Seahawks Insider

Top rookie QB debate

Post by Dave Boling / The News Tribune on Nov. 15, 2012 at 1:40 pm with 50 Comments »
November 15, 2012 1:40 pm

Mike Sando over at ESPN.com’s NFC West blog set up an interesting discussion among other divisional bloggers examining the relative merits of rookie quarterbacks Russell Wilson, Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III. Amazing to me that Wilson so fully deserves to be in the conversation. As I discussed with Mitch Levy, Hugh Millen and Jerry Brewer this morning on the KJR Seahawks Roundtable, who could have imagined 10 weeks ago that Wilson would have a 90 passer rating, have 11 touchdowns and zero interceptions in home games, and the Hawks would be 6-4 under his leadership?

On that link, there’s an interesting tidbit below about Niners coach Jim Harbaugh having a minor procedure to deal with an irregular heart beat.

 

 

Leave a comment Comments → 50
  1. Best ranked rookie QB as ranked by sportswriters?

    Who cares? Certainly none of the QBs likely give two hoots. If having a better ranking by sportswriters is more important than W’s for your team then you need to recalibrate your focus. Both Luck and Wison each have the same number of wins, but Seattle’s schedule has been significantly more difficult.

    Frankly RW would be ranked a whole lot higher had some catches been made in SF, StL., and Phoenix. An assessment needs to be made of how each of these rookie QBs is being used. The rankings don’t discount bias, scheme, and supporting casts.

    At this stage RW is doing pretty darn well and appears to play within the limits he is allowed but those still remain unnecessarily constrained. His receiving corps have been late to the party and aren’t getting open quickly. Until recently he has been held back from making the plays he can make with his feet.

    It’s too early to say which of these young QBs will prove to be the best in the long term but Wilson as a 3rd round pick for sure is making a strong case for consideration in the same group as the other two. It cannot be argued that so far Wilson appears to have been a draft day bargain.

  2. Ryan Tannehill would have been in this discussion about four weeks ago — right after he passed for 400 yards. I believe that Luck is the real deal and will have a great career and be a Top Ten QB. As for the others, including Wilson, we’ll probably have to wait a few years. But all the signs are positive for Wilson and RG III.

  3. RGIII, great as he is, will need to change the way he plays, or I don’t think he’ll stay healthy in this league. The times I’ve watched him, he takes a ton of major hits.

  4. PugetHawk says:

    I think the Seahawks would have more wins with Luck or RGIII because I think Wilson had more to overcome when he entered the league. This QB class is very impressive and the teams with them should be good for the next decade.

  5. Wilson’s play has certainly quieted any critics of Carroll’s decision to start him. I was in the “Start Flynn” camp during the preseason, but Carroll absolutely made the right decision. Russell Wilson is already the greatest QB ever drafted by the Seahawks. Actually, he achieved that after his fourth game or so. I don’t think Rick Mirer would argue.

  6. Fun to read that Byrne piece referenced in Sando’s article: http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/wheres-the-hype-russell-wilson-nfls-best-rookie-qb-so-far/19228/

    Highest non-partisan praise I’ve seen yet for our guy . . .

  7. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    pdway thanks for the link

  8. tchristensen says:

    yes, thanks pdway! Greta article.

  9. GeorgiaHawk says:

    pdway thanks, I just love cold hard football facts. And it doesn’t help that Wilson plays for Seattle where the likes of Hasselbeck, Green and Easley didn’t get the respect that they deserved.

    I hope Wilson has healthy WRs the rest of the season and takes his QB rating over 100. He will need to do that, (imo) and stay at least 15-20 points higher then Luck to even be considered for rookie of the year.

  10. Ewalters7354 says:

    I think sometimes people get so caught up in numbers,it deceives them.Cam Newton threw for a bunch of yards and still had a 6-10 record.That’s why when I see some disappointed I actually get surprised because he struggled last year.Take away the numbers and you’ll see what I mean.He threw a boatload of picks and struggled with turnovers.So I never was impressed to the point of calling him a stud.

    Luck is the best of the bunch.He’s smart, decisive, has a quick release, and great pocket presence.His main struggle to me is the speed of the game.He also throws ducks every once in a while and struggles with his deep ball.

    RG3 is solid throwing the ball, but great making plays when he isn’t throwing.Has good mechanics, delivery, and has a very good arm.But he holds the ball entirely too long as always gets hit.Needs to learn how to slide and needs to do a better job of locking on to his primary target.

