Seahawks Insider

Morning links: Jackson vs. Kolb? You be the judge

Post by Eric Williams on Sep. 22, 2011 at 5:36 am with 33 Comments »
September 22, 2011 6:26 am
Arizona quarterback Kevin Kolb. (AP Photo/Cliff Owen)

Dave Boling of The News Tribune writes that Sunday will give Seattle Seahawks fans an opportunity to evaluate the team’s position to pass on Arizona quarterback Kevin Kolb and sign Tavaris Jackson.

Of course, it’s not an apples to apples comparison. Kolb would have cost much more in terms of compensation via trade and a new contract extension to pry him from Philadelphia.

Kolb signed a five year, $64 million deal with the Cardinals, and Arizona gave up Pro Bowl cornerback Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie, along with a second-round pick in next year’s draft in the trade with the Eagles. Seattle instead chose to sign Jackson to a two year, $8 million deal.

But Sunday’s does provide a glimpse into what the future could have been for Seattle if they determined that Kolb was a franchise quarterback that could lead them to the Super Bowl.

Boling: “Jackson has not yet been the answer to the many problems the Seahawks have on offense, but he’s not been the most obvious limiting factor, either.

“When the Seahawks and Matt Hasselbeck failed to come to terms, they had to examine options. Could a team with as many needs as they had afford $13 million a year as well as a 2009 Pro Bowl cornerback and a second-round pick on Kolb, especially given the limited evidence of his potential?

“In the end, they signed Jackson for less than one-third that expense.

“And we may all judge the relative value off the approach on Sunday.”

Is Brandon Browner the Larry Fitzgerald stopper? He obviously has a lot to prove before earning that title. But Pete Carroll brought him in because of his length to matchup against big receivers like the five-time Pro Bowler.

Clare Farnsworth of Seahawks.com writes that linebacker Matt McCoy has carved out a nice role defensively as Seattle’s third down and short yardage middle linebacker.

According to ESPN’s Adam Schefter, Raheem Brock was fined $15,000 by the league for his hit on Pittsburgh quarterback Ben Roethlisberger.

More Farnsworth: Some news and notes from Wednesday’s practice.

Rod Mar of Seahawks.com has some cool photos from Sunday’s game at Pittsburgh.

Christian Caple of Seattlepi.com has comments from Pete Carroll weighing in on the fake injury controversy.

Jim Moore of ESPN 710 Seattle offers a rebuttal to Dave Wyman’s piece supporting Tarvaris Jackson, saying that the Seahawks cannot win with Jackson at quarterback.

Doug Kretz of Scouts Inc previews the Arizona-Seattle contest. You have to be an ESPN Insider to view this article.

Arizona Cardinals

Kent Somers of the Arizona Republic writes that the Cardinals have been efficient running the ball so far this season. Beanie Wells has gained 183 yards on 32 carries in two games, his most productive efforts in consecutive games over his three-year career.

Darren Urban of azcardinals.com writes that Kevin Kolb’s toughness has not gone unnoticed by his teammates.

Categories:
Morning links
Leave a comment Comments → 33
  1. Dukeshire says:

    I agree with Farnsworth, McCoy has been a very pleasant surprise at Mike in nickel. I don’t recall seeing much (any) of that with the first unit during preseason. He’s played really well there and it also allows Heater to move to Will in those situations. (And also seems to signal the end of the Curry in nickel at Will experiment.)

  2. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Jackson vs Kolb?
    Not a fair comparison unless we could see how Kolb would do with the Seahawks.
    Kolb has much better players to work with.

    I wouldn’t want to give up a first round pick for him, or a player like Earl Thomas.

  3. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Also what I mean by not a fair comparison is not enough games played yet.

  4. Dukeshire says:

    I agree that it’s a bit early to make any reasonable comparisons. But we can see trends developing. One good. One real bad. And I have to say that I think it is an apples to apples comparison, albeit one very expensive apple vs. a barging basement apple. But still, we’re comparing the same position and their respective results.

  5. GeorgiaHawk says:

    I am looking forward to seeing how this young team will play at home with the 12th man.
    And I want to see more of baldwin! Much more!

  6. ryanryan says:

    This will be a fun game to watch, as there is a reasonable expectation to win.

