Seahawks Insider

Morning links: Hawks get late-round pick for Jackson

Post by Eric Williams on Aug. 27, 2012 at 6:15 am with 139 Comments »
August 27, 2012 6:48 am
Seattle Seahawks quarterback Tarvaris Jackson warms up before the start of an NFL football game between the St. Louis Rams and the Seattle Seahawks Sunday, Nov. 20, 2011, in St. Louis. (AP Photo/Jeff Roberson)

Good morning. The Seahawks practice this afternoon at 1:30, so I’ll have a report from practice later today. I’ll also be hosting a chat at 11 a.m., so check in later if you have time.

Peter King of Sports Illustrated writes that the Seahawks will get a seventh-round pick that could improve to a sixth in the trade with Buffalo if Tarvaris Jackson is active for six games. King also mentions that he was told by “Someone Who Knows” that Wilson would have to be markedly better than free-agent signee Matt Flynn to win the starting job, and that Wilson’s performance was “markedly better.”

Mark Gaughan of the Buffalo News writes that Jackson looks like the frontrunner to back up Ryan Fitzpatrick, with Vince Young and Tyler Thigpen struggling in preseason play.

Here’s my story on a busy day for the Seahawks on Sunday, which included naming Russell Wilson as the team’s starting quarterback.

Clare Farnsworth of Seahawks.com writes that Wilson took full advantage of his opportunities to earn the starting job.

ESPN’s Mike Sando writes that Pete Carroll naming Wilson the starter had more to do with the rookie’s play than the shortcomings of Matt Flynn.

Toni Monkovic of the New York Times’ Fifth Down Blog writes that Wilson being named a starter is a victory for short people.

Jay Glazer of Fox Sports says Terrell Owens might have a tough time catching on with another team in this video link.

Alex Marvez of Fox Sports writes that Owens’ release proves he’s just not good enough anymore.

Clark Judge of CBS Sports writes that if this is the end for Owens, he does not deserve to be in the Hall of Fame.

Mike Freeman of CBS Sports writes that although Owens was a jerk at times, he’s has Hall of Fame credentials.

Categories:
Morning links
Leave a comment Comments → 139
  1. It’s amazing what one year can do. We go from the QB situation I have hated the most in almost 30 years of being a fan to, now, two guys that I really like and know we can/will win with. To top it off, Wilson seems to be the guy of guy that you can be proud of that he’s your QB. He’s smart, well spoken, a good guy, etc. Not that Tarvaris wasn’t a good guy, he was, but I didn’t believe in his “abilities.”

    Regardless of who was going to start between our two guys, I hope people understand there are going to be some dumb plays that come with inexperience (unless you’re Dan Marino as a rookie, it happens – even Cam Newton had some bonehead plays last year, even though he was great), but going with either of these guys is the way to a better tomorrow. All you can ask for as a fan is “hope” and we have plenty of that these days!

  2. seahawksfan31 says:

    PC and JS will be money with that pick next year. Russell is absolutely electric when he is on the field. A team that has a youthful identity now has a youthful stud at qb. GO HAWKS!!!!!!

  3. Here’s the part where pabs writes about worse QB situations and then I respond by saying “that’s why I said ‘I hated most’” and then he’ll talk about Jackson going 7-7 and then I respond by saying the others never had both a dominant run game and top 10 defense and then the argument will continue to something else that has nothing to do with the QB situation. lol

  4. hawkfaninoklahoma says:

    couldnt agree more bobby. going to be a fun year to watch.

  5. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Cam Newton had more then some bonehead plays last year. You won’t see near the bonehead plays from Wilson, imo.

  6. jarred767 says:

    I’m glad our QB situation is settled and we can focus on Arizona now, and to get a 6th rounder back (I’d be surprised if T-Jack was active for less than six gimes – he may even start a few for them) is a great turnaround. I felt undecided who I wanted to win our QB battle (RW of MF) all offseason and through the preseason, but RW won me over last week, and I think that that team will really gel behind him – his leadership definitely seems to be one of his biggest attributes.

    BTW, our team has been rather surprising, a whole lot of fun to watch and pretty dang good all around throughout this preseason (especially the starters) and arguably our most dynamic weapon from last year (Lynch) has only touched the ball a few times times in one game. This could be a really special year.

    Oh, and I know it’s just preseason and they say not to look at the stats, but I did anyways and realized that through 3 games so far we have scored more points than any other team in the league AND we have allowed fewer points than any other team!!! If its any kind of indication of what to come, we should all be stocked for this upcoming year.

  7. I’m still trying to figure out how anyone would be dumb enough to trade even a late round pick for Jackson? Sure, he was the reason, all by himself (that’s sarcasm) that the Seahawks went 6-7 (games started/finished) in his starts, but Vince Young went 8-2 in ’09 as a starter and that’s who he’s going to potentially replace as the #2 in Buffalo. I guess there’s a reason Buffalo sucks and has for over a decade.

  8. Glad we got a starter now, nervious that it’s a rookie though. Mistakes will probably be made, hopefully they will be limited and we can lean on our running game and explosive D to help the little man out. Can’t wait for this sh_t to start. Go Hawks.

  9. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Oh, for those that think pre season games don’t count , ( not on the scoreboard of course ) See Wilson, Sweezy, and a host of other players that have secured a job through pre season play.

  10. RDPoulsbo says:

    Rookies will make rookie mistakes. It’s just going to happen with the speed of the game and defenses better at disguising their schemes. The defense has playmakers, the run game has playmakers, but the passing game is still iffy. If he sticks to PC’s mantra of when in doubt, protect the football he’ll do fine. These WRs are still pretty mediocre, so it’s best not to chance it anyway.

  11. Great we have a young Michael Vick as our QB. This will be interesting to watch when the games count. I agree RW as earned an opportunity here. He certainly hasn’t earned anything beyond that. Defences learn to contain QB with this skill set. I just don’t get how ppl can buy in till everything is real. PC job depends on RW success. Loooooogshooot!

  12. GeorgiaHawk says:

    BobbyK- Are you over on the Bills blogs yet trashing Jackson? Lol.

    Really I wouldn’t be surprised at all if Jackson becomes the Bills starter at some point this season. Not because he is that good so much, but that the other Bills QBs aren’t.

  13. I don’t see any resemblence of Wilson to Vick. Wilson is a mature young man with a brain in his head. I doubt we’re going to have to worry about him getting into any legal trouble. Wilson will get by on some athleticism, like Vick, but I think he’s so much smarter that Vick ever was (or still is) at that age.

    No Georgia – but that’s a good idea. I’m home with a sick kid today so that’s what I’m going to do! lol

  14. RDPoulsbo says:

    Well, T-Jack only has to be active for 6 games, so that means just needs to be the #2. Not a high hurdle to clear there. Fitz is an ok QB. Again, one of those middling types similar to T-Jack who can keep the world from collapsing, but not good enough to take the team into the playoffs. Since they have a rookie LT who really should be playing guard, even if T-Jack were the #3, it may not be long before he becomes the #2 and active.

  15. montanamike2 says:

    It’s true the Bills are screwed at the QB position. This is the most confident i’ve ever felt about the Hawks, I hope we scoop up another stud WR. It’s weird how players with the dropsies suddenly catch everything thrown their way with RW, he elevates everyone around him.
    We have one of the most exciting teams in the NFL!

  16. GeorgiaHawk says:

    BTW- Any word on Curry’s injury? I know his playing time will effect what pick we get for him next year.

  17. GeorgiaHawk says:

    And we have yet to see the Wilson Baldwin show yet. Can’t wait!

  18. montanamike2 says:

    off to paint for awhile.

  19. Let’s have a hand for Eric!

    The man is the only person that called us getting Wilson in the 3rd round. Bravo good sir!

