Seahawks Insider

Morning links: Jones gets hands-on experience

Post by Eric Williams on July 2, 2011 at 9:06 am with 32 Comments »
July 2, 2011 9:06 am
Former Seattle Seahawks Walter Jones has a mold made of his right hand at the opening of the Seahawks team shop in downtown Seattle. (John Boyle/Everett Herald)

Clare Farnworth of Seahawks.com was on hand when former Seattle Seahawk Walter Jones had his right hand cast in wet cement for the opening of a new Seahawks and Sounders team shop in downtown Seattle on Friday.

According to Farnsworth, the event is one of the many new things Jones is experiencing now that he has retired from football.

“Right now, I’m thinking everything I do from now on is going to be a first for me,” Jones told Farnsworth. “I played for 13 years and enjoyed football. But now I’m taking in everything that comes with having done that, and what’s going to come for me.

“You enjoy it, appreciate it and look forward to it.”

ESPN’s Mike Sando considers possible quarterback options for Seattle, including Matt Leinart, Tarvaris Jackson, Carson Palmer, Kevin Kolb and Matt Flynn.

NFC North blogger Kevin Seifert considers former Seahawks Steve Hutchinson’s chances for the Hall of Fame.

Adam Caplan of Fox Sports and Greg Cosell of NFL Films evaluate game tape of Philadelphia quarterback Kevin Kolb and offer their opinion on where he’s at in his development.

KJR 950 AM’s Dave Mahler says that according to a source, the Seahawks have offered first and third round picks for Kevin Kolb. I have not heard anything to confirm this report, but I’ll check into it.

Albert Breer of the NFL Network says the final day of talk on Friday in Minnesota showed significant progress on the revenue split issue – the overriding issue in this labor battle – giving both sides reason for optimism when both sides renew talks in New York on Tuesday.

Mike Freeman of CBS Sports says retired player benefits has become a sticking point in negotiations, and that according to a source close to the ownership group, there is growing concern that games will be missed.

Matt Bowen of National Football Report breaks down the WR route tree and what routes work best against defensive coverages. It’ worth a read.

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Morning links
Leave a comment Comments → 32
  1. 1st and 3rd for Kolb????!!!! Please don’t let that be true. Would probably set the franchise back a decade.

    Continue building a solid foundation – OL, DL and secondary – and don’t make a huge reach for a QB whose tools will, I feel, at best make him an average NFL QB.

    We don’t need the “franchise” QB right now – Build for the future.

  2. Soggybuc says:

    Well if “Softy” is reporting it i’ll easily consider it untrue

  3. Dukeshire says:

    Lol. Any “report” that begins, “Heard from a source…” is completely made up, at least as I see it. And who by the way is confiding in Softy, that has any actual insider information into anything football related? Well, I shouldn’t be too hard on the big guy, radio sweeps did begin June 30th and run through the month of July. Coincidence? Unlikely.

  4. chuck_easton says:

    If Seattle even offers a 1st for Kolb I’m sharpening the pitchforks and getting the torches ready to storm the gates of VMAC.

    A first and a third? I may have to take more drastic measures, but of course we can’t talk about those because 1) I have no clue what to do and 2) you can’t even make jokes anymore without the fear of having some men in black suits visit you about threats and such. Suffice it to say I may just have to hold my breath until I turn blue and pass out. Hey, it worked for my son when he was younger! :)

  5. There is a reason the patriots are the patriots and teams like the raiders and the seahawks are not.

    Teams that consistently give up picks and waste big bucks in FA WON’T CONSISTENTLY MAKE THE PLAYOFFS.

    Boy does that sound familiar. If we trade a 1 for kola I will predict that JS and or PC will be fired within 3yrs. If we give up 4 picks in less than 2 years on a qb these guys have no clue what they are doing when it comes to find a qb. And I don’t trust them to find a guy that will help this team.

    I will repeat again what I believe are the only viable options for this team:
    1. Resign Matt
    2. If that doesn’t work – sign a back up. And go with Charlie
    3. Do what we can to be in position to draft a guy next year- heck maybe 2

    Why trade for Kolb whose upside is Matt if we have Matt already ?

