Seahawks Insider

Morning links: Clemons loses out on $1 million

Post by Eric Williams on July 19, 2012 at 7:25 am with 68 Comments »
July 19, 2012 7:25 am
St. Louis Rams quarterback Sam Bradford (8) fumbles the ball after being sacked for a 6-yard loss by Seattle Seahawks defensive end Chris Clemons (91) during the third quarter of an NFL football game Sunday, Nov. 20, 2011, in St. Louis. The Seahawks recovered the ball and went on to win 24-7. (AP Photo/Seth Perlman)

For disgruntled Seahawks defensive end Chris Clemons, skipping the team’s minicamp in June because of his unhappiness over not getting a contract extension just got more expensive.

Clemons, in the final year of his contract, initially lost $173,000 in fines and workout bonus after skipping the mandatory minicamp.

However, according to a report by Brian McIntyre of NFL.com, because he skipped the mandatory minicamp, Clemons forfeited a $1 million base-salary escalation in his contract.

Clemons’ production in 2010 to 2011 triggered the additional money to his 2012 base salary.

So, instead of earning $4 million in base salary this year, Clemons’ salary has rolled back to its original $3 million, with an additional $800,000 available in an incentive tied to sacks.

Clemons and the team still are in negotiations on a possible extension, which the team hopes to get done before the start of training camp. The players report to camp July 27.

Clare Farnsworth of Seahawks.com previews the defensive line and the offensive line.

KJR’s Ian Furness and Jason Puckett hosted a Seahawks roundtable, with the Seattle Times Danny O’Neil, John Boyle of the Everett Herald and Eric Williams of The News Tribune joining them to discuss all areas of the team. You can check out the audio here and here.

Chris Mortensen of ESPN says that he believes it’s possible Marshawn Lynch escapes without missing a game due to the DUI charge in this video link.

Former Seahawks head personnel man Tim Rusekell joins Tennessee’s scouting staff. Ruskell worked with Tennessee general manager Ruston Webster and COO Mike Reinfeldt while in Seattle.

Peter Schrager of Fox Sports writes that league commissioner Roger Goodell has been awfully quiet amid all of the arrests during the offseason.

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  1. Dukeshire says:

    Man, must be awfully nice to be able to turn your back on a million dollars. lol. Goodness, just show up with a “tweaked hammy” or a “sprained ankle” at least, stand on the sidelines and collect your money.

    Eric, any word on what the contract holdup is? Is it simple dollars or is the length at issue, or something else? Thanks

  2. RDPoulsbo says:

    I still think Clemons is handling this situation rather poorly. He’s under contract this year and there’s few options outside Seattle, so I’m not sure why he thinks he can play hardball. The Hawks are his best option even after his current contract is up so why do things that could potentially poison the well?

    Oh how Ruskill has fallen. Must be tough to report to bosses that once were under you. Judging by his draft picks, I’m guessing the socuting job isn’t going to go very well either.

  3. Dukeshire: Nothing new to report, other than I believe the Seahawks would like to get something done before training camp starts.

  4. mojjonation says:

    How dumb can you be to skip out on what is roughly 25% of your salary? He may be able to run down QB’s but he sure isn’t the sharpest tool in the shed when it comes to economic decisions. Are there any words on any horizons if anyone else is interested in him? I haven’t heard any rumblings or rumors, but I don’t think anyone is knocking down his door. Step up Chris and show Bruce how it’s done. If not, instead of playing with you, he will be playing for you.

  5. tchristensen says:

    Clemons needs to have a discussion with his agent if he hasn’t done so already.

  6. iHateHarbaugh says:

    Man, I’m glad I’m not a Titans fan if Ruskell is going to have say on who we draft. Matt must’ve told them… right?

  7. Yet another over paid, mentally deficient athlete.

    Cutting off his nose to spite his face. Good thinking there, Chris.

  8. GeorgiaHawk says:

    “Clemons, What were you thinking? I could have used that money!” I had a party planned for one day!” Says Pacman Jones.