    Tannehill also has a good arm and decent footwork.He just needs more experience playing the position(only his second year playing QB), but he kinda reminds me of Luck.Very mobile.Throws his passes too low at times and doesn’t go through all his progressions at times.

    Weeden is not good at all.While he has been decent, he struggles with consistency.Arm strength is decent, footwork needs a lot of work,he also struggles seeing the field a lot of time.

    Wilson as we all know has a rocket arm, can make all the throws, and is very elusive.But he struggles holding on to the ball at times, doesn’t sit in the pocket near as long as he should.When he does, good things happen.When he doesn’t, he is kinda reckless.Trust his mobility a little too much at times, running in circles and tries to make too much happen when sometimes he should just takes a sack.Also makes it hard on the WRs when he rolls
    out the pocket.How? It messes the whole play call up.The pass catchers don’t always be done running their routes and he throws it away, making it look like nobody’s open.He’s getting better though.

  11. Ewalters7354 says:

    looking off*

  12. It will be fun to watch who emerges as NFL defenses adjust to these rookie quarterbacks. Can they adapt?

    My money would be on Luck and Wilson.

  13. Where do you guys think we would be with Matthew Hasslebeck? I think we win the Lions game and most likely the Rams game too!

  14. Hasselbeck

  15. bbnate420 says:

    Oh god, let’s not debate Hasselbeck again. He’s gone, and he a ain’t comin back.

  16. no way I’d trade RW for Hasselbeck – – even this year’s version, at this point.

    Re the rookie QB’s — Luck looks great to me, looks like the prototype, he may be the best building block player in the league outside of Rodgers at this point. RG3 is trickier to judge, but he’s a dynamic player. I need to watch him play a bit more.

    Haven’t seen Tannehill or Weeden enough to have an opinion, I guess I’ll watch Tannehill some tonight . . .

    It’s no fun reading all the Thurs football predictions, etc., w/out our Hawks in the mix . . .

  17. Biggest issue I see with RW is his windup and delivery…it takes forever sometimes! How many times have I watched him pick his target and wind up only to get hit before delivering. he needs to focus on the quickness of his release.

  18. Ewalters7354 says:

    Tom, I couldn’t disagree more.He has a very quick delivery.Those were one of his
    strengths coming out of college.Maybe I’m wrong.But that’s what I have both seen and read.

  19. Dukeshire says:

    I don’t agree either. When I was reading Tom’s description I kept thinking of Byron Leftwich. Wilson may be slow with his reads, but once he decides, it’s out pretty quickly, IMO.

  20. It’s fun to think we are watching a young kid develop before our eyes as a potential franchise QB. It’s kind of like we were expecting/hoping from Flynn when he signed, although it really doesn’t matter who it is/was… as long as the Seahawks get a good QB for the future. But Wilson is no Luck. It’s not a knock on him, because if Wilson becomes a top 10-12 type of guy, I’m not going to care. It’s like me saying that Matt Hasselbeck was never a Dan Marino or John Elway, but that doesn’t mean I couldn’t like Hasselbeck more and that he was never any good. It’s like if Seahawks/Hasselbeck ever beat the Colts/Manning… that wouldn’t mean Hasselbeck was better than Manning. It would simply mean the Seahawks (with their good QB) were better than the Colts (and their great QB). Aside from Luck, there’s good reason to compare Wilson to all of the other QBs from this past draft class though. And that’s exciting!

  21. raymaines says:

    I think the best we could say about Matt Hasselbeck is that he would have probably been better than T-Jack last year.

    Now it’s all about RW and Matt Flynn. Had #8 stayed the extra year we would now give him a gold watch and put his number in the ring of honer and would happily move on. Love ya, man. See ya. Write if you find work.

  22. Dukeshire says:

    “Had he stayed”…? You mean “if they kept him”, I presume.

  23. Had they kept Hasselbeck, this team might be going to the Super Bowl this year. Since he’s gone, it’s about competing with a rookie and then setting themselves up for a good run in ’13 (with a young QB w/experience). Anyone here think Wilson would be 7-4 if he was the starter for the Chiefs? Didn’t think so (for the record, Flynn would suck with the Chiefs too). It’s a team game, but I’m glad we have a guy under center like Wilson, even if others may take my words out of context and paint me as a hater (tell enough lies, then others will believe it).