  6. chuck_easton says:

    xcman,

    While I agree with your thought it should be noted that Seattle only gave up one pick (3rd rounder) for Whitehurst. There is this myth that they gave up a 2nd and a 3rd but they only swapped places in the 2nd round they still had the pick.

  7. If Kolb is a young Matt Hasselbeck… I’m totally fine with trading a 1st and a 3rd. If you look at it this way, the 1st round pick would probably be used on a QB next year anyways… so if you look at it this way, they are really only giving up a 3rd round pick. Building for the future makes no sense if you don’t have the QB to build the team around. We only have 1 QB on our current roster and I have a negative 97% chance that he can be the QB of our future.

    That said, they better be right on Kolb if they are going to make this deal. I don’t know if Kolb is the answer or not and won’t claim to know that he’s going to be very good or below average but comPete and Bo are going to stake their careers on this move if they make it (and sometimes it takes guts to make tough decisions — sometimes they work out, sometimes they don’t).

    Personally, I’d like to resign Matt, keep our picks, and get him a LG and Sidney Rice to throw to. Go Kuhn hunting for a FB and I really think this would be a top 10 offense in the NFL. That’d make me happy.

    There’s probably nothing to the report, but at least it got us talking… I have a son who’s going to be born (probably) later this month and this is a big decision… is his first ever Seahawks jersey going to be #8 or #4? His sister has a #8:)

  8. Soggybuc says:

    ROFL@ BobbyK Indeed that is the most important parenting decision your going to have to make ( at least until pop warner ) so be safe and go with #29.

    Hawks already have their QB of the future. sadly he happens to be under contract for the Trojans for 2011.

  9. Dukeshire says:

    Why are the only two choices relegated to the QB, Bobby? An Okung jersey on a baby would be cool. Or how about Forsett? They’d be almost the same size. (Hey-O…)

    What I can’t believe is that anyone is giving this completely unsubstantiated rumor any credence. lol.

  10. Duke – If they go with Charlie in ’11… then he’s either getting Carlson (the rural MN connection) or Okung. I haven’t decided yet:)

  11. Dukeshire says:

    Solid choices. For my jersey this year I’m leaning Hawthorne. I’ll wait until Nike takes over in ’12 to get Moffitt.

  12. Chuck you are right! but it is still frustrating.

    Everyone always asked why the Pats are so good. It’s easy – They draft GREAT! not perfect but very good. They let guys walk when they want to be overpaid to stay.

    No it must be noted that they got lucky with Brady, but they also had a good QB on the roster when they got him.

    How many times in the last few years have they had 2 first round picks since, the hawks, raiders, broncos, gave up a first to get a guy they had to have and NE, sat and laughed since they had drafted the replacement a year or 2 earlier. They fill holes in FA –

    You can look at GB, Pitt, and Philly and see the same basic principals. although not as well put together.

  13. ok on 2nd thought maybe Pitt is right there with them on the drafting.

  14. chuck_easton says:

    Xcman

    That is why I can’t believe this report that Seattle is prepared to give up a 1st and 3rd for Kolb. Schneider comes from the GB school of thought that you build through the draft and not trades or FA.

    Unfortunately the Seahawks are having to recover from a previous regime that thought any widebody could be brought in to play OL

    Because of that we have had to use high draft choices the past few years to rebuild the OL instead of having the luxury to use those picks on ‘sexy’ choices like a franchise QB or some other skill position

    The good news is we now have an OL with two 1st rounders, two 2nd rounders and only one position that will have to be filled through FA. Also we will have a young line with a 3rd year player, a second year player, and two rookies. The line should be able to be solid for years to come

  15. Under Cable SEA’s OL should be pretty good by next season. Maybe it’s not quite up to NFL average this coming season, but going from 28th-29th up to 16th-17th would be an outstanding improvement!

    Last year Cable’s Raiders had a very strange season. They swept the AFCW then went 0-6 vs the rest of their AFC opponents (AFCS + PIT + MIA). Then OAK splitt with the NFCW (beat STL & SEA at home, and lost to AZ & SF on the road) to end up 8-8. I’d bust my buttons from pride if SEA went 8-8 in ’11.

