Seahawks Insider

Morning links: Hawks get thumbs down on draft class

Post by Eric Williams on April 29, 2012 at 11:05 am with 88 Comments »
April 29, 2012 11:05 am
ESPN's Mel Kiper Jr. (AP Photo/Gail Burton)

Yes, we know that the Seattle Seahawks’ 10 draft picks haven’t even played a down of football. But why bother with that important fact when we can make a rush to judgment in grading this year’s draft class?

And so with that, we take a spin around the national media and their opinions on Seattle’s draft class this year. And as you can imagine, with Seattle making unconventional draft selections like Bruce Irvin in the first round and Russell Wilson in the third, it’s not good.

Seattle experienced the same thing last year when draft experts felt they reached on James Carpenter and John Moffitt.

Here’s what ESPN’s John Clayton has to offer in rating the Seahawks as one of the losers in this year’s draft.

“When Luke Kuechly went to the Carolina Panthers at No. 9, you knew the Seahawks would bail on the No. 12 pick and trade back. The problem is whom they selected at No. 15. A lot of teams didn’t have LB Bruce Irvin in the first round. Some didn’t have him in the second round. Pete Carroll felt having Irvin along with an additional fourth- and a sixth-round pick was better than staying at No. 12. The Seahawks would have been better served by continuing to move back and get more picks. If they are right on Irvin and his motor, great. But if they are wrong, they didn’t get value back for their trade.”

And ESPN’s Mel Kiper takes it a step further in giving the Seahawks a C-, tied for the lowest grade given a team in the draft. Kiper gave Seattle a D- minus for value. You must be an ESPN Insider to view this. Kiper: “Let’s be clear: I think the Seahawks drafted guys they really wanted, and with a plan in mind for how to use them. They moved down once, and may have gotten worried that someone would take Bruce Irvin late in the first round if they didn’t get him at No. 15. Again, you have to find the right dance partner to move around the board. But we’re still talking about a player I had a late second-round grade on. I wouldn’t be surprised if Irvin gets 10 sacks in 2012, but that’s really his game. He’s not a three-down player yet. Bobby Wagner fills a need at linebacker, but he’s another guy who would have been around later on. Russell Wilson is a great test case for shorter QBs, because he has everything else, but did they need him in the third round after grabbing Matt Flynn to come in and likely start? I had running back as a need, and Robert Turbin could help out. The needs were met outside of wide receiver, but in terms of maximizing value, there are huge questions. Again, this is a grade of the draft process, not the players alone.”

Pete Prisco of CBS Sports gives Seattle a C+ grade. Prisco: “They made a questionable move at the top with Irvin, bounced back by taking Wagner, but then took Russell Wilson in the third when they just signed Matt Flynn. Why? They did some good things on the final day, but Irvin is the key.”

Clark Judge of CBS Sports listed Irvin as one of the five biggest gambles in the draft. Judge: “ I have no problem with the Seahawks taking him with the 15th pick … so long as it was the 15th pick of the second or third rounds. Irvin is strictly one-dimensional, a pass rusher who isn’t in starting and isn’t interested in playing special teams. He has his own set of baggage that has been dissected over and over, so I’m not going there. Let’s just put it this way: I don’t know anyone other than the Seahawks who had this guy as the 15th player on their board.”

Rob Rang of NFLDraftScout.com gives Seattle a C grade overall. Rang: The Seahawks pulled one of the real shockers of the first round with the selection of passing rushing specialist Bruce Irvin at No. 12 overall. At 6-3, 242 pounds, Irvin is too small to be a traditional 4-3 defensive end but in head coach Pete Carroll’s scheme, size isn’t as important as speed for the right defensive end (or LEO) position and Irvin certainly has that. Drafting a specialist at No. 15 is a stretch but despite boasting a very good defense on first and second down a year ago, Seattle’s lack of pass rush has killed them in recent years. Few will call Irvin’s pick a reach a year from now if he ranks among the rookie leaders in sacks. Second round pick Bobby Wagner’s versatility and reliable open-field tackling skills could earn him a spot in the starting lineup as a rookie.”

Tony Pauline of Sports Illustrated believes both Irvin and Wilson were reaches.

Mike Florio of ProFootballTalk.com provides the most realistic grades for every team because a game has not been played – incomplete.