  20. It’s good in a way that RW is not as fast as Vick, few players are, and it probably limits the number of times he decides to scramble. If you were Michael Vick and you knew you were the fastest dude on the field, wouldn’t you try to outrace somebody to the end zone? Wilson scrambles about twice per game, for huge chunks of yardage, and he’s always pointing out blocks even if there are no blockers, to just try to fool the defenders. He did that against Tennessee, and again vs KC. And he always scoots out of bounds smartly behind a block instead of turning upfield for a few more meaningless yards and risk getting hurt. DangeRuss is wise beyond his years, and I suspect the few mistakes he makes, he will learn from very quickly, and he has shown that already by not throwing a pick since his ugly red zone int.

  21. shorty10 says:

    Good for TJack and the Hawks! He WILL get playing time in Buffalo, Fitz is a mess. And, Russell Wilson WILL win Rookie of the Year.

  22. A little cream to the cake….

    If you think our offense was efficient during last game just wait….

    Last game Russell Wilson wasn’t supposed to succeed on offense. Pete made him execute the essentially the same game plan as Flynn. Sit in the pocket and throw kid, prove to us that your diminutive size doesn’t hinder your ability to read defensive coverages, let your legs and elusiveness be a asset instead of a strength. Pass, pass and pass.

    Think about what our offense can do when it’s tailored to RWs strength. We have only begun to scratch the surface of this kids potential.

  23. Dukeshire says:

    The only concern I have that Wilson will turn out like Vick, in any way, is the frailty. As we all know, Wilson is a smaller guy and the more he scrambles (or extends plays as is now the preferred euphemism) the likelier it is he ends up getting injured. Yet another reason I’m hoping to see him become a more comfortable pocket passer.

  24. Dukeshire says:

    “Last game Russell Wilson wasn’t supposed to succeed on offense.” He wasn’t? This offense isn’t going to become the Packers or Patriots, now. They are going to run the ball, grind defenses down, hopefully keep Wilson (or Flynn) upright in and in the pocket, and create turnovers on defense. Wilson as the starter now doesn’t change that.

  25. DisplacedSeahawkFan says:

    It goes without saying that T.Jack isn’t a starting caliber QB. But who wouldn’t mind having him for a backup? I mean, he’s a guy that will come in off the bench and win a game, or two, for you. He has more than his share of short comings, but Buffalo could find a worse back up QB.

    I support Wilson and I’m happy that he’s our starter. I just hope he stays the way he is as far as wanting to be the best, and always acknowledges that he still has a lot to learn, and room to improve. As long as he does, and I believe he will, it’s a good feeling to know we have a franchise QB for the next decade, or so.

    I know it’s way too early to be thinking draft, but, now that we have a franchise QB, I think he’ll need another weapon, or two, at receiver before we can really start to dominate our division. Once we pick up a couple of receivers in the draft, or free agency, or both, it’s a good feeling knowing that we don’t have any glaring needs and will only have to draft to add depth. I’m really excited and anxious not only for this season, but also for many more seasons to come! This is the best I’ve felt about the Seahawks in a few years!

  26. Soggybuc says:

    Duke I watched that Gruden QB canp again yesterday, the smarts of this kid was not what stood out to me, we already knew that but when he was throwing at the end I was impressed with his body. he’s muscled up as well any other guy on the team. well ok minus Turbins biceps. he lacks any of the lankiness you usually see in QB’s.
    He looks able to take a hit as well as any other QB. that said they are all a good hit away from IR but I think Wilson might just piss off a few rushers this year. 6’6 guys are much bigger targets.

  27. Soggybuc says:

    Oh and lets not forget that teams are going to see a lot of RW handing the ball to Lynch. only to be followed by him handing it to Turbin.
    this is still going to be a run game offense.

  28. Dukeshire says:

    I realize any perceived criticism of Wilson here is met with disdain, having said that, let me point out a couple things: He’s going to struggle. All rookie QBs do. He’s going to face defenses that disguise coverages and blitzes, run exotic packages out that he’s never seen, play at a speed he’s never experienced, and so on. No matter how well he’s played in preseason, only experiencing regular game season games will help him. So while “we’re” anointing him the face of the franchise today, let’s remember the learning curve once the season actually starts.

  29. FleaFlicker says:

    Just saw that Bills released Vince Young. Looks like T-Jack is going to land on both feet.

    I am just as excited about RW as the next guy. But to echo a couple comments about managing expectations: let’s remember that even a great player like Payton Manning had more INTs than TDs in his rookie year.

    RW is going to have his ups and downs. I hope we can all keep that in perspective when the inevitable terrible, 3 INT game comes along. Pulling him in favor of MF is not going to be the answer. We’ve got to stay in Russell’s corner as long as he has the confidence of PC.

  30. “The only concern I have that Wilson will turn out like Vick, in any way, is the frailty”

    Right. Same here. About the only similarity I see to Vick is the body type. Vick came into the league as an unbelievable runner for a QB (still is, for the most part), the best we’ve ever seen at the position. But his passing lacked touch and accuracy. I think Wilson throws a much better ball, and seems to run when needed, and smartly/situationally.

    But – you can’t get away from the fact that RW’s size feels precarious when thinking about the hits that an NFL QB is bound to take. Doesn’t seem like durability has been an issue for him so far, hoping bigtime things stay that way.

  31. Now that Jackson is learning a new offense, I do believe he’s on of the worst back-ups in the NFL. That’s how bad I think he sucks. I’d rather pay some sucker to suck minimum wage (NFL “standards”), than overpay a bad player.

  32. yankinta says:

    For all those, that called me crazy a couple of weeks ago, for picking Russell Wilson and saying we should trade Flynn, what do you have to say for yourselves now??

    Too bad Flynn got injured, or we could have traded him for a second round pick for sure, instead of trading T-Jack for a 7th round pick….

  33. Dukeshire – I never said anything about Wilson changing the identity of our offense…which is run first.

    There is an obvious difference of the first two preseason games and the last one during pass plays involving Wilson. He executed a game plan that mirrored the majority of pass plays invoving Flynn. Much of that involved remaining in the pocket to complete the read and throw rather than doing so from outside the pocket. Much of what Wilson did during KC was more similar to the design of a pocket passer, even down to personell groupings.

  34. If anyone remembers Vick’s early game at Minnesota, I was at that one. He was a man among boys running the ball and, yes, he was, by far, the fastest/quickest player on the field that day. However, with Wilson having a brain in his head, I believe we’ll be just fine.

  35. And the best thing that came out of the TJack trade is that now it gives a Bobby K a chance to become a respectable poster again…..

  36. DisplacedSeahawkFan says:

    Duke, I think that everyone here agrees with that. But the same thing applies to Matt Flynn. Flynn isn’t really experienced either. When those situations arise, and they will, at least Wilson has more natural ability–i.e., scrambling ability and a stronger arm, to try to cope with them. But he’s gonna make some awful mistakes.

    Wilson is really smart. I think that he’ll pick up the game and learn at least as fast as Matt Flynn would have as a starter. All that I think anyone hopes is that when Wilson inevitably makes mistakes he learns from them, and doesn’t repeat them.

  37. RDPoulsbo says:

    yankinta: Nope. You’re the only sucker here. Trade the best backup just before the season begins for a future draft pick? Why not just trade Thomas for a couple 1s with that kind of logic. Whatever. Enjoy your weekend in the spring while the rest of us enjoy actual football in the fall.

  38. HawksKD — I’m not sure if that’s a compliment or not :)

    But, yeah, I can’t think of anyone I’ve despised more. Sure, I think Portis is an idiot, but who cares, he’s 3rd string and (hopefully) never sees the field. But when you hate a starter that bad, it’s not a good sign.