    The Seahawks will have to pass first, run second because nobody is (or should) buy that they have anything to fear in the passing game. Teams will stack the box until the Hawks burn them with the pass. The nice thing for other teams with that approach is that they can bring the heat, which has cooked Jackson thus far.

    That said, I’m glad we didn’t sell the farm to get Kolb – the roster is too full of gaps and question marks.

    The Scouts Inc. preview was funny, it said that running was the strength of the Seahawks…do what?

  7. “I wouldn’t want to give up a first round pick for him, or a player like Earl Thomas.”

    What if the trade offered today was Carpenter and Moffitt for Kolb, would you take it?

    That’s our 1st and 3rd, which probably would’ve swung it. Doesn’t matter anymore, doesn’t seem like Kolb is going anywhere anytime soon.

  8. Jackson has Mike Williams as the number 1 WR and Marshawn Lynch as the number 1 RB.

    Kevin Kolb has Larry Fitzgerald as the number 1 WR and Beanie Wells as the number 1 RB.

  9. To consider what it would mean to put Kolb on the Seahawks, subtract our top CB, Trufant, and subtract the chance to draft another high-round player like John Moffitt, then subtract $13M/year and commit to not searching for a new starting QB for the next 5 or 6 years. That extra $9M/yr would likely have prevented us from signing either Zach Miller or Sidney Rice (most likely Rice would not be here, since signing Tarvaris first was part of the plan they executed to recruit Rice).

    So, for better or worse, subtract Trufant, Rice, a top draftee in 2012, $9M, and forget about drafting a QB in 2012, and that’s what Kolb cost.

    Signing Jackson left our cash available and our draft choices and valued veterans intact while we go about our first priorities: building a new O line and running game worthy of a new QB.

    Tough choices, but the path taken by the Seahawks gives a rebuilding team both more flexibility and more upside for building in 2012.

    Meanwhile, if Kolb doesn’t win a super bowl in AZ, then they grossly overpaid for him.

  10. MadSweeney42 says:

    I love how an accidental hit from being first blocked, then tripped (unflagged) into the QB gets a bigger fine than a player actually punching another one after a play was over. I don’t recall a fine for EJ Henderjerk crab-walking into Hass (how would that have changed the last 4 years?). Goodell is a menace, is inconsistent with punishment, wants to move football to England, and just plain needs to go.

  11. On getting Jackson that`s what you get when you shop at the Dollar Store. Even then he was a rip-off. I want to believe the O-Line is close to turning things around.BUT…an inexperienced line like ours is going to take more time.maybe by mid-season? Suck for Luck!,or try for the Oklahoma QB

  12. Pabs – Wells was a backup averaging 3.4 ypc last year with poor QB’s. Now with Kolb and against a couple defense he lit up you claim he is all pro? Lynch has been to a pro bowl. IT AIN”T HIM.

    The Seahawk receivers are handcuffed because of a worthless QB and above average defense they have faced. Fitz is great but ranked below Williams a year ago HERE rank 64 / 71

    Stevos – AZ grossly overpaid for Leinart relying on a high draft choice that was extremely spendy. I would rather give up a talented safety any day of the week for a quality QB. One that is capable of running the offense and move the chains. Then all that is needed is a FO that can supply enough talent at EACH position, eliminating glaring weakness, building a team which will reach the playoffs. From there it is another win and your in season.

  13. Ewalters7354 says:

    Pabs,the Cards don’t have more talent than the Hawks but at that one player position.Beanie Wells is not better then Lynch.He has a line that gas played together for four years.C’mon dude

  14. SandHills says:

    Just glad I am not a die-hard Seahawk fan, because as just an observer of the first 2 games (as well as the Pre- season where Whitehurst was clearly the best option at QB after Hasselback left) I certainly don’t see how this Sundays game is going to prove anything that isn’t already obvious.

  15. SeahawkFan12 says:

    The comparison between Kolb and Jackson is a bit premature, but I will give the Seahawks the advantage in this one. Kolb has been brought in to be the long-term solution; Jackson is a band-aide to get us to April 2012 where the long-term solution will be drafted out of college. I did not (and still do not) believe this year’s QB class will hold a candle to next year’s, so I’m glad Seattle did not draft a QB this year, nor give up the draft picks and money to sign Kolb.

    Advantage Arizona in the short-term, advantage Seattle in the long run.