  16. If you want to add someone to the list of “they usually draft well” teams, we could talk about Ozzie Newsome in Baltimore. He usually drafts well and he usually trades down to get more picks. There are exceptions to every rule, like when they traded up to get Michael Oher (and one more I’m about to bring up), but, for the most part, they trade down more often than up.

    Why do I bring this up?

    They traded a 1st, early 3rd, and 6th round pick in 2008 so they could take Joe Flacco (3 picks for 1 pick). We could debate until we’re blue in the face about if Flacco is a stud or not, but that’s not the point. The point is that this organization, that usually drafts well, felt that getting a franchise QB was important enough to trade some picks away for. If we were to trade a couple of high picks for our franchise QB (Kolb)… I wouldn’t care. With any other position, I would care (like if we traded picks for a CB, DT, or DE), but not with the most important position in professional sports though.

    If we trade a #1 and a #3 for Kolb… as I’ve already said… is it really trading 2 picks away? No. Not if we would have used that #1 on a QB. It’s basically like trading 1 pick away (again, b/c we’d have had to use the one we kept on a QB).

    I doubt there’s any truth to this rumor, but speculating is fun, right Duke? :)

  17. chuck_easton says:

    BobbyK,

    I agree when you have that shot at the franchise QB you do what it takes. I’m just not sure Kolb is that can’t miss Franchise QB. That is, in my humble and entirely uneducated position, the real debate. Is Kolb really that guy you mortgage the farm for?

    Whitewurst only cost a 3rd. Definitely worth the risk there. If he panned out you hit the home run. If he doesn’t pan out it’s not too expensive a try.

  18. I don’t know if he is or is not. I agree about that being the million dollar question.

    I think he has enough arm strength and mobility, kind on like he’s a young Matt Hasselbeck (underrated in both, when he was young, IMO). I have heard the term “gym rat” used to describe him, which fits my criteria that the QB must be one of the hardest working and dedicated players in the organization.

    However, I just don’t know if he’s going to progress the way Matt did, for example. If it’s a “yes,” then I, personally, would trade away a #1 and #2 to make it happen. If it’s the other, we’re back to Dan McGwire, Kelly Stouffer, Rick Mirer, and more nightmares.

    This is one scenario where I’m glad I’m not the one making the decision because I really have no clue if Kolb is the next Matt or the next clown. In my limited viewing of his games, I think he’s going to be a good, solid QB for 2012. I think there will be Matt-like growing pains in ’11 (he’s never really started many games).

    My HUGE Kolb trump card over Charlie (in the “but he hasn’t started many games” argument) is that Kolb appears to have earned respect/support from his teammates with respect to performing in practice (and some games, too… whereas the Charlie supporters will tell you that he won the Rams game, where it was the defense/home field, and not his 60 or whatever yard and 1 INT… 2nd half performance that was the biggest reason the game was won, IMO).

  19. Dukeshire says:

    It’s not as though this team is simply a QB away from being complete. They have glaring needs at several positions and it would be incredibly irresponsible, IMO, for them to hand over a 1st and 3rd for any QB at this point.

  20. I don’t believe you can build a perfect team and then, all of a sudden, get the QB, who will take years to develop, and throw him in there. He needs to be part of the rebuilding process. Granted, it’s going to be harder to rebuild the rest of the team if you don’t have all of your ammo (draft picks), but thanks to Numbskull, we are a little bare of talent around here at too many positions. We’re not in the ideal situation, that’s for sure (and it sucks).

  21. Dukeshire says:

    I can agree with that. And Carroll did say back in May, that he’d be willing to “mortgage the future” with regards to trading draft picks for a franchise QB. However, I didn’t get the impression that that meant doing so for a developmental type QB. And although I do like Kolb, he is still that.