Here’s my story from today, focusing on Utah State running back Robert Turbin joining Seattle.

Clare Farnsworth of Seahawks.com goes into more detail on the adversity Turbin dealt with growing up in Freemont, Calif.

Dave Boling of The News Tribune writes that Seahawks defensive end Bruce Irvin can now repay all the sacrifices his family made to get him through school now that he’s in the NFL.

Here’s more on Seahawks sixth round draft pick Northwestern State CB Jeremy Lane from his hometown paper, the Alexandria Town Talk in Louisiana.

Categories:
NFL Draft
Leave a comment Comments → 88
  1. SeahawkGreg says:

    Let’s see…who knows more about what this team needs and who they think truly fits their system: Hot airbags like Mel Kiper or media guys like John Clayton, or the general manager and head coach?

    We got kudos for drafting Aaron Curry once upon a time. That goes to show you how silly these immediate post-draft grading things are. People second guessed the choices of Chancellor, Wright and Sherman as well. One made the Pro Bowl last season, one has a chance to this season, and the other is a very solid and diverse LB.

    At least Kiper finally admitted that the Seahawks are unconventional are are plugging players into their own unique spots.

    I could care less about draft grades and analysis, as much as I don’t care about mock drafts and predictions beforehand. If they haven’t figured out by now that this front office is going to do the unconventional, then they are clueless. Most of the positive development of this team the last few seasons has been after unconventional moves (Moving Red Bryant to DE, trading for Marshawn Lynch with his question marks, signing Brandon Browner and starting him right away, wringing a 10-sack season out of an almost washed up Raheem Brock, plugging in no-names to the offensive line with success).

    Time will tell.

  2. seahawk44 says:

    You can’t legitimately judge any draft class until after at least 3 seasons.

  3. Dukeshire says:

    44 – Exactly. These grades from the “experts” are about as meaningful as their mock drafts were.

  4. Overall, I’m happy with the draft.
    All of the pass rush prospects had flaws, and I’m glad they picked Irvin, who has the potential to dominate off the edge.
    I don’t care if he can’t play every down… we don’t need that. If he can contribute on passing downs, this pick was totally worth it.

    I was a little upset that they passed on a receiver (like Hill) in the second round, but mlb was a need, and Wagner sounds like he can step in and start for us right away.

    All in all, a lot of great athletes. A lot of speed.
    We did pass on some interesting o-line prospects, but all in all, I’m excited about this draft.

  5. Mel Kipers just a douche. Who cares what he has to say. It’s all opinion anyway. Everything these scouts and reporters have to say is neither here nor there in my books. Lets see how these guys fit into the Hawks system and go from there, maybe?!

  6. I’m surprised with kipers final notes…. Not as demeaning as I was expecting……. Actually maybe his words will enlighten those that aren’t in the know.

    Indeed unconventional… Guess what… It’s working.

  7. Why even put a picture up of that old antiquated “spurt”. I never look at his stuff.

  8. EyeAmBaldman says:

    Todd McShay is even worse than “helmet head.” I love how ESPN calls them “experts” as if they know what they’re talking about.

  9. Dukeshire says:

    I actually don’t hav a real issue with Kiper. He’s a better talent evaluator than most want to give him credit for. But McShay? He really doesn’t seem to have a clue. I put zero stock into what he says.

  10. Macabrevity says:

    Kiper’s comments actually make more sense than the rest – don’t know why everybody hates him so much. I enjoy watching the draft, and enjoy watching Kiper since he’s been part of the experience since I started back in 1984. I don’t agree with him, but the comments are a lot more logical than say Clayton who states “A lot of teams didn’t have LB Bruce Irvin in the first round. Some didn’t have him in the second round” Clayton and the others are looking at this like it’s a mock draft game, and the winner gets the most and highest rated players. The fact is it only takes one other team to have Irvin graded in the first round, and then if we pass, we lose out. Irvin might just be the best player we could’ve drafted overall, period… so to play the game and possibly risk losing him vs. making sure we lock him up… what good is that? We picked up a couple of extra picks and got our guy. Nuff said.

  11. Good thing our FO doesn’t put much stock in what these guys have to say. What matters is who is on each team’s boards. It would be interesting to know how the word gets around during the draft that this team or that team is going to take someone so you better act. I don’t know the behind-the-scenes aspect of the draft process but it would fun to know how it works.