  39. yankinta says:

    RDPoulsbo, really? wow, you’d keep Flynn as a backup for that kind of money? When we could easily use that pick for a WR or LB next year? what are you smoking?

    and calling me a sucker? You sound like a sore loser to me… Maybe you think the Eagles are a sucker too for traking Kolb too, lol…

  40. Soggybuc says:

    ” However, with Wilson having a brain in his head, I believe we’ll be just fine.”

    That right there is the reason we should never mention Vick and Wilson in the same sentence!

    Duke your above post stated every reason why I was a Flynn guy! that train has left the station apparently so i’m just going to jump on the bandwagon and roll with it.

  41. RDPoulsbo says:

    Football starts in just over a week. Only a sucker gets rid of their assets just before the season begins. Talking about the draft now is only for the losers.

  42. Regardless of who became the starter between Flynn and Wilson there is going to be a lot of mistakes. They would have both been learning and pregressing as the season wore on.

    It makes sense to start Wilson if they believed he would be our QB 5 years from now. We want Russell to be developed and learned come that time and Pete fully believes that when it comes to football the more game time experience you have the steeper progression will become. He plays em early and he plays them often. The caveat with the QB position is that it is a centralized role. Pete has to trust that while Wilson progresses that he can minimize mistakes that become critical to the outcome of games.

  43. Perspective. Flynn has already received some (if not all – IDK) of the signing bonus. It’s already been paid. And year #3 of the contract is big. He won’t be here in ’14 at that big of a price (so it’s not really 3 years and $27 million) if he’s not the starter (which none of us want, as we’re hoping for the best w/Wilson). Call me crazy, but I’d rather have a really good/great (IMO) back-up QB next year than some WR or LB (and if we need either of those positions that badly, then we have our #1/2 picks to use them on). I don’t think there’s a price tag you can put on any season. If you have a great back-up QB, you have the power of not having your season destroyed if your starter goes down. We can handle the loss of any of our stars, IMO (ET, Okung, Rice, etc.), but not a legit/good starting QB.

  44. In my view, Dukeshire has just said it all above: this team’s bread and butter really on offense is running the ball consistently and dependably, first and finally, and not just another passing circus that’s underlain by a QB having to skitter around too vulnerably and often. And, even more importantly, this offensive strategy is complemented now by a defense that’s more able to control at the center of play from the d-line out, which increases the likelihood of turnover opportunities around the periphery by a talented and active secondary.

    All of which makes for really exciting football, especially when you’ve got the talent developing from the inside out now, topped off finally by two (yes, two) talented, albeit young QBs now who CAN move the chains.

    Which is what we didn’t have in our lone SuperBowl foray in 2005: the ability to control the middle of the line of action, on both sides of the ball…and to score dependably when it counted. So this looks like good stuff to watch developing from now on, even though it’s only the preseason…and key injuries can still alter any of these good intentions and efforts.

  45. Yank
    “For all those, that called me crazy a couple of weeks ago, for picking Russell Wilson and saying we should trade Flynn, what do you have to say for yourselves now??”

    …………….. You’re still crazy

  46. FleaFlicker says:

    Heads up bloggers: Single Game Tickets go on sale at 10:00 a.m.

  47. Great post Bruzy..

    But if I were to nitpick you I would say that our 05 team was about as good as you can get at “scoring at will”. ;)

  48. The QB situation is settled, yet the crazy talk rolls on. lol.

    I just want to inject one bit of reality into the QB comments. The biggest change in this team this year is not at QB. Its not even close. We have upgraded both the starting QB and #2 QB, no question about that. Yet the biggest change on this team – by far – is not QB.

    Its what supports, or destroys, the QB. Its the offensive line.

    Last year, the Seahawks started the season with a string of O line performances through the first third of the season that were the worst in the NFL. Cable tore the line down, threw rookies into the mix, changed their schemes, and they were confused and pathetic through the first three games, pulled it together, then proceeded to suck for a few more games. Our QB was hit and hurried and harassed more than any QB in the league. Jackson performed admirably in that situation and actually gutted out a couple of wins while being destroyed and eventually hobbling through the rest of the year injured.

    If that same O line were starting the opening game this year, Wilson would be destroyed, Flynn would be destroyed, it wouldn’t matter.

    I’m not convinced our O line has elite talent yet, but the improvement in the O line that arrived around game 10 last year was a night/day improvement. If Cable gets this line playing as well to start this season, this will be team that reaches the playoffs, regardless of who is the QB.

    Once in the playoffs, we will also need some QB magic to win… and this is why I’m happy to know Wilson will have 16 games to get ready.

  49. Dukeshire says:

    HawksKD – It sounded like that, to me, with the pass, pass, pass, stuff.

    yankinta – I agree with KD: you are crazy for wanting to trade Flynn.

  50. *Most* rookie QBs struggle. Sure, ok. What will become clear sooner than later is that Russell Wilson is not like most other rookie QBs. He actually has a brain to go with his athletic ability. He’s smart, decisive, and motivated to be great. He won’t struggle nearly as much as some vets here may think. The Seattle QB doesn’t have to do much, just pick up first downs. Check it down. Hence the early belief that Flynn would do just fine as a game manager. Wilson, however, is a dynamic playmaker hidden beneath game manager clothing. Seattle has the perfect opportunity to lull D’s asleep with conservative, he’s-just-a-rookie, play calling only to let Wilson and his talents shine at just the right moment. A fake hand off bootleg with Rice, Edwards, and Miller running routes. Boom! TD.

    WASH, INDY, CLE, and MIA all fail to make the playoffs. Who doesn’t? Seattle and their 3rd rounder.

  51. I for one wish TJ all the best. He showed a lot of heart playing with a torn pectoral last year and he does not deserve the amount of scorn that gets heaped on him by some folks. The blame for miscasting him as a starter belongs on PC, not TJ. TJ only did what was asked of him, and he did his best to deliver, IMO.

  52. Duke my fault for the terrible wording….When I said “pass, pass, pass”

    I meant pass as in…there was a challenge laid before you and you “passed”……

  53. RDPoulsbo says:

    I agree with Stevos. Last year’s starting o-line had the least number of starts in over 10 years week 1 and they played like you’d expect them to play. T-Jack wasn’t the problem early on as he had no time to even make 3 step drops. This year is different with a year of working together and improved depth. They’re also still a very young line and can only get better as they gain even more experience.

  54. yankinta says:

    I guess, I’m crazy for jumping out of my couch, screaming like we just won a playoff game, when we picked him in the 3rd round this year…. lol., and saying immediately that we should trade Flynn to get some good value and keep T-Jack as our backup.

    Either if you all agree with me or not, Flynn will be traded before the deadline this year or next year. And we can trust Pete and John to pick up a really good back-up QB with our 3rd round pick (look at Nick Foles at Eagles)…,,,

    And for those that saying we’d never get 1st or 2nd round pick for Flynn, the entire league knows that Flynn didn’t lost the job to RW, RW won it. And yes, there’s a big diff. Only real Football fans knows the diff…. :) )

  55. surelyyoujest says:

    I think some of you guys need to learn how to handle success. This team is back as a contender, so why are we still looking for knits to pick ? Wondering whether Russell Wilson will be frail and injury prone ? Why don’t we wait and see if he gets injured at all before we start fretting about that one. Gees. I’m not sure he’s any more likely to be injured on a scramble than he would be getting clobbered in the pocket. And he’s not much smaller than some of the smaller running backs in the league, like a guy we’ve had here for the last few years (j-force).

    He’s not Mike Vick. And I mean that in a good way. He’s smarter, and has a better grasp on the game likely already than Vick does. He’s not going to try to win games with his legs. He’ll take off to avoid sacks (as I would hope we’d want him to), but otherwise he’ll run the offense.