  16. “On getting Jackson that`s what you get when you shop at the Dollar Store.”

    Dollar Store? Don’t you mean flea market?!

  17. ChrisHolmes says:

    “I did not (and still do not) believe this year’s QB class will hold a candle to next year’s”

    I’d agree with that, except for Mallet. I still think he has the potential to be an amazing QB. And we passed when we could have had him in round 2.

    I’ll be giddy if we land Luck.

  18. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Hey! I get my reading glasses at the dollar store. I have about 25 broken pair, but one pair will get me through a few weeks if I’m lucky. Duct tape can help sometimes.
    I wonder if Carroll has any duct tape?Lol.

  19. I’m a diehard Seahawk fan. Maybe I’m a strange bird to some of the other folks that post on here, but I love reading their views and interactions about “my” team. I’ve been watching and waiting for 35 yrs for a SB winning championship team to be built here, and have seen them come fairly close a coupla times. The last time we were close (’05), we saw what happens when a GM doesn’t value players the same way that the HC does. That’s been fixed with PC & JS. As long as they’re working together to improve the team for the long haul, I don’t care so much if the team wins or loses short term, just that they make progress in their performance. It may even take awhile for them to start getting their act together – that’s OK.

    Back around April, the sports media were saying that the Bidwell’s FO had to get a “good” QB in order to get Larry Fitzgerald to re-sign (his contract said he couldn’t be franchised). Fitz mentioned Kolb as one of the QBs he had in mind. Kolb was signed from PHI for alotta $salory (5yr/$64M), plus picks and trading away a really good to great but dissatisfied CB to PHI. Then last Aug 20, 8-yr vet Fitz signed an eight-year, $128.5M extension ($50M guaranteed) with the Cards. Short term expensive ‘fixes’ for the Cards. Let’s build this SEA team long term.

  20. GeorgiaHawk says:

    Good post klm008! Sometimes you lose me, but I’m sure I do the same to others. Especially after a few beers.

  21. So I’ve been trying to figure this out but can’t seem to wrap my head around. I think we have a pretty clear understanding of what this regime wants to do with offense.

    Correct me if I’m wrong but this offense is designed as: Run heavy oriented WCO. A lot of short timed routes that are low risk high percentage completions with the occasional hit em deep and spread the field vertically. Everything is predicated on setting up with the run and maintaining possession.

    With the run being so heavily emphasized why in gods name do we not have a standard piece of a run attack….

    Since the inception of this new offense we have not had a FB on the roster. Michael Robinson is an athletic phenom, a tweener. When he gets injured we dont even have a player who can claim FB on their repetoir. The most asinine thing I have seen this season and last is our primary pass catching TE lining up at full back.

    You want to get the run game going stop de-emphasizing the full back position and dedicate yourself to improving the run

    Shit or get off the pot……..

  22. AaronCurryIsBUST says:

    Jim Moore is SPOT ON! Wyman’s article is probably the most asinine thing I have ever read.

  23. This is completely off subject of the post, but i’m hoping someone can be of assistance to me. I am trying to deck out my projector room (seahawks room) with all seahawks gear. I’m doing good so far, but the only thing i am missing is a sweet 12th man flag. I have been looking all over for one and can not find anything worth buying. Does anyone out there have any idea where to find one or any suggestions? I did an online chat with someone at NFLshop.com to ask them, thinking they’d have an idea for me…the lady said, and i quote, “what is 12th man?”. haha, needless to say, i ended that chat and came here, to real football and seahawk fans. Any ideas would be appreciated, thanks in advance!

  24. I am worried that after the first two 3 & outs on Sunday, the boo birds will start chanting for Charlie. Remember when Hasselbeck got booed and everybody was chanting for Dilfer? Holmgren told the team after the game to ignore the fans (in much more colorful language) and stood up for his QB in front of the team. Couple of years later, we are in the Super Bowl. It is always hard to believe that these guys know what they are doing, but I truly do think that PC & JS have a plan, and are on the way to building something great for the future.

  25. Who cares about money? The Seahawks are far enough under the cap where it would have made no difference between the contracts of Kolb and Jackson. Why would we sacrifice any other player if we already have an owner with enough money to go around and cap space to do it?

    Jackson may be bad enough (along with some other positions) for us to get Luck. With that being said, I’ll take Luck any day of the week over a Kolb or almost anyone.