  9. Let it rain!

  10. Hammajamma says:

    I’m sure he’s calculating this will be covered in a contract extension. Either they redo this year entirely or negotiate it back in. It only hurts him if they can’t get a deal done.

  11. Southendzone says:

    Darn, one poster said the obvious and just before me too. Good job hammajamma but I’ll repeat it anyways.

    This is ZERO loss to Clemons at all. If he is in the mindset of “I’m not playing out my 2012 contract year w/o a new contract”, then this missed escalator is meaningless. He’s not giving up 1M, he’s just getting an extra week off work and will end up with the same pay in the end after him and the Hawks come to an agreement.

  12. Soggybuc says:

    I doubt this was a route his agent wanted him to take. I’m no expert(as if that matters on the Internet right?) but I think most take around 10%, so his agent just lost out on a 100,000.
    I’m betting his agent is kind of pissed off.

  13. Clemons should understand he has more value here with the 12th man and playing against ARZ, Rams crappy O-Line twice a year. His numbers while impressive are clearly at least partially inflated

  14. Ewalters7354 says:

    Chris Clemons wants to get paid but was willing to forfeit a million bucks?Wow!Not doing himself any favors there.I hate that the Hawks are beginning to have issues coming into a season we are expecting to see major improvement.It’s not time to be selfish knowing that the Hawks take care of their players(ala Red Bryant and Brandon Mebane).Knowing that I would think he plays put this final year and give the FO a chance to reward him.But obviously not…

  15. Ewalters7354 says:
  16. bbnate420 says:

    Very good point Hamma and South, we will find out fairly soon.

    I have posted my view a number of times. Ultimately, I just hope they get something done to keep him here for 2012-2013 at least. He deserves more than what he is currently getting but, also must be realistic about his age and scheme diversity IMO.

  17. Dukeshire says:

    I don’t see how this is a zero loss to Clemons. If Seattle were to add that million on to whatever contract they (presumably)come to an agreement on, that would be one thing. But it seems unlikely that if they agreed on say, a 3 year $25 million, that Seattle would tack on the $1 million he forfeited by missing the mandatory camp. No, that money is gone, and whatever extension is a separate financial circumstance.

  18. The deal that Cameron Wake got in Miami is what’s messing everything up with Clemons. I’ve always hated the Dolphins, now more than ever.

    Clem ain’t being real smart on this situation. If his holdout goes into training camp and by chance the Hawks have a few people that can fill his void, he’ll be sitting on the sidelines with a franchise tag waiting for him when he gets back.

    IMO he’s a product of the system and granted there are other systems similar to ours, he really got his break here. It’s all a business, I get it, but IMO he’s displaying poor form.

    Oh well.

  19. bbnate420 says:

    Maybe I read the new CBA wrong but, from my reading, I gather that he must report 30 days before the start of the first reg. season game.

    “A player shall not receive an Accrued Season for any League Year in which the player is under contract to a Club and in which he failed to report to such Club at least thirty days prior to the first regular season game of that season, or in which the player thereafter failed to perform his contract services for the Club for a material period of time unless he demonstrates to the Impartial Arbitrator extreme personal hardship causing such failure to report or perform, such as severe illness or death in the
    (b)
    family. The determination of the Impartial Arbitrator shall be made within thirty days of the application by the player, and shall be based upon all information relating to such hardship submitted by such date. The determination of the Impartial Arbitrator shall be final and binding upon all parties.”

  20. Hammajamma says:

    Duke, I’m not an NFL agent, but negotiated a number of contracts and renewals. I presume the agent would find an easy way to make him whole on the forfeiture, whether that’s through adding it back into to this year’s base (essentially getting the team to honor the original terms) or seeking added value in signing bonus or other guarantees. If I’m the team, I agree to comp it, but add it to a future year base salary. So they negotiate it. But in the end, the player should not percieve a net loss over the life of the pending deal because he’s getting new revenue that far exceeds his current rate. How you parse it out becomes less important.