    With Flynn on the bench it’s a great situation. Considering where this offense was at this time last year, my goodness, we’re light years ahead.

  56. “Jackson performed admirably in that situation and actually gutted out a couple of wins while being destroyed and eventually hobbling through the rest of the year injured.”

    Give me one game he “gutted” out a win. Just one. We won the AZ game (win1) in spite of him, not b/c of him. Sure, he didn’t have any turnovers, but he didn’t “gut” out a win there either (especially scoring 13 points at home). He left the Giants game in a tie. That doesn’t count. We got a bunch of kick-off turnovers (great scoring position that he couldn’t turn into TDs) against Baltimore. No way he “gutted” out that one, especially when they were the ones coming back late. When you beat the Rams by a million points twice, I’m not sure how you “gut” those wins out if you’re Tarvaris. Or if you beat the Eagles and Bears by a bunch of points and your defense and/or special teams is scoring points, I’m not sure how you “gut” out any wins there either.

    With that being said, Tarvaris Jackson never “gutted” out one win last year. He rode the coattails of a great running game, top 10 defense, and a defense/special teams that scored a bunch of points (hell, Sidney Rice almost had more passing yards in one of those wins in the first half than Jackson did – I think it was the first Rams game and I’m not sure they qualified as an “NFL” team). As I’ve said a bunch, I can’t remember (since ’07) a Seahawks schedule that was ever any easier. This years teams is going to be a lot better, but they have to be. If this years team could play last years schedule, it’d be good for a lot more wins.

  57. RDPoulsbo says:

    Yep. Still crazy. The team is about to play real football and you’re still more interested in an unnamed player 8 months from now. Once again, only fans of losing teams are excited about the draft when actual football is about to start. This team is not one of them.

    If Flynn gets traded, it will be after the season when other teams are interested in getting a starter and have the full offseason to learn their offense. In the meantime, every other team already has a starter and are full go.

  58. All the fighting over which QB is the best is moot right now Wilson is the starter until he’s not the starter.
    He’ll make mistakes as do all QB’s not just the rookies.
    Remember it only takes 1 play, which could even be in practice and the back up may be the starter. I’m glad we still have Flynn.
    Don’t really care what he makes thats up to the Seahawks.
    We have what appears to be a pretty good QB situation right now where both our QB’s look to be as good or better than the rest of the QB’s in the division.
    Just excited to get the season going only 3 weeks till the Home Season opener.

  59. FleaFlicker says:

    Maybe this is rose-colored-glasses land, but everytime I read about the disaster known as the AZ Offense, I get giddy. That being said, AZ does have a pretty nasty defense. Seems like a great challenge for a rookie QB in his first game. Our defense will keep the game close, we’ll just need 17 points to win.

    Discuss…

  60. yankinta says:

    RDPoulsbo, you are a small-time guy, you think small and you want to win one game or have one successful season. It’s not your fault. It is what it is and you are what you are. There’s nothing wrong with it.

    Me??, I’m a big-time guy. I think big. I want to win a ton of games, not just one season. I want a DYNASTY. Therefore, I think about the future as well as the present. And yes, it can be done. Look at the Patriots and Steelers, a couple of other DYNASTY Teams…. again, that’s not my fault. I can’t help but think big and use my assets to build a Dynasty…. :) )

  61. Dukeshire says:

    KD – I see what you mean. Misunderstood…

    neklok – There are a lot of smart, motivated, and athletic QBs that come out every year. The fact is however, there are no short cuts to adapting and learning in the NFL. Some of the greatest QBs in history have struggled, badly, their rookie seasons. My post is meant to temper some of, what are fast becoming, unrealistic expectations. Even if Wilson becomes an “elite” QB in this league, he’s going to look bad, at times this year.

  62. Dukeshire says:

    RD – Ditto that…

  63. yankinta says:

    Dukeshire, read my last comment to RD., again, it’s not your fault either…. :) )

  64. Dukeshire says:

    I saw it, and see the flaw in it as well.

  65. yankinta says:

    I bet, you do. :)

  66. yankinta says:

    Of course. I’d bet you do. :)

  67. RDPoulsbo says:

    Whatever you say yank. Just keep on playing that Madden in Dynasty Mode and pretending it’s the real thing.

    As for AZ, they are looking at QB in a position of weakness. Enough so that heads will roll by season’s end. Even if they expected improved play by Kolb or Skelton, they didn’t properly address the glaring hole they knew they had there in the offseason.

  68. yankinta: “I guess, I’m crazy for jumping out of my couch, screaming like we just won a playoff game…”

    Yeah. Ain’t football great?

  69. yankinta says:

    lol, I’ve never played Madden or Fantasy Football League,,,not that there’s anything wrong with it. And you shouldn’t put down those people that do play those games…, we’re all different in our own ways. we should try to find good in people, instead. :) )

  70. chuck_easton says:

    I’m back to trying to be a voice of reason and not chicken little as I was last week.

    I just wanted the QB situation settled and it is. We go with the kid, and we have a very good backup who showed he can start. Flynn did nothing wrong. Wilson just did everything right.

    That being said, I am concerned about some of the posters here who now have Wilson as not only the best rookie QB but proclaim him one of the best QBs in the league. Whoa there. Back up the bandwagon.
    Why don’t we wait and see how Wilson performs when he’s facing top 10 defenses in game situations where the other team is actively scheming to stop Wilson.

    We can all be hopeful that he handles it well. We will all be rooting for him as he is our QB and looks like he can be here for quite some time. But he’s not a reincarnation of Unitas, Montana, Brady, Rodgers, Mannning, Elway…

    What’s going to happen the first time Wilson proves by his rookie mistakes and rookie decision making tha he is really human and not a QB immortal?

    Wilson will make mistakes. Wilson will have games where he can’t read the defensive disguises. Wilson will have games where he has more interceptions than TDs

    To say this isn’t being anti Wilson and it isn’t sour grapes that Flynn didn’t get the nod. I’d be saying the same thing if the QB depth hart was reversed.

    I just can’t fathom the people on here that pretty much have Wilson I the HOF and in the superbowl before he ever plays a regular season game.

    Calm down people. Wilson may be great some day. But at this point he’s a rookie that hasn’t played a down of NFL football that counts.

  71. chuck – I agree. At some point this season, I believe Wilson is going to do something to suck and maybe cost us a game due to inexperience (as Matt Hasselbeck did before him as our only “real” QB prior) no matter how optimistic we are right now. Wilson is in a great situation (as Flynn would have been) with respect to having a great run game, a great defense, and a (hopefully) healthy Sidney Rice, which makes his WRs good, too (and w/Winslow, great, IMO). I’m going to have his back, as I would have had Flynn’s back in that case. We’re all in this boat together and we need to stick together. No matter who Mr. Happy picked as his starting QB, we all need to board the train together and be supportive (Flynn or Wilson; now it’s Wilson).

  72. MarkinSeattle says:

    A couple of thoughts, although some are long so you might want to skim.

    I agree that Russell Wilson is a rookie. But he definitely has a good ability at finding open receivers. When he threw the ball to first team receivers against KC, it just seemed like there were a lot more guys open. Perhaps KC has really bad defense, but more than likely it was a reflection of him finding the open receivers and throwing the ball where they can get open. That is what I was most impressed, we will see what happens when things get turned up a notch in the regular season.

    I expect the Seahawks to use the game plan from Big Ben’s rookie year. Don’t ask Wilson to throw the ball a lot, pound it as much as possible and limit the number of throws. If that is the offense that manifests itself, then I think we will set ourselves up for a good year. If we ask Russell to throw for 250 yards per game, then we will see a lot more rookie mistakes, and those mistakes will likely cost us a game or two this year.