  24. Ewalters7354 says:

    Bobby, that is so true! Happens all the time lol

    Had they kept Hasselbeck and
    he was able to stay healthy, this team would probably be undefeated and be the talk of the league.Well all we can do now id wonder because Matt’s not coming back :(

  25. Undefeated with Matt Hasselbeck? No way. They would have still lost at Arizona and San Fran, perhaps even at St. Louis and Detroit. Hass was my favorite Seahawk, but he’s way past his peak. With the 2007 Hass, they certainly could be undefeated, but the 2012 Hass isn’t the same. He’s definitely a Hass-been.

  26. Ewalters7354 says:

    Canfan, I agree to an extent.He’s definitely not the 07 Hass, but he can still lead a team and has the smarts to cover up for his diminished skill(arm strength).I said this team will PROBABLY be undefeated.We’ll never know, but based on how he lead the Titans last year.I think he can still deliver.Just my personal feeling.

  27. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I’m a huge fan of Hasselbeck, ( as most of you all know ) however at this stage of his career he’s very unlikely to lead any team to a SuperBowl.
    There is a reason Locker is starting over him.

    I think Hasselbeck would have been our best option last year to make the playoffs and this year too, until Wilson came along. Now there is no way that I would have started Hasselbeck this year at this stage of the season over Wilson if he was still on the team.
    As much as I liked Hasselbecks smarts, size and guts, he would rip our hearts out at times with his Jeckyll/ Hyde play. He tried to be too much like Brett Farve at times in a gooney bird body.
    I want a guy that is more steady Eddie, that will play within himself and not be to emotionally high like Hasselbeck was, and is during the game. I want a guy who is a hard worker and smart, and has guts like Hasselbeck has but with a strong arm, athletic durable body who can stay more cool under pressure.
    That’s what Wilson brings to the table despite his shortcomings.

    Locker is the QB that I wanted this team to draft last year with Hasselbeck as his mentor, however no way would I trade Wilson/Flynn for Locker/Hasselbeck now. No way!

  28. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Miami has now lost three in a row but is still in the playoff picture in the AFC.
    Just like the Jets, Miami will be desperate for a win,( when we play them ) to keep their playoff hopes alive. Unlike the Jets they will be playing at their place.
    I think one sign of a strong playoff ready team is to be able to knockoff fringe playoff teams on the road. This game will be a good test imo.

  29. Ewalters7354 says:

    Georgia, good stuff bro.Aside from Jake Locker.That guy is reckless as they come.

  30. montanamike2 says:

    Yesterday they dug up our lines in the area and didn’t tell us. I had no internet mostly all day and the frustration of trying to reset and analyze my modem was driving me crazy! Today it’s back on but the changes i made to my computer must be all reconfigured.
    The Bills didn’t look a whole lot better than Miami last night so there’s optimism.

  31. Its great to see Miami stumble again, just before we play them. As Chuck Knox used to say, its not who you play but when you play them. Our confidence is high, theirs will be low.

    It will be difficult, but I will be watching and cheering for the Bears on Monday night vs. 49ers.

  32. And we catch a small break in that we play Buffalo at the Rogers Center in Toronto instead of at Ralph Wilson stadium in Buffalo. Its almost like a neutral site. I saw Buffalo play Washington at the Rogers Center last season.

  33. Dukeshire says:

    Playing at Ralph Wilson is almost like a neutral site. Seattle ought to win that game, regardless where it’s played.

  34. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Ewalters7354- agree about Locker. I don’t know how this kid is ever going to make it through a season if he doesn’t learn how to slide.

    You would think he would know how after playing baseball for years.

  35. The away games at Miami and Buffalo are as winnable as the game at St. Louis was. The Seahawks should win, unless strange things happen, like a kicker making two extra-long FGs and some flukey INTs. Miami is more winnable than Buffalo because they have a rookie QB and a mediocre running game.

  36. Duke – I take it your comment is more about how Buffalo is playing right now? Fair enough, but I have seen a couple of games at Ralph Wilson stadium (including the Seahawks getting their butt kicked 34-10, Bureleson was injured and out for the year) Its a tough place to play, especially in the winter. It really a big advantage to play Buffalo in the dome in Toronto over the cold outside in Buffalo.

  37. Dukeshire says:

    All that is true, but additionally, Seattle is simply better across the board and at nearly every matchup.