  12. I as well respect Kipers opinion… I just can’t stand his cocky attitude.

    He has a habit of expressing himself passionately even when he doesn’t know what he’d talking about. However he’s not above changing his view after being enlightened…

    On second thought he may just be every TNT blogger… Including myself…

  13. Tennhawkfan says:

    If Kiper is such an expert, why is not a GM somewhere, just saying.

  14. I like Kiper. He’s my favorite draft analyst. However, we disagree on Bruce Irvin.

    And I could care less what all of these talking heads say about Irvin. I like him and that’s all that matters in my world. It’s a 179 degree difference with how I feel about his pick vs. Carp over Carimi last year (DeCastro would have been the 180 degrees:). Yes. Last year I was pissed, but this year I’m pleased and could give a rip less what the “experts” grade the draft.

    And, really, if he’s “only” a 1-trick pony that will get double digit sacks this season, who cares? Isn’t that what we wanted and demanded?

    Now, if something happens to Clem, at least we’ve got someone who I think we can count on to give us pressure.

    If Dexter Davis can be what I think he can, we may have a great pass rush with actual depth, instead of only one player that can get after it.

    Gotta love Turbin. He’s already one of my favorites!

  15. I guarantee that Kiper would make a better GM than some of the clowns running teams. I bet Kiper would have done a better job than Ruskell in those 5 years and he spent over 20 years in the NFL.

  16. Southendzone says:

    Yep, excited about Turbin, not excited about the Seahawks becoming the new Raiders on draft day. I guess with Oakland having no 1st rounder someone had to fill that void.

    “Ummm cause he’s fast” is now our new #1 driving factor in drafting players. Thanks Petey.

    Again Irvin might turn out great but like Kiper said, we didn’t get maximize the value for our picks, that’s my biggest complaint.

  17. If we could go back in time and draft Tom Brady in the 2nd round, imagine how much fun people would have made of you with that “reach.” If Irvin can get after the QB this year to the tune of double digit sacks, then you take a guy “too early” and be happy about it. There’s no guarantees he would have been available where he was supposed to be available, so if you believe in him that much, you take him early instead of potentially missing out on him. They got the guy they wanted AND still got an extra 4th and 6th round pick!

  18. mkniffen says:

    I feel much better about this draft now that Kiper doesn’t like it. I like the speed in this draft and the fact that we are continuing to build the D. This team is starting to remain me of the old Steelers – a bruising ground game, a quarterback who won’t make mistakes (I hope), and a killer defense.

    BTW for all you folk who wished we could have kept Holmgren as our GM, look at the Browns draft this year and count your blessings.

  19. Macabrevity says:

    And what’s with everyone knocking a one-trick pony anyway? Especially if that trick is getting sacks and hurries…. oh wait, isn’t that two tricks?! Irvin can actually contain on the outside pretty well too from what I’ve read.

  20. These evaluations are a joke, but why not get praise for having a plan, knowing what you want and picking players who fit into that system? I guess 10+ sacks this year isn’t a good pick? Get out of here, Kiper, if your first round pick gets double digit sacks his rookie year, while still being pretty raw how is that worth a C-..

  21. JMSeaTown says:

    Todd McGay is clueless… I’d love to look back on these “experts” locks of the decade and see how they’ve panned out

  22. JMSeaTown says:

    Todd McGay is clueless… I’d love to look back on these “experts” locks of the decade and see how they’ve panned out. Nerdin out for a second, but fantasy football is somewhat similar, draft guys you love regardless of where they’re ranked b/c they may not be there when your next pick comes up.

  23. I was pretty upset that we just missed out on Kendricks in the 2nd, but then got Wagner in the following pick. I’d never heard of him before the Senior Bowl, but took notice of him there during the game and he ended up with MVP for the North’s Defense. He should be pretty solid and an upgrade to Heater–hopefully he’ll play with as much heart.

    Somewhat of a shock to me was when they took Wilson in the 3rd. I honestly had ignored him, like everyone else, because of his height. He did not look very impressive in the Senior Bowl, but he didn’t do anything wrong either. Now that I’ve had more time to go over his game tape, realize that his numbers were better than Luck’s, and watched this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmH3JhGeIU0&feature=BFa&list=PL6E24D45DC523335E
    I can’t wait to see what happens in Training Camp. His seems VERY sharp too, next to T-Jax, Wilson looks like Hannibal Lecter.

