly arent all Rice’s fault, as he doesnt play in a true WCO offense as Jackson did. Which is sad, because Rice had by far more talent than Jackson. And Jackson played years with a debilitating knee injury, jet still racked up 1,000 yard seasons, and in his last good year here, was close to it and racked up 10 TD’s in 10 games to lead the NFL before his knee just got too thrashed.

    Rice is a good WR, and at times very good. But he’s just not anywhere near as explosive as some on this blog would like to paint him. He seems to have a reputation built on hype, hope, and one good year with Favre.

    Those that disagree are welcome to their opinions, and I dont mind discussing it. I just cannot see how Rice can be considered an elite WR or even a true number 1. To each their own, I suppose.

  90. I dont get the RADEoN baiting/bashing. He’s gone off the deep end a few times, but many of us have. He’s also eaten serious crow–and liked it–as others have pointed out.

    Personally, I like discussing, even arguing, about the Seahawks. Even with the looniest of the loony (and I must say Ive been one of those at times). I too wish he’d post more.

  91. yankinta says:

    Rice will not be with us next year, I see Tate, Harvin, Baldwin and Harper and a rookie WR with us next year. Rice is too expensive for a run first Offense like ours. We need his 8 million plus salary to extend Earl Thomas and Richard Sherman.

    Cruz is above average WR but not a game changer like Harvin currently is or Tate will be this year and next year.

    I’m waiting for a big year from Jordan Hill and Luke Willson. Jesse Williams will make some noise too….

  92. madpunter–Enough namecalling. You dont even post here regularly, what gives you the right to demand we endlessly and only discuss something that already has its own thread–in fact two threads?!

    Personally, I would rather watch paint dry than discuss a charity softball game played by NFL players. Im glad they raised money for charity, even if I am highly suspicious of any and all charities, as most are fake (the stats prove this; most put very little of the money they garner on the ground, and many are simply tax fronts or salary mills). But I didnt see the game, and I really dont care much for baseball or softball, so there is nothing to discuss, at least for me.

    Its great Sherman organized this, or at least spearheaded it, and that guys like Fitz showed up, and that fans supported it. And its also great that the poor ref from the Fail Mary got some much needed love; he sounds like a good dude. THAT is worth talking about.

    But its the offseason. Which means we discuss anything and everything even tangential to the hawks, from the Fail Mary to the charity softball game. If you dont wanna discuss a topic, dont; but dont bag on others and label them fools for discussing anything tangential to the Hawks. It only ends up making you look like the fool.

  93. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I’ve been critical of Rice in the past, however he can do something’s out there that no other WR can do on our team. We need him, and I hope we don’t lose him.
    A healthy Rice is a top 25 WR.

  94. Georgia–I agree, when healthy Rice is at least a top 25 WR, if not a top 15.

  95. madpunter88 says:

    While I agree with you that Tate caught the ball — or at least that the call on the field was plausible and that video evidence was certainly not enough to overturn — my main issue is that the arguments one way or another have been argued to the point of stasis. No one will be convinced one way or the other any longer. Sides are drawn and it is pointless to continue the fight.

    I have been on this blog since 2006. While my posts are more infrequent now than then, I have probably posted several hundred times since the early days. My choice of posting about this is indicative of how much I would prefer to end all discussion of the so-called “Fail Mary.” That’s just my opinion though.

  96. Tate’s TD catch: If you are over it, move along. If you are like me and bored at work, go ahead and read…

    I think we can all agree that it’s called a “Hail Mary” for a reason – it’s a desperate prayer that requires an inordinate amount of luck. Catch/Interception, PI/no call, real ref/replacement ref – none of it matters at the end of the day. It’s a lucky play no matter what because EVERY COMPLETED HAIL MARY REQUIRES LUCK. Getting lucky due to poor officiating is fine with me. Getting lucky because Tate’s a lefty and his left hand was the one he got on the ball is fine with me. Getting lucky because Tate is enough of a “competitor” to blatently shove a guy to the ground and eventually wrestle the ball out is fine with me. There are more defenders than receivers, hail mary’s are a big deal because they are about as common as a no-hitter in baseball, maybe less. Debating the “correctness or incorrectness of the call” is irrelevant, had it been called an INT it would have stayed that way following replay.

    Arguing about which rule should apply is a waste of time too. The call was right because the Seahawks benefitted. I’ll say it another way to those that care: The call was legit because it went in favor of the Seahawks. I’m a fan so I will always feel this way, regardless of what a different angle shows or a frame by frame reveals. I don’t need to hear someone else agree – neither should you. Sometimes the ball hits the net… LUCK HAPPENS.

    Go Hawks!

  97. bbnate420 says:

    Yankster, I don’t believe in a lord, so I don’t really care about whether or not you think I took his name in vain. But how exactly did I take his name in vain pray tell? I didn’t criticize anyone’s religion or deity. It certainly wasn’t the intent anyways. Chill.

    STTBM, I wasn’t arguing that Rice is more dynamic than Cruz. I just don’t think it’s clear cut either way. I can see a case for both players. It depends exactly what someone means by dynamic. Is it the TDs they score and the yards they average per play, regardless of how close to the LOS they receive the ball? Or is it more about what they can do with the ball in their hands?

    I wouldn’t argue if you said Cruz has faster playing speed and is better after the catch. Rice and Cruz actually ran almost identical 40 times coming out of college. Rice ran a 4.51 at the combine and Cruz ran 4.47 at his pro day. The combine times are more accurate and usually slower. But 40 time doesn’t automatically equate to playing speed. And I know you think Rice has lost a lot of speed. I think he probably has lost a little, but I don’t think he’s lost as much as you insinuate. It’s subjective. But that doesn’t automatically make Cruz more dynamic to me. And you can be very dynamic without a lot of YAC. Randy Moss did catch some WR screens, more so earlier in his career, but most of his damage came far down the field. He didn’t break a ton of tackles. He just out ran and jumped people. I don’t think anyone would argue that Moss wasn’t dynamic.

    Cruz certainly gets more YAC than Rice. Rice’s YAC for his career is 24.1 % of his total yards. Randy Moss’ YAC is 25 % of his career total. Cruz’s YAC is 34.5 % of his total yards. For comparison, Harvin’s YAC is 57.3 %!

    Your opinion that Cruz is more dynamic is certainly legitimate. So is someones’ who would argue for Rice. That was really my point. You can’t objectively make an overwhelming case for either.

  98. bbnate420 says:

    BTW, this is why I made the comment about lord and savior to Georgia. I also saw a mocked up poster, but I can’t find it now.

  99. bbnate420 says:

    I guess I should give a warning. Don’t read if uptight, humorless, or holier than thou.

  100. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Thanks nate for The Ten Commandments of Wilson-ism. I will put that up on my wall, (amongst all his pics & posters) and read it every day.

    BTW- Did you read the one comment that says “I just can’t pray to a QB that’s shorter than me.” Lol.

  101. bbnate420 says:

    Yes, that was funny Georgia. A lot of the comments were pretty funny.

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