  22. Palerydr says:

    Well Bobby your argument has plenty of room for back tracking so to me it seems even you are trying to convince yourself that this would be a good move to make. Me I look to next years draft and see possibly 4 and maybe even 5 QB prospects that will go in the first or second round. I’m ready to roll the dice on CW if we don’t resign MH. Worst case scenario we have a crappy season and get a better draft choice. Best case scenario we find our QB of the next 3-5 years(CW is 29) and we draft for another need with our higher picks. Picking up a developmental QB later on. Personally I just don’t see them making that move. To me it’s nothing to get worked up about Softy is nothing but a blowhole and pervert who rarely puts thought into what comes out of his obnoxious pie hole.

  23. SeahawkFan12 says:

    It’s one thing to run with unsubstantiated rumors put our by a half-wit sports radio talk show dork, it is another thing to run with them when they involve an over-inflated FA QB like Kolb. Before last season, a conversation like this would never happen. Kolb is NOT a younger version of Hasselbeck; re-sign Hass and draft The Future next April. Let said Future develop under Hass and his proven leadership. Neither Kolb nor Whitehurst (just puked in my mouth a little) can provide the level of mentorship that will get someone ready to lead for the next 10-15 years.

  24. Glad to see no one here is putting much stock is Softy’s reporting. lol! With Brock Huard on the radio in the mornings talking Seahawks, it seems Softy is getting a little desperate for attention. He’s the last reporter I’d expect to have insider information for the Seahawks.

    I would agree with Bobby that this 1st and 3rd for Kolb idea has some merit. I’m against it, personally, because the team still has too many needs and still needs to keep to the strategy of leveraging its high draft picks into multiple picks, at least for another year or so, to build the team. Multiple picks for one player doesn’t make sense at this stage. You can’t take short-cuts in building a team, and I think Schneider will demonstrate that he knows this by being patient.

    Its us fans who lack patience. But that’s just one more reason why we don’t have his job.

    We all expect that with our 1st pick next year, we will take a QB. There will likely be 3 or 4 QBs taken in the first round who will all be rated higher than Kolb was when he came out of Houston. We will get one of them with one first round pick. it won’t cost an extra third rounder.

    The math is pretty simple. The only thing required is that JS and PC have enough patience to build the team, and I think they do. There is a reason they negotiated long-term contracts for themselves.

  25. Palerydr – I never said I wanted to make that trade. I can see where it could be interpreted that way though. This is one of the few times where I defer to the powers that be and am going to put my trust in them (they are earning trust, Josh Wilson trade and all…lol).

    My first priority has always been to resign Matt. Personally, I would resign him, sign Gallery to plug the black hole at LG, and overpay for Sidney Rice and watch our offense become top-10 and roll the dice and see how far we can go in ’11 (I realize the defense needs help, too).

    If we go into ’11 with a three headed monster comPETEtition of T-Jack, Leinart, and Charlie… I have a definite feeling that we could get LUCKy in the ’12 Draft.

    One thing I will say for Kolb over the rookies in the ’12 class… he’s gotten his feet wet (with a few starts, even in different years) so there’s going to be much less of a learning curve. He just needs the real time on the field. However, I have no idea how he’s going to develop. No clue. So, in no way, would I say we should make the move. If it happens, I’ll support it. If we don’t trade for him, I’ll be thrilled to get Matt back. If we end up with T-Jack or Leinart (or Charlie) I’ll watch the Lions for a year and come back when we have hope again (figure of speech).

    By the time a ’12 1st round pick is in his prime, guys like Okung are going to be in their later twenties.

    Another thing you can’t say about Kolb is that he doesn’t have Matt’s skills of 10 years ago. The arm strength and mobility is pretty similar. It’s what’s in his head that I don’t know. pabuwal has said that he stares his guys down and things like that. I have no knowledge of this or if he’ll grow with experience and become a good QB, but nobody can tell me that he and a young Matt aren’t twins when it comes to arm strength/mobility.

  26. I wouldn’t doubt there to be a source
    1) Seattle was inquiring about Kolb last off season. The asking price – 2 first round
    2) Kolb had beaten out incumbent Philly QB Donovan McNabb a decorated pro bowler who had taken the team to numerous playoff appearances.
    3) Until injury Kolb had won the starting position over Mike Vick who went to the pro bowl

    I realize this blog entertains some of the best arm chair GM’s around and that the stats on Kolb aren’t favorable. But, if Andy Reid was so high on Kolb’s talent a 1st and 3rd would seem to be a discount from the previous asking price – 2 first.