  24. Dukeshire says:

    Time will tell, of course, but after spending a good portion of the weekend watching clips and reading what I could about Irvin, calling him a one trick pony is a false narrative. He plays a lot stronger and plays the run much better than he gets credit for.

  25. “And, really, if he’s “only” a 1-trick pony that will get double digit sacks this season, who cares? Isn’t that what we wanted and demanded?”

    Right, it’s a stupid complaint, and has quickly become the go-to “analysis” on the guy – – Deon Sanders couldn’t tackle, and stunk against the run game – I guess locking down the other team’s #1 receiver was his one-trick.

    I like the pick too. So what if he’s not a 3-down guy to start – lack of pass rush on passing downs was our D’s biggest weakness last year.

  26. Classic! I love Jon Gruden BTW, especially the part about these fools giving him a headache.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ja2LQqnTDck

  27. Soggybuc says:

    LOL, yep one trick pony! sure is a nifty trick though!

  28. I think Irvin is going to be the starting Leo in ’13 and an every down player. He may do the 1-trick pony thing this year, but I love our new Clay Matthews moving forward at a full timer.

  29. Soggybuc says:

    To clarify, what was the ONE thing we wanted for the D? uhmm, ok sure BI is weak against the run? last I checked our run D was beyond solid heading into the draft.

  30. Remember now, Irvin has had VERY little coaching at this point in his career, he’s said himself that up till this point he’s just been running, going off instincts alone and look at his production, just look at the number of sacks based of INSTINCTS and physicality, think what he potentially could do wile being coached by someone like Carroll, who is pretty fantastic at putting together a defense. If Irvin learns some stuff, and keeps it simple, not over analyzing situations, he could be a freak for us, I really think he could. As with all picks, he might not pan out, but I commend this front office for having a plan, and going with guys they think will get them the furthest, let’s be honest, it’s worked out pretty good so far on defense at least, Irvin will hopefully be another piece in that puzzle. Chow, chow, time to eat some QB’s!

  31. NWPoseidon says:

    I love everyone’s obsession with the concept of “value.” What makes a pick good “value?” Is it good value if the pick could be taken the next round? What if that pick turns out terrible, is that still good value? Or is good value getting a player who becomes a starter or pro bowler, no matter where you took him? Shouldnt value be based upon production and not draft slot? If Bruce and Wagner turn out to be starters (or better), and Wilson and Turbin develop into quality back ups (or better) and we can reap the benefits of their play, is that not good value for 4 picks? Will it matter if they were taken in the 1st or 2nd when they are sacking the QB and intercepting passes? 10 years from now, if they are still in the league, will we remember them for their “value” of draft slot or the “value” of their production?

  32. SandpointHawk says:

    Great clip rgbuckl, thanks for posting….

  33. nidhighe says:

    I love Florio’s article.

    “And, as usual, we give every team the same grade: Incomplete.”

  34. wabubba67 says:

    In the picture, is Kiper giving us an example of the type of circumference that he admires in other arrogant douchebags?

  35. Does anyone else have the impression that this year’s draft was kinda about getting Pete what he wants on defense (especially Irvin)?

    If you look at last year, there seemed to be a commitment to building the offense. It’s almost like Schneider asked Cable, “What do you want?” and they got it for him (Carpenter, Moffitt, Gallery, and Miller). And he got what Bevell wanted through free agency (Tjack and Rice).

    Seems like this year they focused more on Toys for Pete (or maybe Gus Bradley). I personally miss the old days of Tez, Jacob Green, Fred Young, Dave Brown, etc. so I like it actually. It seemed like we always had an inconsistent offense but if you just wait a minute or two the defense would get a turnover. I would love to see a turnover-rich defense like that again.

  36. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d828b79bd/article/bill-belichick-doesnt-care-what-draft-experts-think

    Take a look at the end of this… I knew when Carroll said that couches called him that NE, more precisly Bill Belichick, was looking to take Irvin..