    With a big dollar negotiation like this, it’s going to be hard to play apples to apples with this piece. Ultimately the only thing that matters is if everyone is comfortable with the new comp package.

    My point really is that I don’t consider this a brain fart on the part of the agent. It’s a gamble, but that’s part of positioning yourself in a negotiation.

  21. “The Miami Dolphins and pass rusher Cameron Wake agreed to a four-year, $49 million contract extension over the weekend, according to ESPN’s Adam Schefter. The deal includes $20 million in guaranteed money. Additional contract details were unknown on Sunday morning.”

    Clem wants the same.

  22. bbnate420 says:

    Actually, this applies to the first 3 years of an NFL players’ contract. May not apply to players with more than 3 years accrued. Not sure?

  23. bbnate420 says:

    If Clem expects 12 mil a year or 20 mil guaranteed, I believe he will be disappointed and should be. I like him but, he;s not worth that much IMO.

  24. Ewalters7354 says:

    I definitely don’t think Clem is worth that type of money Cameron Wake received.20 mill guaranteed is well over what he is worth IMO,so if Clem is expecting that type of money he may want to think again.I agree Joreb he indeed is a product of the system.Prior to coming to the Hawks a lot of people had no clue who he was,not to mention how some thought he wouldn’t even make the team when he got here.3yrs 20 mill with about 10 guaranteed would be a decent offer.Not to mention Cameron Wake is a few years younger than Clem and and also a more consistent player.

  25. Dukeshire says:

    Hammajamma – That’s fair, and perhaps they reality. I guess it’s fair to say that I’d be surprised to learn they would tack that original million back on. However, this, “Ultimately the only thing that matters is if everyone is comfortable with the new comp package.” is spot on.

  26. bbnate420 says:

    3 years 21-24 mil seems fair to me, Ewalters.

  27. RDPoulsbo says:

    The accrual of eligible years is meant to keep rookies from holding out. By giving up a year of accrual, it makes their UFA status 1 year longer. The only other thing effected would be for pension issues but that’s more important to the lower paid players.

    Quite frankly, I don’t think he’s worth Cameron Wake money or a franchise tag next year. He’s a niche player that brings little value in most other systems around the league. He may be good in Seattle, but there’s little market for him elsewhere. There’s also a lot of guys who happens to be a lot of guys coming back from IR that can fit that position. With guys like Kam and Earl becoming FAs over the horizon, they can’t be throwing big money at 32 year old players and screwing up the cap down the road.

  28. Ewalters7354 says:

    bbnate, that’s a pretty fair number to me also.We are definitely on the same page lol

  29. Hammajamma says:

    Locking up $20mm for a 32 year old seems contrary to their operating philoshophy. I think the team has the leverage, and I’d be surprised to see them ink a deal like Wake’s unless it’s weighted toward performance metrics. Give the dude $500k for every sack.

  30. RDPoulsbo says:

    PC has already outright said Irvin is being groomed to be the Leo in 2013. He’s the 1st round pick thats quicker, faster and younger. Even if he didn’t say it, Irvin has to take over that role next year given the PR battle the team waged the week after the draft.

    That leaves Clemons as the nickel pass rushing specialist at best. Given his age, the team really has to stick to their original offer. Even that offer IMO is too much.

  31. raymaines says:

    I don’t see CC making more that Red Bryant. Not this year, next year or any other year.

  32. Southendzone says:

    The reason why the 1M is meaningless is because he wants a new contract and I’m making the assumption they will arrive at one.

    So the scenario is:

    Clem is currently under contract for another year at $3 million, if he reported it would have been $4 million.

    Clem will NOT play out this contract and will agree to some new contract which will pay him a new higher salary. He has a # in mind, the Hawks have a # in mind and it’s really independent of the OLD $1M escalator clause.

    It makes no difference if he’s forfeiting a 3M salary that he thought was too small or a $4M salary that he thought was too small. He had no intention to play out 2012 at either of those new rates.

  33. Southendzone says:

    Sorry for double post, but to make it more clear. Is there any difference to Me or You in these 2 scenarios?