  38. Southendzone says:

    If Flynn was the starter, the Hawks would have been 11/0 right now. That’s right, the NFL would have awarded us an extra win for a game not played due to Flynn’s greatness. They would also have filed legal paperwork to rename it the National Flynn-ball League, and started construction of the Matt Flynn wing of the NFL HOF.

  39. rramstad says:

    The best thing about Rogers Centre is that it’s indoors. Playing at Buffalo late in the year could have had really bad weather, and I’d like to see our passing game continue developing… I agree that we’d have good advantage against the Bills at Ralph Wilson in Buffalo in bad weather, because of our great running game, but I want to see strides every week, especially getting passes out to the fringe guys like Baldwin and Moore (who?), and we’ll see that in Toronto where we wouldn’t see it probably in Buffalo.

  40. yankinta says:

    Andrew Luck is not the real deal. He’s a good player. But he’s not a sure future HOF player which is what most people think. I’ve watched a lot of his games in college and in NFL. He will be good, a probowl player. But he will not be an All-Pro player.

    I’ve said it from Day 1, that RW will be a great player and his ceiling is so high that he could be an All-Pro player one day.

    For those that said that Luck is carrying a bad team. They have 3 ALL-PRO players on that team and good young talent. Colts are not a bad team. They just had a really bad QB (who didn’t belong in the NFL) hence their record last year. Ryan T. and Brandon W. are in worst situation than Luck…..

  41. Dukeshire says:

    So, being a “pro-bowl” level player doesn’t qualify as the “real deal” to you? In addition, I’ll go on record right now and say barring injuries, he’ll be a multi-time all-pro and would give great odds he’ll be a MVP at some point.

  42. Helenahawk says:

    I saw two special teams td’s last night. These guys both can threaten so these aren’t gimmes.

  43. Duke – I never said Seattle wasn’t a better team, only that we caught a small break because of the games location.

  44. EastCoastFan51 says:

    well Luck is playing well but waaaay too much hype for what he has done. Of his 10 td’s 4 are on the ground…..so the arguement goes wilson is playing better ….how can you not say that? A third round pick isn’t suppose to be 6-4 but a first pick overall is expected to be great so why all the hype for him? I don’t get it….well it will pay off for us hawk fans as it will give Wilson more drive/desire to be great….he will prove all doubters wrong. Some guys just know how to win/play and Wilson is a baller. We are in good hands with Wilson guy never gets rattled.

  45. I really like Wilson and how his progressing and how well he handling the team. That being said – if we could trade Wilson straight up for Luck I would.

    I like them both a lot!! but I would still hold a slight favor towards Luck. The great thing is we didn’t have to give up the #1 overall pick for Wilson :) Good for us!! now and in the long run

  46. Russel Wilson was the guy for us. RGIII is a better athlete, and has a stronger arm, but Wilson fits our offense just as well. (I do wish we had somehow ended up with RGII, but Wilson is making me forget about him). Luck is a great in the making, and old-school prototype qb with the speed and size to run which is key in todays NFL. But I still think RGIII and WIlson will go down as the top qb’s from this class.

    Now that Seattle’s staff is working for Wilson rather than against him as they did early in the season, he is outplaying both Luck and RGIII. It wont matter the the NFL, run by Goodell, as he cares far more about pumping up interest in flagging teams with big TV markets like Indi and DC. Everything in the NFL awards system is money/political under Goodell. Gone is sportsmanship and real performance, in is hype and spin. Oh well, Wilson isnt exactly being ignored by the world, and even Mike Florio the Douche has good things to say about Seattle on Profootballblather each day…it could be worse.

    And yeah, we got him in the third…eat it NFL!

  47. I expect Seattle to do thier usual by losing one of the two games vs Miami and Buffalo. I expect us to lose to Chicago and the Niners as well, but I hope somehow we beat them both.

    And secretly, I want Seattle to beat the Niners more than I want us to go to the playoffs. Id trade the playoffs to beat the niners, at least this year…call me crazy…

  48. EastCoastFan51 says:

    i believe pete carroll will have the guys ready for the last six games with the hope they can catch the niners. we’ve gotten better each week where the niners haven’t….niners are good but beatable. carroll will have this young team ready for miami and the other road games knowing that they’ll more than likely have to play on the road come playoff time if we make it i’m sure that will be stressed next week….honestly every game left is winnable….wilson is not the same qb from the first three games and neither is our offense…things are coming together and trust me no one wants to play us come playoffs as we are getting hot when it counts. go Hawks!!

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