    The thing that has impressed me the most about the Carroll/Schnieder regime is there ability to find great talent both in the draft and off the scap bins of other teams. I don’t recall another coach in Seattle who managed to dig up this much talent in so short a period of time. More impressive are the guys that have been signed as unheralded 4-6 year players (or traded for a 6th or 7th round draft choice), that have emerged into a top 15 player in the league at their position.

    In the past, we would see some late round draft picks stick around as backups for 3-5 years. Every once in a while, one of those guys would step into a starting role and become an average player. There were even 1-2 guys who emerged into Pro Bowlers (Rufus Porter comes to mind). But for the most part, those late round draft picks never amounted to anything more than a backup or possibly an average starter (and the hit rate for even that was low). We never really saw a guy with great speed emerge after 3 years into a top player (once again, except Rufus Porter).

    Under Carroll, my expectation is almost the exact opposite. He churns through so many guys and creates so much competition, that if they cut a Lockette (great size and fantastic speed), it doesn’t really bother me. They will bring in more talent next year and I feel like someone is going to emerge. I am no longer pinning my hopes on the good talents putting it together after a couple of years, because the churn rate is so high that I feel that the Hawks will find a great talent if that guy can’t put it together. Where before we had backups who were serviceable and in some cases had the potential to start, now we have backups who are pushing the starters for playing time, even the pro bowl players (Thurmond is a good example at CB when he comes back).

    The hit rate on the drafts have also been impressive. Sure, not every guy drafted makes the team, but it seems like the talent that we have picked up in the draft is even better. I don’t know if Wilson, Turbin, Wagner, or Sweazy will ever be Pro Bowl players, but it wouldn’t shock me if someday they did make the Pro Bowl either. Sweazy in particular sticks out to me. He is raw and misses his assignment on occasion. But he has manhandled his opponent at other times and I have noticed that he gets to the second level quickly and does a great job engaging LB’s. Turbin looks comfortable and could easily end up pushing Lynch in a year for the starting spot. Wagner has great speed, and once it clicks, could end up being a beast. It also wouldn’t surprise me to see Scruggs and Howard make the team (Howard is more likely a practice squad guy, but he has flashed some ability).

    I don’t know how good this team will be, but with the parity in the NFL these days, I think that Carroll and Schnieder have done a great job churning this roster and filling it with talent across the board. Normally I would say if we don’t have any injuries, then we could…but we have so much talent that we are probably more capable of weathering injuries than just about any other team.

    This is going to be a fun team to watch this year. Not because we will be one of the top teams in the NFC. Rather it will be a fun team to see who emerges. Given the last two years, I am expecting to see 2-3 guys we didn’t anticipate step it up a notch and push the bubble to make the Pro Bowl. Perhaps it will be at OL, or it could be at LB, DE, or even WR. Seeing this team grow in this regard will be the most enjoyable aspect of watching them.

    I do expect us to make the playoffs, from there, who knows?

  73. F everyone that buys seahawk tickets for $55 and turns around and tries to sell them for $200 when I’m online at 10 am trying to get cowboy tickets, but wait there’s none available, oh except all over stubhub, ticket exchange, and ebay for 300% mark up. I thought that shit was supposed to be illegal, this is the second year in a row this has happened to me, WTF. Sorry, rant over.

  74. pelanderjj says:

    I wish that Flynn could of had the same reps that Wilson did in the preaseason, with the same players that RW played with. I still question whether or not Flynn got the same opportunity that RW did? RW has played great and no one disagree’s with that but I think there is more to Flynn’s abilities that we haven’t got to see and regardless of his playing time you cant argue with the NFL experience and knowledge he has picked up in GB for the past 3 or 4 years. I am concerend with how many “growing pains” we will have to endure with RW. I hope this works out for us!?!

  75. “I don’t know how good this team will be, but with the parity in the NFL these days, I think that Carroll and Schnieder have done a great job churning this roster and filling it with talent across the board.”

    Yes. I think Mr. Happy realized (not that he didn’t know this prior – easier said than done) at USC that it’s easier/fun to beat teams w/superior talent. However, you have to have the “buy in” talent, too.

    I think he and Bo have done a great job at getting here! Now, we’re in for a great ride…

  76. Flynn was fine/solid in the pre-season. The fact that he had to force feed Eldorado was his undoing in game two. One is now out of a starting job and the other out of the NFL. That’s the way it is (unfortunately for Flynn; who cares about Eldorado?). But there’s no denying that Wilson stepped up above and beyond where nobody can’t be jacked about him being our guy from now on…

  77. TruBlue – I agree, it’s frustrating (any game/event). If I come to a game (which is now more of a probability w/the Jackson trade), I’m going to get them from scalpers.

  78. As fans we have the right (obligation?) to be reactionary. I have probably unfair hopes and expectations for RW–but I don’t care.

    Bone-headed plays aren’t exclusive to rookies. I think his learning curve will be sharp. Someone made the point that just because something happened before (or hasn’t) that it never will or wont happen again. Rules are constantly being broken by exceptions, and I think our rookie QB will play well.

    Still–kudos to those slowing the roll of the crazies (bless ya!) who are frothing about draft picks and our new Suber Bowl MVP quarterback.

  79. boy tickets are hard to come by, I hate ticketmaster interface. got 2 standing room only for GB. but wanted the SF game also.

  80. RDPoulsbo says:

    When I’ve had to buy tickets, I’ve had 3 or 4 phones going on redial with another 3 or 4 browser sessions refreshing. I’ve always been able to get tickets to the game I wanted, but it really is a pain. I also agree about the StubHub markup people, but they’re not the ones calling in for the single game tickets. They are the ones who get 10 or even 20 season ticket accounts just to resell for profit. May all of those types of season ticket holders rot in hell.

  81. Got two from ticket exchange for the home opener for $340, sec. 330 row Q, face value $110 for the both of them. What a joke.

  82. Chuck, I get your point, but how can you state so definitively that he will not be like Brady, Rodgers, or Montana?
    RW has not played one regular season game yet, none of us know for sure how it will play out.
    I just watched an interview with Montana and Rice, and the thing that struck me was that neither was thought to be a future great coming out of college. Work ethic, being a perfectionist, ambition and desire to get better and be the best at what you do along with innate talent are more accurate indicators of a player’s potential.
    And remember that Brady was a 6th rd pick not many had on their radar, Montana was a 3rd rd pick many thought had a weak arm. Even Rodgers was passed up by 23 teams, including the genius niners who selected A Smith ahead of him. So while it’s way too early to anoint RW the second coming, by the same reasoning we can not rule out that he may turn out to be extremely good, either, based on the evidence thus far.

  83. SandpointHawk says:

    Come to think of it, that was the only good thing (besides Tez)about being a fan in the early 90′s. I could always get great seats to any game.

  84. I was on the phone with 2 browsers open and could only get GB tickets, go figure I thought they would be the hardest to come by.I wanted the Jets and the Dec SF game as well.

  85. HeinieHunter says:

    Listened to a couple of on line interview and I’m really pissed about Hugh Millen referring to Russell Willson as a “Teachers Pet”.
    That demeaning to the entire coaching staff, front office, and Wilson. Normally I find him entertaining, even if he has a huge ego, but if he is so perceptive why isn’t he a coach…..probably because he is more hot air than astute evaluator.

  86. jchawks08 says:

    lol yank. I always joke with people about their opinions being wrong, but in your case, you couldn’t be more wrong! Yes, you are indeed crazy. The ‘Hawks need crazy fans too though, so you’re still alright in my book.
    BobbyK still annoying with all the T-Jack hate… The more things change the more they stay the same. Give it a rest, man. Noone cares anymore.