    1) Tomorrow, i’m NOT going to give you $10
    2) Tomorrow, i’m NOT going to give you $20

  34. chuck_easton says:

    Can I get the $20 on Saturday instead?

  35. Dukeshire says:

    Southendzone – You’re presuming he’s willing to sit out the year. If he does, and they are unable to reach a new deal, then perhaps that reasoning makes so sense. But if he shows, and plays 2012 under the old contract (either he gets no new contract or an extension doesn’t take effect until 2013) then he forfeited a million. In either your or my scenarios, there is a lot of presumption at play here to know anything for certain.

  36. bird_spit says:

    Yeah – a year with out pay, and a year of experience for his replacement. Sounds like a loosing strategy. In a year, will he be in playing shape? For certain, he will be a year older. His stock will be down. His best bet is to take whats on the table or play his current contract. If I am him, I would be staring into my agents eyes, and telling him to get it done or I’d change agents.

    Southendzone – too funny, but true if he has leverage. Next year, he has none.

  37. chuck_easton says:

    Duke and Southendzone,

    Just to throw a further monkey wrench into the mix. Clemmons can’t sit out this season if he wants to be a FA next year. He would still owe the team one more year pursuant to his contract and he’d be playing 2013 for the 3 million he would get this year.

    His only options are to come in and play for three million or agree to some new deal.

  38. I very much appreciate having attorneys and well-to-do’s on this blog that can break down contracts and explain them to me in simple terms.

    Thanks.

    And Clem is a fool if he thinks he’s gaining any leverage with all of this.

  39. Dukeshire says:

    chuck – Absolutely agree. That’s why it’s baffling to me that he’d pass up a “free” million. I know players do it fairly often, but when you have no leverage as Clemons doesn’t, it makes no sense to me.

  40. GeorgiaHawk says:

    OK- Let’s just say that this thing drags on far to long. If it does, (and that’s a big if,} do you think the Seahawks would consider trading him? And what do you think they could get for him? Anyone?

  41. http://beargoggleson.com/2012/07/08/nfl-power-rankings-pre-training-camp-edition/

    11. Seattle Seahawks (7-9) Somebody can dominate the week NFC West and the Seahawks have one of the best running backs out there if he can stay focused after signing his big extension in Lynch. Last season they didn’t have a quarterback, now they have the one game legend in Matt Flynn. If he’s close to as advertised the Seahawks could fly deep into the playoffs.

    I about crapped my pants when I saw the ‘hawks ranked at #11 in the preseason rankings.

  42. Soggybuc says:

    Hawk’s take: we’ll give you a modest raise and back load the contract because you will be cut before/after 2013

    Clem’s take : PAY me NOW! because you cutthroat douches will cut me after/before 2013

  43. bird_spit says:

    Soggybuc, I think you nailed the summary. Hawks would probably want him as insurance in case the project called Bruuucce fails or if Irvin is injured. Hawks need to get it done too.

  44. chuck_easton says:

    And Seahawks response:

    Play for our modest raise, play for 3 million or retire…you still owe us a year.

    Clem can’t even pull the nasty hang nail that keeps him out for the season trick because he’s playing for a contract in 2013. Nobody is going to give him the kind of money he thinks he’s worth in 2013 if he doesn’t produce on the field in 2012.

    Check and Mate for the Seahawks.

    Clem can show up week 10 and make $1.3 million (3 million pro-rated for the 7 or so games he’d play) and still get full credit for this season.

    But again, what team is going to give him big bucks next year if he only plays 6 or 7 games this year.

  45. Hammajamma says:

    It’s an interesting game. Clem is weighing playing for $4.5, and having to work his ass off again while risking injury for a shot at being 33 year old FA. Even if he has a great year, his value may never be higher than right now. That’s part of the equation for his agent, along with a big comparible contract that potentially drives up the numbers. They want to force a deal now and withholding services is their only play.