  37. Carol said to start off Irvin will essentially be taking Brocks spot and Brock played over 600 snaps last year. If he does that and has double digit sacks then tell me how that is not worth a mid 1st rounder. Getting to the Qb is game changing. I love the pick. And I love the Wilson pick also…young insurance at the most important position. Hopefully he will become even more of a hot commodity free agent in 4 years then Flynn was this year only because that means Flynn is the real deal.

  38. But Mr. Happy also said he’s going to work on some things so that Irvin sees the field a little more than that, too.

  39. fdsadat, I agree with the article that “the draft community” can only compare where the player went relative to where “the draft community”felt they should go. But the FO has to go by what other teams are going to do (the reality, not the fictional draft player value).

    So if Irvin wasn’t going to make it to SEA’s pick in the second round, and he was that high on their board, the best SEA could do is trade down to get more picks but not trade down too far.

    Same with Wilson, there were apparently 2 other teams ready to take him in the 3rd. If that is true it’s the same scenario, trade down but not too far. That is the best that could be done if they really want that player. And that is what they did.

    So the big hair man is grading “the draft process” and he gives it a poor grade because it didn’t fit what the “draft community” thought (i.e. fantasy). But if the other teams were really going to take those guys, then that is the reality and based on “the draft process” -not necessarily the players- they should get an A. Because they did the best that could be done (get more picks and still get their player). Whereas if they waited that player would be gone. Just talking about the draft process here not the individual players fit/talent, etc.

  40. SeahawkFan12 says:

    Who f#cking cares what the national media thinks? Go out and win games, the division and make the playoffs. Let our play do the talking.

  41. Irvin said he thought he would go #26-#31 in the interview as I recall. That’s a pretty specific range. 26 is Houston who took a DE. 31 was New England who traded up to take a DE. So connecting the dots, I wonder if Houston and NE were planning on taking him late in the first round?

  42. I don’t expect Irvin to have a huge year this year, maybe 5 sacks or so. It’s the year after where I expect the breakout 15 sack year, starting in Clemons spot. He still needs another year of seasoning.

  43. SeahawkFan12, Whatchutalkinbout man? Kiper IS football. His head is even designed so that you can just stick a football helmet on there. No padding needed.

  44. Rumor has it the Jets wanted him at #16.

  45. VNHLNFAN says:

    Kiper is an exspert allright. Welcome to seattle Bruce!

  46. chuck_easton says:

    PFT just said it was SF that secretly flew Irvin in last week and pretty much promised him they would draft him at 30 if he was still there.

  47. I’m quite interested to see how RW comes along.

    It’s really easy to like that guy. I’m pulling for that dude big time. Wouldn’t it be great to have someone that articulate and smart and dedicated–to be your franchise QB?

    But I’m excited about Flynnsanity too…just sayin’.

  48. But yeah, Gruden loves RW. I thought he’d crawl across the table and smack Mel Kiper in the grill. He was really pissed! Ha!

    Thanks for sharing that video!

  49. leroyjamis says:

    Bobby Wagner and Robert Turbin interviewing each other…

    http://youtu.be/e3BBCZN7izg

  50. more stuff coming out about Irvin, and other teams that wanted him:

    http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/rob-rang/18881295

    It’s a dead horse at this point – but he wasn’t the mind-boggling reach that some termed him. Obviously.

  51. I read something similar about the Jets ready to take him with the very next pick earlier today, too.

    But I guess we didn’t get “value” for him though.

    If we would have traded down again so we could have gotten “value” and then he’d have been gone.

    I forget, we took him “too early.”

    Funny stuff!

    :)

  52. Irvin is a stud! The more tape I watch, the more I can’t believe the ‘experts’ didn’t have them going higher. It sounds like the JETS wanted him badly, not to mention the others. If his measurables are similar to Von Miller, that’s good enough for me. Fast twitch 6’3″, 4.4 speed, long arms, great balance, productive college numbers, learning and playing behind/with C. Clemons…I mean, what more can you ask for? This was a perfect fit as long as he keeps his head screwed on straight. I’m jacked. Hope he gets a good number cuz I’m definitely getting a jersey. I’ve been waiting pretty much all my seahawk fan life to have a guy like LT, Derrick Thomas, the fast LB sack artist type. Admittedly, I didn’t know a lick about him before Thursday, but am really impressed that this was kept so quiet. Now, the worst time of the year and the anticipation that goes with it. It’s exciting, but damn…is it September yet?