  87. Dukeshire says:

    Carroll had an interesting interview on Sirius XM, just now.

  88. Bobbyk–In 1992, Seattle had THE BEST defense in the NFL. (A guy nickamed Tez had 14 sacks as a DT and won Defensive Player of the year as well) And I believe Chris Warren ran for 1500 yards despite our qb’s being so bad we barely completed 2 passes to WR’s in an entire game. THAT qb situation was far worse, because those guys SUCKED SO BAD they made T-Jack look like Joe Montana. That team had the best defense I have ever watched, as well as a good run-blocking line and Warren, who really was special–especially that year. So it isnt true that our other awful qb’s from back in the day lacked great D and a top-10 run game.

    Youre usually a good dude, but I have to say that I am glad T-Jack is gone because it means you will soon stop the endless, overly exaggerated T-Jack trashing rants.

    I suppose now you’ll begin ragging on Portis, who has done nothing wrong since before becoming a Hawk! LOL, Im happy for you though, and its gonna be great watching Wilson tear it up!

  89. SkeleTony says:

    I agree with BobbyK about T-Jax. I fully understand why some, including Pete Carroll and the former Vikings coach (already forgotten his name) were excited by TJ’s arm and thought maybe with the right coaching he could be great, but unfortunately he just never had the starting QB gene. He could not make the right decisions or win games.

    RW has won me over now and I am getting on the bandwagon, though I fully realize that we could be in for shocking disappointment come regular season. It IS POSSIBLE at least that his great preseason does not transfer to a great regular season NFL career, even if unlikely.

    But this talk of trading Flynn for an LB or some such is absurd and in no way ‘thinking big picture’ and for yankinta to try and characterize those he disagrees with as ‘small picture’ thinkers, as if THAT is the reason they are disagreeing with him, is childishly small thinking.

    Critical thinking is your friend. Learn how to think critically.

  90. Hugh Millen=major douche. Why anyone listens to a guy who sucked as a backup in the NFL is beyond me.

  91. Duke – can you give us any snippets that we may find interesting?

  92. SkeleTony says:

    STTBM: I agree that Portis looks like a very good and possibly great QB to develop but is unfortunately not going to get the chance. There is a small part of me that kind of wishes both RW and Flynn would get injured just so we could see Portis get a chance but don’t anyone take that statement and run (the wrong way) with it. Yeah Portis could be another T-Jax…a QB with a great arm (and better size/strength) who cannot win games but I would have liked to see him get the chance.

  93. Tjack bashing…old (he’s gone now)

    Whining about Flynn having to throw to TO and losing the starting job (old as well…TO is gone)

    Having to read about mindless redundancy (yep, old again)

    Reading all the boo-hooers, negative nancy’s, skeptics that want to remind us to manage our expectations, that he’s only a rookie, blah, blah, blah…and essentially are still enjoying a rather large piece of crow…

    PRICELESS

    :-)

    Doubters…keep doubting. You’ll come around eventually and we’ll be waiting for you.

    GO HAWKS!

  94. SkeleTony says:

    STTBM, you are wrong about the Seattle defense in 1992. We did NOT have the #1 defense that year. We had the #17 defense! The N.O. Saints had the #1 defense that year.

    http://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/1992/opp.htm

  95. SkeleTony says:

    Ack…1991. In ’91 we had the #8 defense and N.O. still had the #1 defense. So my apologies for that but still…

  96. SkeleTony says:

    Ack again! I was right the first time! we were talking about 1992 and not ’91.

  97. Well, actually it was the number 10 ranked defense in 1992. The reason YPG is used instead of PPG is because PPG can be inordinately impacted by a bad offense with a lot of turnovers and bad field position.

    Anyone remember the Chargers game at the end of that year? The Chargers had barely scored and Gelbaugh went crazy with the turnovers and then the Chargers put up a bunch of point in the 4th quarter.

  98. VNHLNFAN says:

    Hugh Millen is still upset his shower buddy mora was canned.

  99. SkeleTony says:

    Fair enough pabuwal but we still weren’t “The BEST”.

  100. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Now with a chain moving qb or defense has a good chance to be top 5 or better.

  101. I once watched Hugh Millen QB in person. It was as ugly as it sounds.

  102. Skeletony–We had the best defense in the NFL, perhaps the best defense EVER, in my opinion. The metrics used for ranking defenses are flawed–giving up the fewest yards isnt a good metric, as really good teams that go up several td’s go into prevent D and allow yards…Points allowed is also not a great metric, for the same reasons. Im sticking with my assertion.

    Seattle’s D was incredible that year, and most knowledgeable NFL watchers that year knew they were the toughest D to play in the NFL. They were on the field almost the entire game, as the Hawk “offense” often failed to pass midfield, and had more 3 and outs than I could count. Yet Seattle’s D kept the score close, (usually less than 14 points allowed if I remember correctly), and really made other teams work for thier points.

    Had they had even an average offense, this team would have won a Super Bowl just like Tampa or the Ravens of later year.

    The stats wont show it, but that was one hell of a defense.

  103. Portis may get some playing time against the Raiders if Flynns arm pain lingers.

    I like Portis, and would love to see him play. He looked realy good last year in his preseason appearance. He doesnt play like a scrambling qb–he is a real pocket passer who can move and run if need be. And he has a really good arm. Whats not to like?

    Perhaps he’s had trouble learning the offense or reading NFL defenses, and thats why he hasnt gotten more of a look; or perhaps Carrol isnt playing him becuase he doesnt want anyone to know he has a diamond in the rough. Who knows?

  104. jchawks08 says:

    What was I saying about people’s opinions being wrong?
    STTBM, as long as you believe it, who are we to judge your state of mind?
    First thing I remember about that ’92 season is beating Denver on Monday Night. For one night, Gellbaugh was gloriously just good enough to eek out a victory.

  105. ruminator1 says:

    man, bobby your TJ obsession is really unbalanced (in all senses of that word). Reminds me of the guy who was always blabbing on about Curry. And at least in his case, Curry was indeed a bust. But TJ was far from the insult you make him out to be. Didn’t have some of the requisite talent, not for top notch QBing. But he was a gamer, a really good teammate, did some good things. I forgot–were you one of those who loved Charlie W? Sort of brings up the exchange a few yrs ago about the bet not paid off.

    On Millern–he was a decent QB, had a lot of yrs as a backup, just not good enough to start. I hate his politics and personally I doubt we’d get along at all. And really, some of his football opinions, while fill;ed with damn good technical knowledge, are filled with bias. He uses his technical knowledge to support bias. Nevertheless, he often makes comments that make one think and he does understand a lot about the game that most of us have no clue about. Even Warren Moon makes some good knowledge statements even if his announcing skills are barely above Ron Fairly’s.

    On attending a game: would be fun to get a block of tickets for a game next year. We could argue in person and tip a few.

  106. yankinta says:

    jchawks08, why am I wrong? you gave no reasons., only assumptions…. are you another small-time guy like most of the people in this blog??

  107. Dukeshire says:

    HawksKD – Sorry, I was at the gym when it was on:

    re. Wilson running: The thing that impresses him is that he doesn’t run to simply run like other “athletic” QBs. He always keeps his eyes downfield looking to make a play with his arm.

    re. Sweezy: Although Moffitt’s back at practice today, we might be looking at a “Wally Pipp” situation. To him, Sweezy is the story of camp. Even over the QB situation. He and Cable have “no idea” ho he’s transitioning so quickly.

    re. TO: He worked hard, is in great shape, but ultimately didn’t add enough over some of the younger receivers’ potential. They have his number should they need him during the season.

    re. Irvin: Best game so far on Friday. Was close to 4 sacks and has shown great progress the past couple weeks. Still toying with where to play him, although he’ll remain in all their pass situation packages.