    Houston gave up 2 seconds and swapped position 8 to the Atlanta 10 in return for backup QB, Matt Schaub an original third round selection. Kolb was chosen 36 overall. A very high second round selection by Philly GM Tom Heckert who is now with the Browns and Mike Holmgren.

    We know the Hawks are in the market for QB having only Charlie Whitehurst on the roster. Hopefully these questions will be answered soon.

  27. I will say that I’d trade 100 1st round picks for Kolb if the alternative was to go with T-Jack.

    One thing that scares me about T-Jack and Schneider is that Schneider loved Charlie’s athleticism and arm strength, yet didn’t seem to care about his brain (questions about him coming from Clemson with respect to reading defenses, staring down receivers, bla, bla, bla… I’m not claiming to remember any of his college games, I don’t, but from the scouting reports we were able to google after the trade last year).

    If Schneider looks only at T-Jack’s arm/mobility, I fear he could easily be a Seahawk and that scares the crap out of me. If he looks at things like having a brain and throwing accuracy, then I can rest assured that he won’t be a Seahawk (please, no).

    The Vikings team of a few years ago was built to win now, but they didn’t have the QB (they only had T-Jack, who wasn’t a “real” QB) and they lost (or didn’t go as far as talent indicated it should). Then they get Favre and had a legit chance to win it all and obviously fell short in New Orleans. I don’t want us to have the team built to win now… and then all of a sudden “we’ve got to get our QB.” I think the Vikings’ window has passed, as most of their guys are in their prime or just ending their prime (we could have another discussion about Childress the Moron) and now they are going with a rookie (Ponder). Great for Ponder, bad for the Vikings in ’11 and ’12. By the time Ponder is ready to go, they are going to have too many players who aren’t good enough anymore (or overpaid for their production) like AP, Hutch, Kevin Williams, Allen, etc.). If I were the Vikings, I would look into trading a few of their aging studs and try to get some picks so they will be ready to rock again when Ponder is entering his 3rd/4th years (if he turns out). Personally, I’d trade everyone, make sure I got LUCKy in the ’11 draft, and have oodles and oodles of picks in the next three drafts, but I’m crazy that way… lol.

  28. BobbyK – what would you think of getting Pat Williams now?

  29. Dukeshire says:

    For my part, it’s not that I doubt whether Kolb will garner a 1st and 3rd, he may. It’s that I don’t believe for one second that anyone with even a shred of knowledge regarding negotiations that may be taking place for Kolb, went to Mahler and leaked, or confided or however one wants to say it, what he genuinely knows. That is, if Kolb comes to Seattle for a 1st and 3rd, it’s pure coincidence that Softy claimed to have a source stating as such. I think he completely made it up.

  30. Duke – True.

    klm – I think Pat Williams qualifies for social security next month and he’s a mamoth run stuffer, whereas our most pressing need on the interior DL is pass rushing penetration.

  31. Pass-Rushing Productivity for UFA DTs for last season:
    see http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/06/22/three-years-of-pass-rushing-productivity-interior-defensive-linemen/
    GB’s Cullen Jenkins is UFA – ranked 3rd.
    NYJ’s UFA Shaun Ellis ranked 12th.

    UFA DTs for ’08-’10 (last 3 years):
    GB’s Cullen Jenkins – ranks 1st ($$$?).
    NO’s Shaun Rogers – 4th
    SEA’s Brandon Mebane – 18th
    NYJ’s Shaun Ellis – 19th

    Betcha Cullen Jenkins and Shaun Rogers are too expensive for JS & PC. Ellis is an end that gets good pressure when he moves inside on 3rd down, but he’s not a 3-down 3-tech. Sure hope SEA can keep Mebane for next season – unless JS sees something in some DT that hasn’t showed much pressure so far at the 3-tech(?) Kinda like finding Clemons. . .

  32. Oops – GB’s DE Jenkins is in the same category as Ellis. He gets pressure when he moves to the interior on 3rd down, so the only obvious FA alternative to Mebane is S.Rogers if you’re looking at QB pressure.

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