    Negotiations are often about assigning risk to the other party. Most of the risk is on Clem right now, so he’s got to force the action. The one play he can’t make is to sit out or not sign a new deal. He won’t get Wake money, not because he’s not a comparible player, but because he doesn’t hold the hammer. Just the way it goes. I’m confident something will get done because he can’t substantially improve his position. His only option is to make All Pro after coughing up $1mm in salary.

    The team, on the other hand, played the Irvin draft card acknowledging his age and potential free agency. But, and this is a big one, they know how important he is to winning today and they desperately want to win today. He fills a role as a pash rusher that would quickly turn to a weakness without him. The debate comes down to years and future value, I think. How far down the road do they see him as a double digit sack man?

    Clem will settle because he has to. The team will pay him high dollar because they need him. In between is just guanteed dollars. The team needs to have the option to get him off their books in two years and pay him enough to get that done. I think 3 years, $21mm with $12 guaranteed is market value, under the circumstances.

  46. owenbytheway says:

    oohhhh, deep sigh!!!

    three years ago we didn’t have anyone of this caliber on the team (i.e., we could not have landed a Hawk on an all NFC-West team).

    Hammajamma gotz it pretty well figured, methinks. $21 and $12 over three years gives both the player and the team insurance.

    Yes, that million will not be lost … only the mini-camps … as the deal will be done within two days of the start of camp.

    The “team” does not have all the leverage because a disastrous year this year would put PC and The Schneid on the hot seat. They have done too well, too quickly, to jeopardize that … and not getting this guy signed is a bad “if” they can avoid.

    It also goes to performance. Yawns, when Clem came here. A mediocre big guy at best. He’s earned his bread … and he can’t afford to take a chance on free agency at his age if the Hawks put three years on the table.

    So this has been a lot of sweat about nothing seriously changing except speculation by outsiders.

    Both sides know the dance, and, make no mistake, they are partners, at least for this year’s prom, so they’ll drop a few more dimes to clear the floor for at least next year.

    Well thought out and expressed by all the posters herein. You got the rest of the local yokes and jokes and yokels out eveythinged.
    And, of course, the national speculators.

  47. GeorgiaHawk says:

    If I were the FO I would drag the negotiations out as long as I can and see who may step up that can replace his production. If someone does step up I would ship his A$$ back to the Eagles for a 3rd round pick!
    If no one does step up, sign him to a two year contract.

  48. freedom_X says:

    I’m not sure the Cameron Wake deal was at all a decent one for Miami. I think they overpaid actually. But when one person overpays, other people take that as setting the market. If Seattle pays Clemons the same kind of money, then it definitely becomes the market.

    It’s better to let a player go one season too soon rather than one season too late, unless that player is a team legend. In that case, it’s good to be able to send them out in an honorable fashion. But Clemons isn’t a Seahawk legend, despite his play. Think Raheem Brock here.

    I don’t really think Clemons has much leverage because, to most people’s eyes, he’s not a long-term building block.

    If he really wants Wake money, he’s going to end up playing out the year and then leaving Seattle acrimoniously. He’ll be as motivated as ever this last year since he wants that monster paycheck in his next contract. The front office knows it, and thus they’ll stick to the offer they think is fair.

    I don’t think Seattle’s front office will panic and overpay. I don’t think they’re in desperate save-my-job-win-now mode, which is the only think I can see that would panic them into laying out a market-leading contract.

  49. bbnate420 says:

    I don’t think Clem holds out if he doesn’t get a new contract by TC. We will find out 9 days from now!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I am a believer that Irvin will be a good player but, he hasn’t played a down yet. He hasn’t replaced Clemons’ productivity yet. I bet they draft a player to pair with Irvin in the 2013 draft, provided Irvin works out and someone like Dexter Davis doesn’t quickly develop.

    The only leverage Clem has is if he holds out and the Hawks struggle to mount a pass rush. The same as in 93, if I recall correctly, when Emmitt Smith held out and the Cowgirls went 0-2 to start the season. They caved after that.

  50. I still don’t think that Clem is going about this right – The team looks WAY better in this order.

    They have not bad mouthed him – they have said positive things about him. They have been willing to renegotiate, which they haven’t done with other people.