    I can’t wait to see our Defense (and Wilson/Turbin)!

    GO HAWKS!

  53. joreb – I’ve always wanted one of those pass rushing edge LB types, too! It’s exciting!

  54. More on where Irvin would have been taken if Seattle didn’t draft him at 15 –

    http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/rob-rang/18881295

  55. Soggybuc says:

    The only thing better than watching Jon Gruden reach over and bitch slap Kiper would be to watch Wilson walk in and bitch slap him, that and watching his wife react with happiness to said bitch slap.

  56. Now I must get off the bobbyk bandwagon as well. ;)

    http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/7515/bruce-irvin

    Clearly Kiper missed this one. He views his research as the pinnacle which it is not. When he first started he was doing what no other guy was doing amongst those out of the loop so he built some reputation up. Now he is so entrenched with his ways and po’d so many football people that the real stories like Irvin simply do not reach him.

  57. Looks like I reposted the same link.

  58. I really hate to agree with Kiper on anything……….. but in this case………. it really does seem like we overvalued some players.

  59. Soggybuc says:

    HAHA, thanks for the link Leroyjamis that was awesome stuff, hook them up with MikeRob!!!

  60. I was thinking when we got Curry… if we have taken Clay Matthews instead, everybody would say that we lost the safest pick in the draft to take a guy that would be avaliable at 10… Yeah, I wouldnt care at all about that today

    And this time, no one is pointing who we should have taken instead of Irvin, Couples has doubts all over him, Ingram has doubts, Mercilus and Perry would be a reach too… I just thrust Carroll, every 1 round pick they took has pro-bowl caliber, in my opinion…

  61. PDWay, Pabuwal thanks for the links…. They are enlightening and somewhat comforting to know we didn’t reach…

    Before I read Rangs article i was already on board with Bruce Irvin. It was a slap to the face at first with Coples and Ingram still there. I wanted an explanation and we got one.

    Bruce Irvin fills a specific role in which all he needs to do is be a “one trick pony”. Our defense is unconventional…that’s what makes it special and that’s where the genius of Pete Carrol stands. Everyone has a role in our defense and a specific skill set that exemplifies that role… looking back at the defensive ends/linebackers in the draft….there IS no one better to fit our LEO position than Irvin. I don’t care if he is drafted into a situational role just as long as he excels in that role.

    Like Bobby said this guy was drafted to replace Clemons. To be our specific LEO. Excellent job Carrol the timing was right..and if we stiffed some other teams alon the way? More power to that move….

    I have learned to have complete blind faith in Pete when it comes to our defense….. With our offense? That’s another story…

  62. On the Russel Wilson debate…everyone points to Brees…but there’s also a HOF QB named Fran Tarkenton who was only 6 foot. I saw him play when I was a kid and he was a blast to watch. I heard on the radio that Carroll talked to Bud Grant about Tarkenton when they were evaluating Wilson.

    “Bud Grant flatly called Tarkenton “the greatest quarterback who’s ever played.”

  63. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Remember this FOs first year when our special teams was really special? Last year the special teams play wasn’t as good, especially in the first game against the 49ers.
    After this draft I think our special teams will be even better than year one!
    That could mean around two more wins.

  64. OregonHawk says:

    I wonder if we did target Wilson, OR if he just fell to us…
    IE we had him rated the highest player when we went to pick..

  65. VNHLNFAN says:

    Anyone know where I can get a Turbin jersey? I am sold on this cat!

  66. wabubba67 says:

    Saw a video of Turbin’s highlights…I LOVE the pick, but his offensive line deserves some love too. Those holes to run through were HUGE! I wonder if any of those guys got drafted or will be drafted next year.

  67. i cant wait to see thes guys on the field

  68. I love our team speed and attitude. Mostly young, hungry guys that work hard and respect one another. Coach Pete has really changed the culture and expectation level. I can’t recall ever having this kind of confidence in our coach, GM and organization as a whole. I wasn’t sure about Irvin and Wilson at first glance, now I get it. Everyone else seems to be great value as well (including UFA’s…I wonder who will emerge from that group…guesses anyone?)

