Seahawks Insider

It’s official: Holmgren goes to the Browns

Post by Ryan Divish on Dec. 21, 2009 at 3:54 pm with 71 Comments »
December 21, 2009 4:08 pm
AP photo
AP photo

Eric is en route to Tacoma from the VMAC, so I thought I’d post the link that Mike Holmgren has indeed taken the job with Cleveland Browns.

I know people have had their opinions, so go ahead and post them again.

Dave Boling offered his in today’s paper.

Despite the effort, the Seahawks are the ones facing the pressure now.

Holmgren will find work and get a nice salary for it.

But if the Seahawks don’t find somebody to get busy turning this franchise around, the ghost of Mike Holmgren could turn into a haunting specter.

Steve Kelley of the Seattle Times also did the same, and even talked with Holmgren.

But no matter who offered what during this weekend’s negotiations (the Seahawks did not respond to Holmgren’s claims), football is a bottom-line business and the bottom line of this story is that the Seahawks lost Mike Holmgren.

He wanted the job and they blew it. No matter how they spin it, they didn’t get Holmgren and it could be years before they recover from this blunder.

Holmgren, 61, wanted to finish his football career in Seattle and even after they decided they wanted him, the Hawks let him walk.

Did the Seahawks mess up?

Is this move ultimately better for Holmgren?

Where does Seattle go next?

AP photo
AP photo

I guess this guy’s Christmas wish went unanswered.

Categories:
General Seahawks
Leave a comment Comments → 71
  1. nidhighe says:

    I want to see who we hire as a GM and what they do in their first couple years before I say not getting Holmgren was or wasn’t a mistake. Choosing Holmgren would have been the popular and safe move, though.

    I can understand why Holmgren rejected the Seahawks’ offer. He would still have been reporting to someone else other than the owner, and that someone wouldn’t be a football guy.

    – Danielle

  2. Hope I’m Wrong, but I’m beting the Browns will make the playoffs before we do. Long Before We do if the current regime stays in place.

    After yesterday and the noticeable continuing downward spiral this team is taking instead of getting better during the year we are getting worse.
    The best hit was by the stinking Punter my god
    Why #%%##$%^ COACHING!!!
    It is the players as well due to Timmay not getting any/ few O line in the past few years, but the coaches are Failing Miserably.
    Let the Hammer Start Swinging NOWWWWW!!!!
    The front office did not want Holmgren, even though they made an offer to appease the masses. An offer everyone knew he would not accept.

  3. HawkSoop says:

    I must be the only ‘Hawks fan that isn’t upset by this news. Holmgren was a great coach and a mediocre talent evaluator. He would have been an acceptable GM / PFO type, but it’s doubtful he would have been the instant savior some seem to think.

    It seems to me that the ‘Hawks are being cautious with their moves so far and frankly that’s a good sign because I don’t think they have been all that cautious since they signed Ruskell.

    Let’s take a breath enjoy the remaining football (or closest approximation the current roster and coaching staff can manage) for the season.

  4. williambryan says:

    This means for me that the browns are my new favorite team. I will still watch the hawks and cheer for the players I like but i wont live and die on sunday afternoons anymore. Personally as a fan, I put my loyalties with individuals rather than organizations. I will follow Holmgren wherever he goes. I became a hawks fan when ricky watters came here, and when holmgren came in and brought in (or was at least a part in bringing in) guys like hasselbeck and alexander, i fell in love with this team and have devoted more of my life to this team than i care to say. But i cant love this team blindly while there are such big problems going on. Mainly Mora, and the way the team has been run recently. Releasing Alexander the way they did (is it any coincidence we have been one of the worst teams in the league since he left? I think not. Remember we went to the playoffs even without hutch, but since Shaun left…? nope, we are now a laughing stock.) Obviously the release of SA isn’t the whole picture of why we are what we are, but these football people that have been brought in don’t know football that well. Ruskell and Mora come from a background (Atlanta and Tampa bay) that have produced a combined 1 SB appearance(it was a win but with gruden, a holmgren disciple at HC). while Holmgren has led three SB runs and two wins, (I count SBXL as a win in my heart, there is no question who the better team was).
    So yeah, go Browns, and heres to the hawks waiving forsett and the browns picking him up.