  108. Dukeshire says:

    What’s with all the “small-time guy” cracks? You think they can trade Flynn for a second and you’re questioning the mentality of others?

  109. yakimahawk says:

    Where is the the link to the bradshaw comment or what did he say?

  110. RDPoulsbo says:

    I wouldn’t waste anymore time on him Duke. He’s reached troll status. He posts nothing of value that are constantly trying to instigate inane off topic crap. In other words, a troll.

  111. Duke I’m a little surpsied by your comment about Wilson keeping his eyes down field, looking to make a play when he runs… I thought nearly the exact opposite. While I am drinking the koolaid and love this kid, my impression has been that he tucks the ball and runs…period. Not that it is a bad thing, but he definitely doesn’t look to be making a play with his arm (i.e. throwing it). Seems to me when he makes up his mind to run, he tucks it in to protect it and he runs! That said, I loved his fake pitch to the RB on one of his scrambles Friday night.

    One thing I continue to say is that I hope he can throw more accurately to his left on the dig routes and other timing routes. I’m still waiting to see accuracy that direction. I fear defenses may start forcing the issue to see how he does throwing left. If I were game planning for him that’s one of the main things I’d do…force him to go left.

  112. jchawks08 says:

    Carroll stated that Irvin had almost 4 sacks? I know he was very active and was certainly trying hard. Still though, he has not one single measurable stat, am i right? No sacks, no tackles, no assists, no passes defensed… I’m hoping for the best for this guy.

  113. Dukeshire says:

    Skavage – Those are titbits from what Carroll said on Sirius XM NFL, this afternoon.

  114. jchawks08 says:

    Skavage, I believe Duke was paraphrasing Carroll’s thoughts that he heard on the interview..
    I have to agree that Wilson runs very smartly. He doesn’t force his runs. I think he fully intends on passing 1st unless the play calls for a bootleg. He is a rookie though so if he doesn’t see anything within a few moments he will look to run. Not a bad thing right? 29 yards a carry on Friday.. I’ll take that. Not to mention his other long runs this preseason. I belive there was a 30+ td run.

  115. jchawks08 says:

    I think the thing I’m most amazed about Wilson is the fact that there are absolutely zero training wheels. There’s no dinking and dunking with this guy. So often with rookie QB’s, even 1st rounders, all you see are screenplays and swingout to the RB patterns. If you’re lucky a couple of slants and maybe 1 out pattern a game is called. With Russell, he has seemingly has the complete playbook at his disposal. To me, it truly is amazing. It really is hard to temper the excitement for this guy and this team.

  116. RDPoulsbo says:

    The almost 4 sacks thing is a big of a stretch. Irvin did play much better in this last game though. PC not having his role set yet for the pass rushing situations is a little bit worrisome. He had all of the offseason and TC to figure that out. It’s getting a little late to be experimenting.

    We will see a lot more bootlegs with Wilson. I’m pretty sure we’ve heard that from PC before about taking advantage of his skillset.

  117. yankinta says:

    Yes, I do think that Matt Flynn is worth a high draft pick. Yes we will trade him this year before the deadline or in the off season. I trust that if John can get a 6th round pick for T-Jack, he can get 2nd or 3rd rd pick for Flynn, if not better…

    I wasn’t questioning, I was assuming cuz he sounded like some people who think small,,… :)

  118. chuck_easton says:

    joreb,

    Again, you missed the point. I’m totally on board with Wilson. But I also know he’s a rookie and there will be mistakes. Doesn’t mean I’m not behind him and it doesn’t mean I’m rooting for him to fail.

    What it means is I won’t be breaking my leg jumping off the bandwagon when he has his first really bad game. He’s going to, no matter how much you think he’s god and can do no wrong.

    He’s still a rookie who has not faced a team like GB or NE who will be putting together defensive packages specifically designed to confuse him.

    Wilson isn’t an elite anything, yet. He’s a rookie who we are all hoping will turn into a great QB. But I’m not ready to anoint him HOF status after a couple of pre-season games. You are, and that’s great. I can’t wait to see what you have to say after Wilson lays his first egg.

  119. SandpointHawk says:

    Our QB dollars aren’t out of a line at all. When was the last time we had a QB start 16 games let alone 19 or 20? Best back up in the NFL? Well I will take that any day… and as someone pointed out the bonus money is gone already and the performance money is now a moot point.

  120. bbnate420 says:

    jchawks08, QB pressures is a measurable stat.

    This will almost certainly be a 6th round pick now that they released VY, if health is not prohibitive. Good job, PC/JS. A 7th for Ruud and 6th for TJack. 2 players that weren’t going to play.

    May we PRETTY PLEASE WITH SUGAR ON TOP retire the TJack talk from now on. We’ve all repeated our stated positions ad nauseum. Saying it’s beating a dead horse at this point would be underselling it. :-(

    I preface this by saying that I do like RW and think he will be a franchise QB some day, but ALL rookie QBs go through some struggles. For those who don’t understand why some of us aren’t ready to completely anoint RW yet or say that he will be a pro bowler this year, here are some stats for the QB rating of top rookie QBs in recent years:

    Matt Ryan 87.7

    Cam Newton 84.5

    Andy Dalton 80.4

    Joe Flacco 80.3

    Sam Bradford 76.5

    Brett Favre had a 85.3 rating after sitting his first year, and then his rating dipped to 72.2 in his second season starting. Aaron Rodgers probably had the best season ever for a first year starting QB at 93.8, and that’s after he had sat for 3 years.

    PS, I know that QB rating doesn’t give the whole picture of a QBs’ play, but it’s the best way without me writing a paragraph about each one.

  121. SandpointHawk says:

    Chuck I’m one of your fans but I got to ask on GB and NE comment, why is it we should fear a couple of the the worst defenses in the NFL (last year at least)?

    http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef

  122. chuck_easton says:

    Sandpointhawk,

    To explain the money paid to Flynn:

    6 million signing bonus (pro-rated at 2 million a season over three years)

    2 million guaranteed salary in 2012

    2 million in incentives tied to him being the starter. (not likely to reach them now).

    total payout:

    2012: 4 million guaranteed
    2013: 2 million guaranteed + salary if he’s on the roster.
    2014: 2 million guarnateed if he was on the 2013 roster. zero if not on the 2013 roster (2013 then just has a 4 million salary cap hit).. + salary if he’s on the 2014 roster. BIG salary in 2014 so likely won’t be on the roster unless something happens and he’s the starter. More likely it will just be a 2 million hit if he’s cut or traded in 2014.

    Flynn will be on the roster for 2012 – so total 4 million this season. Same price we would have paid TJack and we get a better backup.

  123. bbnate420 says:

    I forgot to mention that Cam Newton’s QB rating is especially inadequate in measuring his play since he is a dominant runner.

    Clark Judge is a retard.

    I want some of whatever you’re smoking if you think they’re going to trade Flynn this year. PC/JS aren’t going to leave themselves with 2 QBs that hadn’t thrown an NFL regular season pass before 2012 as their starter and backup. I’m sure they’d sign some veteran scrub if that actually happened in some fantasy world but still.

    Chuck, you make some very good points, but I’m not sure why you chose NE and GB as your example defenses. They were 2 of the worst defenses in the league last year. Billicheat is a master game planner though.