    How cool would it be to employed by THESE Seattle Seahawks. I’m in advertising and couldn’t think of anything cooler than working with and being around these guys. Lots of energy, positive winning attitudes and state of the art facilities. I hope every single member of that organization realizes what a gift it is to be a part of what’s building over at the VMAC. I think I’m jealous.

    Side Note: I don’t know about anyone else here, but if you play fantasy football wouldn’t you love to draft our defense? Young, fast and the potential to be shutdown exciting.

    Pinch me, I’m dreaming.

    GO HAWKS!

  69. GeorgiaHawk says:

    SandpointHawk – those grades are about the worst I have seen yet! Let’s just give about every pick an A! That’s really rational? Lol.

    At least some who grade us overall a C are being middle of the road, however this one is crap!
    Lets just see how this all plays out before we believe what any of these extreme grades are either way!

  70. GeorgiaHawk says:

    DukieO- Are you Dukeshire after 6 beers?

  71. nidhighe says:

    GeorgiaHawk, did you read to the bottom where the writer gave us an overall grade of F? ;)

  72. Surprising how fast they inked the UDFA’s, seems they had the entire thing planned out.
    I also have a new kid to root for in Panther UDFA Tauren Poole, If you get it, you get it.

  73. Seahawkgo says:

    Boo boo to Mel Kiper grade and comments

  74. Dang, I just watched the Gruden QB Camp with Wilson and he is pretty impressive. Does one or two inches really matter? He DID play behind pretty much the tallest O-line in college football. And he said he planned it that way! It’s a little bittersweet cause I think Flynn could be great too, but I guess it’s a good problem to have. Oh, and I did see one draft grade that was somewhat favorable, on foxsports.com. I think it was Czar who said we got a B, but I can’t remember if anyone got lower than a C. But like everyone has been saying, who gives a rat’s rear about grades. Time and playing time will tell. One more thing- I hope Irvin can contribute to special teams if he isn’t gonna be a every down player. I saw one report that said he will never be interested in helping in that aspect, but if you are gonna take a flyer on a guy @ pick 15, you would think he would do whatever they tell him to…

  75. joreb-
    totally agree on the fantasy football aspect of our D. hopefully our special teams do a better job and Leon gets a few runbacks this year too!

    Man I can’t wait for the season, even the preseason. I think it all hinges on our OL, hopefully they come back healthy and stay that way. There will be no stopping Beast-Mode and Sea-Hulk!

  76. Newborough says:

    I recall the post draft comments after the Colts drafted a certain Dwight Freeney 10 years back, along the lines of “too short and relies too much on pure speed, not an every down player and risks getting man-handled by more talented NFL tackles”

    I don’t recall any apologies and retractions later on though. I’m not setting expectations at Freeney-level (yet), but I’m feeling we got ourselves a good pass-rusher who, with some good coaching, has the potential to be ranked as elite within a couple of years

  77. Macabrevity says:

    I’m excited about the D too, although the road ahead is a tough one – I do like they way we could potentially finish out. I’m a big fan of our secondary, but I’m predicting a sophomore slump possibly for our CB’s, especially Browner who I like, but the penalties are due to simple physics, it’s harder to change direction when you’re that big and long. Opponents will learn what routes to run against him, although we should be able to compensate. Wagner landed in just about the best spot a MLB could land… can’t think of anywhere better. He’ll nab the starting spot, with a vet who won’t threaten him but can take some of the pressure off him in Ruud, and a D-line that will remind some of Baltimore fronts of the last decade.

    Offensively if we get and stay healthy, we could really surprise some people. There are a lot of variables, including Flynn’s play, our WR’s, and what could potentially be one of the better if not best O-lines in the league if healthy.

  78. bbnate420 says:

    “But we’re still talking about a player I had a late second-round grade on. I wouldn’t be surprised if Irvin gets 10 sacks in 2012, but that’s really his game.”-Helmet-Haired Moron

    This has to be one of the dumbest things I have ever read! Good chance he could have 10 sacks next year, by the way pass rushing is one of their biggest needs, but because I HAD A LATE 2ND value on him it is a bad pick! 99% of these moronic egomaniacs just don’t like it when teams disagree with their myopic views of the draft. Half of them don’t even know/consider the system of the teams when they evaluate. If the Hawks ran a traditional 4-3 then I would have somewhat of a problem with it. BUT THEY DON’T! If Irvin pans out then it was a good pick. If he doesn’t then it wasn’t. CASE CLOSED!