    What has Clem done – mope and not show up

  51. Soggybuc says:

    Clems productivity was pretty much Ho and Hum until the trade. he is less a product of talent and more a product of system.
    KKCYLHANL!!!!!!!

    League is full of decent players who can post pedestrian numbers for 6 or 7 years and then look great for 2 years. Clem is decent but he ain’t that special.

  52. 4 sacks vs STL and none in the 2 most important games of the year – just sayin

  53. GeorgiaHawk says:

    All these arrests this year and now the mighty Quinn has been popped!

    So much for Goodells Social Discipline program. Just let the judicial system take care of it for crying out loud!

    http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/8181362/st-louis-rams-defensive-end-robert-quinn-charged-drunken-driving

  54. Macabrevity says:

    I used to be a bit of a gym rat and honestly didn’t know anyone into lifting that ever boozed it up, much less drink and drive. It hampers circulation, especially in the legs. Any serious weight lifter wouldn’t compromise all that work put in.

    These NFL guys, and the level of athleticism and training needed to compete much less excel, it really surprises me how careless they are in terms of maintaining a proper health regimen.

    If I made money with my legs, and the amounts they’re making, I wouldn’t risk it for alcohol.

  55. mojjonation says:

    Clem has no leverage. There is no market for him. He lost a million and he will not be getting it back. He won’t get Wake type money and he is for sure not worth a franchise tag. This, quite frankly, may be the dumbest move made by a pro football player, ever. There is some sarcasm in there, but this was a bonehead play on his part.

  56. bayareahawkfan says:

    Re: Robert Quinn’s DUI, sadly I think this hurts Marshawn’s chances of escaping Goodell’s harshest. The more similar things happen, the more likely Roger is to feel he needs to make an example of these guys, to amp up the “deterrent” effect of these rules.

    Which is really the point of the punishments being in the CBA in the first place – to provide sufficient deterrent to cause players, as much as possible, to think before acting in these situations.

    The more incidents, the less the effect appears to be, the more he’ll feel the need to reinforce the policy with strong penalties.

  57. Dukeshire says:

    I’m curious how much of this goes back to my original question to Eric the first day of mini-camps he no showed for; to paraphrase: are his feelings hurt by Seattle drafting Irvin? Few things cloud judgement like pride. Although that’s where his agent ought to come in and check him. But the fact is, it’s so difficult to know what their strategy is and what conversations they’ve had with Seattle.

  58. Great point Duke. You know…Marshawn and Clem seem to be ‘wired’ a little differently. Lynch seems pretty eccentric where Clem is just flat out angry (which seems to help on the field). Whereas some athletes can be just as down to earth as anyone, it seems as though the a significant number of uber talented folks require a little extra attention/babysitting/coddling…see TO, Ochocinco, etc. The egos of a lot of these athletes are almost 2nd to none (World leaders, movie stars aside). I just wonder how they’d be conditioned if they were to be paid ‘normal’ wages like the majority of the rest of us. I’m sure we’ll never know, but couldn’t help but to think aloud.

  59. chuck_easton says:

    bayareahawkfan,

    Now we can add Kenny Britt to the mix. DUI. Multiple run-ins with the law. Avoided suspension last year.

    Problem is either Goodell has to hit them all hard or he has to let them all go. He can’t suspend one but not the other. That would indicate some sort of favoritism.

    I am betting it means there will be suspensions. The question is when. As stated, the California legal system could take up to a year to get the matter to trial. If Goodell is going to wait for a conviction or a plea to a lesser charge Lynch may get to play this year, but he’d be looking at the punishment later.

    The law abiding citizen in me says, if he did the offense he deserves the time out. The fan in me says next year would be more convienent for the team.