  124. jchawks08 says:

    Haha thanks for the reminder on rookie QB’s Nate420.. I keep going through the emotional ringer here with Wilson. One hand, he looks like everyone’s All-Pro, then on the other he’s still a dang rookie and we can’t expect greatness from him this year. Which irks me because I’d hate to see this team being held back because of his rookie-ness..
    And last I looked, there’s no stat for QB Pressures on the back of football cards. I know what you mean though. Pressures equal hurried throws, which leads to E.T. pick 6′s. :D

  125. chuck_easton says:

    Sandpoint,

    Just picked those particular games because those are likely the two teams that will come to CLink with the best records. SF is another team that I fear from a defensive standpoint, but I think we have the D and enough O to pull those games out.

    The GB and NE games are going to likely turn into last team with the ball wins type games and if there is going to be a potential chink in Wilson’s armour it will be in a game where we have to match another high powered offense point for point.

  126. SandpointHawk says:

    I believe I said the salary was not out of a line…

  127. chuck_easton says:

    Sandpoint,

    And I agree with you. That was for those people that are raging that we should have traded Flynn and kept TJack as the backup because he was so much cheaper.

    The 2012 price tag is the same for either guy, and we kept the better one.

  128. jchawks08 says:

    Thank you for breaking it down for those people, Chuck.

  129. bbnate420 says:

    No problem, jchawks08.

    I’m not sure if QB pressures if an official stat or not. Probably isn’t. Highly subjective, although so are tackles, and they are an official stat. Many places record QB pressures.

    Excellent point about the ET pick. The pressure definitely helped Cassell make a bad throw that play. I thought the Hawks actually were getting some pretty good pressure that day, but Cassell did a great job of avoiding nthe rush on a number of occasions.

  130. SandpointHawk says:

    Last man standing NE and GB…oh I agree. SF defense I agree. What you typed…and it must have been a misstatement. Don’t worry we all do them once in a while…

    “He’s still a rookie who has not faced a team like GB or NE who will be putting together defensive packages specifically designed to confuse him”.

  131. SandpointHawk says:

    Any people who say we should trade Flynn over T Jack are on hard drugs or 16 years old. I’m logging off because by the time I type something a clarification has been typed and I don’t want to add to this negative vibe that has been going on for weeks.. See you tomorrow….

  132. jchawks08–You can debate my mental state if you so choose. I can back up my opinion at great length, using logic. But in the end, its simply my opinion. Which is 90% of what you’ll find on blogs, as you know.

    I remember those games in 92, and how the announcers were amazed at what our defense did, despite being onfield 80% of the game. They raved about it, in depth, and some of those guys were ex-NFL’ers. While the stats show us as middle of the pack, the reality was far different. As I said, that was one feared and respected D, regardless of how it looked on the stat sheet with yards given up/points/etc.

    That years defense is a prime example of how stats can outright lie at worst, and at best are merely a flawed tool used to analyze.

  133. Chuck Easton–I hear what youre saying. Its unlikely Wilson plays anywhere near as well in real games as he has in preseason, at least not for a good while. However, barring a total collapse, Im happy to sit back and watch this kid grow and take charge.

    We have only had this happen three times in Hawk history–having a pretty good idea that our qb of the next 6-10 years is just beginning his Era. (We were duped into thinking Mirer was, but he wasnt…) That happened with Zorn, Kreig, and Hass, but not like this, not in thier first couple preseason games, especially not as rookies. (Well, Kreig was ready but Knox wouldnt start him until Zorn lost some games and was obviously pathetic and done, several weeks into the season).

    I think its awesome to have a young guy at qb with so much excitement, and Im gonna ride the wave until it crashes, knowing full well that it will. I also know Wilson is the kind of kid who will bounce back, and will only get better.

    I dont expect him to make the Pro Bowl, but hell, he might! We’re 0-0 right now and Wilson is the next great qb! (I can dream, right?!)

  134. Dukeshire says:

    A defense like GB, who led the NFL in interceptions last season, becomes so much better when teams are forced into a shootout, which most are (as evidence, the turnovers). That is not a good recipe for a rookie QB with limited talent at receiver. And before people get carried away, I’m not predicting a loss. What I am saying is that simply noting that because GB has, by some measure, a poor defense, that Wilson, and Seattle by extension, will play well. That’s folly and the NFL doesn’t work that way. Capers will show Wilson packages and disguise schemes in ways he has likely never seen. He’s young and it will happen a lot, this year especially. And because he is smart he’ll learn from those experiences. But let’s not be too dismissive of any team they will play. There’s a reason they lace ‘em up, and not let statistics determine outcomes.

  135. freedom_X says:

    Remember that teams with explosive, high scoring offenses rarely, if ever, have top defenses statistically. High scoring teams cause the other team to try and match with their offense, which boosts the numbers against the defense.

    Conversely, low-scoring teams (like the ’92 Seahawk team) have their defensive numbers aided by an inept offensive unit. Opposing offenses don’t have to open up the playbook and push the ball to keep up. They can sit on a modest lead and play very conservatively, knowing the other offense has little chance to match.

    Wilson has yet to see the most elaborate, multiple, disguised coverages and rush packages. Hopefully the Seattle defensive staff is giving him a good taste of that. No preseason opponents are showing any of that stuff.

    The keys to a successful 2012 season (9-7 or better) will be how fast can Wilson grow to keep up with the game-planning he’s going to see, *AND* if the offensive line keeps trending upwards, particularly in pass protection.

    If the protection doesn’t get better, even than it was late last season, then it will be tough for Wilson to deliver this year. A bad pass pro line can ruin a young QB and get him into bad habits. The defense and running game would have to be totally dominant to overcome poor pass protection. The protection has be at least mediocre, which it *may* have been by end of season last year (but maybe not.)

  136. MoSeahawk12 says:

    Ok guys, 2012 Seahawks season is right around the corner. Wilson wins the job and we have a very solid backup in Flynn. The odds are we will need both for a deep playoff run. Our situation at QB is better than it’s been in years, maybe ever. When Holmgren flipped back and forth between Dilfer and Hasselbeck we basically had two QB’s with similar abilities. Both played well, Hasselbeck won more games and took as to the Superbowl, but neither was as dynamic as Wilson is now. Flynn reminds me of Hasselbeck in that he’s smart, anticipates well, competitive and given the opportunity will play well for us. We now have two QB’s that will win many games this year and well into the future. The national media is jumping all over Wilson starting. When was the last time ESPN or any of the media ran weekly Seahawk stories? This year feels like it can be special. Agree with freedom_X that the o-line needs to deliver better protection and keep Wilson intact. I think Russell Okung is a great left tackle, but am a little concerned as he seems out of position in the preseason games so far. He’s been beaten around the edge a lot and we are lucky the refs haven’t called more holding on him. He seems slightly off. I’m sure he can turn it up when the real games start.
    I agree with any above comment regarding T Jack. It’s over, he’s gone, let it go. We don’t have to worry about him making or not making plays for the Seahawks anymore. The next time we mention him is Dec. 16th when we play the Bills. Let’s hope he doesn’t start due to injury and have one of those games of his life days against us…….Nah, not likely. Here’s to starting 1-0 against AZ and building a 10+ games winning season!! Go Hawks!!! Enjoy every second of Seahawks football. We should see some cool things this year.

  137. @Duke… Thanks for clarifying. I didn;t read all the previous posts…doh! :) (I was wondering why the odd formating at the begining of each line.)

    Still, I think he looks down field as long as he can, but once he makes up his mind to go, he goes. I like the fact he tucks the ball in close. It will help him avoid turnovers when/if he gets hit from behind.

  138. Dukeshire says:

    No worries. Usually I try to include it all together but I was at the gym when I was listening.

  139. HonHawksLSB says:

    I am so tired of hearing all the so called ‘experts’ talk about how much the Hawks are paying for the back up QB. Has anyone thought about the fact that we are paying our starter $750k a year? I don’t have all the contracts for all the QBs in the league, but I have to imagine RW is the lowest paid starter in the league.

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