    I too hope that Flynn turns out to be a good to great QB for us but, the Russell Wilson pick isn’t automatically a WASTE if he does, as BobbyK says. He still can play well in the preseason and in spot starting duty over the next few years, as a lot of QBs don’t make 16 starts every year! We could then trade him for a better pick than we used on him. Kolb brought in a 2nd AND a top CB and, I bet the Packers could’ve gotten a 2nd last year for Flynn.

  79. SandpointHawk says:

    Georgia did you miss the tag line?

    “Overall Seahawks Draft Grade: F because if you think that arbitrary grades from me or anyone else mean a damn thing, then you are bat$hit insane.”

  80. bbnate420 says:

    By the way, looking back at the draft grades from 2011, Rob Rang is the only one that gave Seattle a decent grade of a B.

    Helmet-Haired Moron-D+

    Pete Prisco-C-

    Wes Bunting-C

    and so on….

    I would think that most people here are pretty happy with the draft/UFAs from 2011! Even the most criticized pick, Carpenter, will become a pro bowler eventually if moved to G or a very solid RT IMO.

  81. GeorgiaHawk says:

    nidhighe, SandpointHawk- My bad. I Missed that one.

    It’s hard to stomach my favorite player in the draft being a Stealer.

    http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/story/2012-04-29/ratings-2012-NFL-draft/54629536/1

  82. Would be interesting to see Kiper’s grades for when Ruskell was GM. As I remember they were pretty much A’s every year. But our team was recognized as having perhaps the least talent in the league when Ruskell left. If Ruskell’s picks were truly “A” picks, the team wouldn’t have been near the bottom of the league in talent. I may be wrong about the Kiper grades during the Ruskell years, I’d have to look it up, but that is what I remember.

  83. bbnate – I never said he was a wasted pick. I said I hope it was a wasted pick. That means that I hope Flynn does great and never gets hurt so Wilson never has to play. I never said I didn’t like the pick either.

    Lets be clear – I like Wilson! I just hope he never has to play!

  84. HeinieHunter says:

    There is on e common thread running thru this draft…..speed. Since Pete came to Seattle the team has gotten younger, bigger, and faster every year. Gotta love it!

  85. bbnate420 says:

    BobbyK, I never said that you said it was a wasted pick! I said that you said it was a wasted pick if Flynn turns out to play great! Read what I ACTUALLY WRITE NEXT TIME! My point was that I disagree that it is AUTOMATICALLY a wasted pick if Flynn turns out great. I could be wrong. Time will tell.

  86. Nighthawk3 says:

    No one got worse than a C-? I’d rate the Seahawks draft as an F-. Other than the 4th round, this was a completely wasted draft with blown opportunities to improve the team and just outright stupid picks. Passing on DeCastro, twice, should alone be cause for Carroll and Schneider to be fired. Why the hell would anyone think pass rusher was the top need for a team with a glaring hole (that is still unfilled) at left guard and no middle linebacker? Taking a 3rd round “end” who’s really only fit to be a 3-4 rush linebacker in the 1st round is completely unjustifiable (especially one with a violent criminal history), no matter what spin these clowns put on it. Wagner was a 3rd round talent taken a round too early, and after trading back and blowing the chance to draft Mychal Kendricks. I like the 4th round picks, Winston wasn’t a bad one, the rest suck. Especially taking a midget QB after signing Flynn. Is he going to play RB or receiver? Yeah, that’s what we needed in the 3rd round, a sub-six foot tailback taking snaps, not a guard (like the one taken one pick later) or an outside linebacker (like the one taken two picks later) or a cornerback (like the one taken five picks later) or a DT (like the one taken seven picks later); nope, we needed a midget (excuse me, vertically challenged) quarterback. This team really did nothing outside of signing Flynn to improve itself this offseason, and will have a 5th straight losing season as a result. If three straight losing seasons doesn’t get Carroll fired, I’m not sure what will. Why is it impossible for this franchise to get a personnel department and coach who can assess team needs, sign and draft good players to fill those needs, and win football games? Are we cursed? Or is it because we have an owner who treats the team as a hobby instead of a passion.

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