    I despise the idea of quitting and hoping the Hawks lose for Luck but recently I’ve been thinking how the organization quit on me and 2011 by going with Jackson as our QB so I don’t feel as bad about it anymore.

    This is the year from hell so I’m just following my team and riding it out because I know it (probably) can’t get any worse and that happier and more optimistic days are ahead. Going through this will also make going back to the Super Bowl even more special.

  26. jboard1 – This is probably the coolest thing I own and I love it! It’s not a flag and it is pretty spendy, but is really cool and looks great in my mostly Seahawks area.

    http://proshop.seahawks.com/ProductDetail.aspx?CategoryID=2652&Page=1,1&ViewAll=False,True&ProductID=36460

  27. bobbyk-
    wow that is really cool..and also REALLY spendy :)
    I love the old school retro stuff. I wish i could afford that.

  28. For all of the “there’s no guarantees with Luck” people…

    I understand there are no “guaranteed” players.

    However, if I grow up in a run down and drug/gang infested neighborhood with a crackhead for a Mom and a Dad in jail (or dead), there’s a chance that I’ll turn out fine, but better odds that I’m not going to turn out to be a good citizen.

    But if I grow up in a loving two parent household in a good area where things like education are important to people, I guarentee that my odds of life success are going to be much greater (yet, with no guarantees).

    I’m playing the odds with Luck and only Luck. I think he’s going to be great and I want to play my percentages with him. Personally, after watching his bowl game last year and definitely paying strict attention to him this year… I have NEVER felt more strongly about a college QB prospect. He’s got a good arm, he’s accurate, is a good athlete, and has the all important “it” or intangibles. I want him at ANY cost!

  29. ljarllrajl says:

    As I like to say, it is what it is.

    It’s not like Kolb and T-Jack are undrafted rookie free agents…we know exactly who these guys are and what they can do on the football field. There’s no comparison.

    T-Jack got an NFL job because he knew somebody’s playbook. Nobody else was knocking at this guy’s door to even give him a back up job.

    I don’t know if Arizona will get there $64 Million worth outta Kolb but they’ve got there DRC and 2nd round picks worth.

    Arizona last year got destroyed by the opponent’s #1 WR last year (remember BMW), so DRC might be a little over rated. He’s the #3 corner in Philly right now.

  30. wabubba67 says:

    The real comparison will be Kolb v. whoever the Seahawks draft in 2012. That was the real decison that Carroll made by not acquiring Kolb….we’ll be better off in the long run for it, too.

  31. BobbyK, I want Luck BAD too but, you might want to accept the fact that we will PROBABLY not get him. I want him too but, I think we’re more likely to have our pick of Landry Jones and Matt Barkley. I hope comPete and JS can make the right choice. Although it will mean that we are 2-14 or 4-12 at best, I hope we can LUCK into LUCK. Just don’t count on it. The Chiefs are injured and TERRIBLE. Hopefully if we don’t get the #1, Carolina does and we can make a trade for it!!!!!!!

  32. Kolb by a mile. That’s why I expect us to lose Sunday.

  33. I doubt we will “have our pick of Landry Jones or Matt Barkley”. That’s just day-dreaming, although not quite as crazy as assuming we’ll draft Andrew Luck.

    Andrew Luck and Matt Barkley will both be drafted in the top 3. The teams that draft them will be so bad that Luck and Barkley’s rookie years will be destroyed, and those teams won’t be any good for several more years and more rebuilding than just a QB.

    The Seahawks have too many good players and coaches to be one of those three teams. Right now, Seahawks aren’t as good as last year’s team, but as of games 13, 14, 15, 16 this year, they will be better than last year’s team was. (last year’s Hawks were 1-3 in the final four reg season games).

    I’d guess we will draft somewhere between 4 and 8. We won’t get Matt Barkley unless we trade up for him. I would bet that Scheider’s scouts have their eyes on another QB or two who will be drafted later.

    Remember, Schneider drafted Rogers at 1/24, while in the same draft, Alex Smith was 1/1, Kyle Orton was drafted in round 4, Matt Cassell in round 7. Two years later, Kevin Kolb was drafted in round 2, while JaMarcus Russell and Brady Quinn went in round 1. So much for “draft experts”. They’re all guessing.

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