  60. NYHawkFan says:

    I agree with mojjonation, that when negotiating a new contract, it’s all about leverage. By drafting Irvin, Clem’s leverage was compromised. Imagine your company hiring some new kid fresh out of college that had similar skills during the middle of your contract negotiations. Wouldn’t you be ticked? The writing is on the wall. Seahawk FO is essentially saying: “Clem, see how easily we can replace you?” After hoping to capitalize on having a good season last year, scoring a big contract is now much more difficult. No wonder he’s mad.

  61. So it is looking like we are going to have to find other ways to improve our pass rush without having 2 stud DE’s, although – I actually don’t think Clem is a stud but very good

    Yeah – you can see the writing on the wall that Irvin will eventually replace you but have you noticed that the top DL’s in the NFL have non starters that are good enough to start on other teams. But this is clearly a selfish move, by a guy not interested being part of a TEAM that is trying to win

  62. chuck_easton says:

    joreb,

    I think you are on to something. My son’s football coach jokingly told me last season that my son is too nice and he has too supportive of a family for him to be a good D lineman. It was suggested, in jest, that perhaps we could start daily beatings around my house to get my son more angry.

    Again, all in fun, but it does seem like the guys that thrive in the NFL are the ones that come from troubled past. You never see the guy that was raised in a happy loving middle class or upper class family that come into the NFL. Well except possibly kickers and QB’s.

    I only wish these guys would realize that once you ‘make it’ you can leave the ghetto behind. I’ve seen black cops catch alot more flack in the projects than the white cops because thay had ‘sold out’ and weren’t keeping it real anymore. I can only assume that NFL players that came from the wrong side of town (regardless of race) have some feelings of guilt that they got out.

    That’s why they have their entourage. I don’t know about you all, but I was raised in a lower middle class family in some very poor neighborhoods. Now that I have two University degrees I don’t see the need to bring my old gang to the office as my personal groupies.

    That, along with better money management, is where the NFL could and should be helping these guys out better.

  63. Hammajamma says:

    Duke,

    You’re right, but I still can’t believe his agent would allow him to make a $1mm prideful mistake. They are being quiet, which may indicate a certain amount of restraint and calculation on their part. I still think this deal gets done. But if he holds out into training camp, look for the Hawks to float glowing reports about Irvin, regardless of his development.

  64. bird_spit says:

    Lets hope Irvin remembers that it’s the Seahawk training camp, not the Wash training camp. We need him in camp if Clem is not there. Someone has to make the guy a redskins jersey, and hang it in his locker.

  65. dirtbiker_joey says:

    Chuck, I disagree that you have to grow up in a rough neighboorhood or have a chip on your shoulder to be successful in the NFL. Dane Looker grew up a few blocks from where I live in middle-class Puyallup and went on to a very nice career. Brandon Gibson grew up down the street, and I see him playing hoops at the Y all the time – he’s a really nice kid. Chad Eaton is another middle-class Puyallup kid who had success in the NFL. I’ll leave out the Huard brothres since you exempted QBs. Anyway, there are a lot of great stories of professional football players making it despite their circumstances, but I would bet there are more who came from middle-class backgrounds than from poverty.

  66. Pay him to a modest contract or don’t pay him at all and let him hit free agency. Like someone posted earlier, we want to win here and now, it’s about the here and now. Well we got him for the here and now, and can find his replacement for next season after this season

  67. bayareahawkfan says:

    Chuck, regarding your Kenny Britt reference, ouch.

    I don’t like it, but I can’t see how – unless the Lynch charge is dropped entirely – Goodell fails to give him less than 4 games, per your comment about setting the bar for everyone, as this recent spate of problems has cropped up.

    Heck, even if charges are dropped, I don’t see Goodell giving him a pass, based purely on principal.

    I guess we’ll see.

  68. owenbytheway says:

    Deep sign changes to yawn.

    Several posters realized there were bennies to each side, and leverage held by each side.

    Still think HammaJamma’s $21 with $12 guranteed for three is about what will show in details tomorrow.

    I can’t see the forest over the heads of the o’linemen, even though I could at Wisconsin where the front line was taller than most in the NFL … but that is another matter.

    We’ll soon see if Clemmons stayed in shape.

    412 guranteed for

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