  5. hawkforever21 says:

    Alexander has NOTHING to do with our problems. You don’t think there’s a reason why no other team is interested in signing him, even though he’s been campaigning to get back into the league??

  6. hickhart says:

    Cleveland truely is a football town and the fans there deserve a winning team, they finally have someone who knows how to win. I wish Holmgren the best of luck, and I believe he will have sucess in Cleveland. There’s no reason to think differently, after all he turned this program completely around.

  7. I’m glad he went to cleveland. Holmgren drafted 2 or 3 legitimate players when he was our GM/HC. Alexander and Hutch, maybe tatupu. We’ve seen how replaceable lofa is by Hawthorne.

    Lamar King… Lmao.

  8. vichawkfan says:

    lofa was a ruskell pick. bottom line, he has connections and respect all over the league and THAT are qualaties deserving of a GM and personal man. He will have doors opened that some suit non-football guy won’t.
    Still have a slim hope for Ernie Accosri or Charlie Casserly – you know the guy that passed on Reggie Bush for Mario Williams.

  9. Holmgren didnt draft Tatupu.

  10. GRRR. They’d best find a Football Jack Z or else.

    OKC, any chance of trading the Hawks for the Sonics?

  11. Seahawks2620 says:

    I have just about had enough of Mora’s motivational speeches. I really hope he isn’t here next season. When are we going to see Nick Reed consistently?

  12. What happens when Holmgren comes calling and offers a 4th round pick for Hasselbeck? How many of you guys would take that?

  13. Well first Hutch and now Holmgren. Just can’t stand excellence in Seattle..
    We ran Panella and George Karl outta town and gave the Sonics away. And we keep guys like Mora, Bradley, Knapp, Paul Allen was real dumb on this one. What is it just can’t stand winning?

  14. madpunter88 says:

    I think it is way to early to say the Seahawks blundered in not bringing in Holmgren. Obviously, you have to wait and see the results a few years from now in both Cleveland or Seattle. But more immediately, it was no secret Holmgren was lobbying for full control with Seattle. If the Seahawks — and that includes Paul Allen — really wanted him back and wanted to put the franchise in his hands going forward they would have done so the day after Ruskell resigned. They didn’t; so that should tell us something. It is unfair, possibly naive, to assume they blundered away the chance or just screwed it up. Holgmren probably wanted way too much.

    Cleveland is a lot like Seattle was in 1999 — a franchise willing to turn over full control to one person to provide instant legitimacy and clean-up after a decade of losing. The Seahawks might be reeling this season but the franchise is not in the same dire straits from top to bottom. Turning over the keys to Holmgren and offering him a king’s ransom isn’t really necessary — it might even be counterproductive.

    It is quite possible Seattle never really had a shot with Holmgren because his requests were way out of line with what the front office was looking to do — it was just a fall-back option to use as leverage with Cleveland (or Buffalo, or any other suitor). I like Holmgren a lot. And I am happy for the Browns franchise because he brings instant credibility and excitement to the team. But I don’t know that he was really the prescription for Seattle’s ills.

    Bringing Holmgren back to Seattle may not have had the same punch that a lot of people think. Would it really have invigorated the franchise? Probably not considering how much he was already entwined in a lot of the decisions that got them to their current lowly state. Worst case scenario, it could have given one person way too much power who hasn’t really proven he can handle all of those jobs — something Cleveland is more willing to do. I’m sure Holmgren will be fine — but so would a regular and proven GM (Casserly?).

  15. We get it, pabuwal. You hate Hasselbeck as much as I hated losing Hutch. I won’t mention my obsession again if you stop with your Hasselbeck hatred. Deal?

  16. bird_spit says:

    My Cleveland Browns are back..long live Holmgren!

    Now can some one please fix the hawks. The stench from Qwest was so bad, I thought I moved back to Akron, OH.

  17. Maybe if he proves himself to be a competent NFL QB again, I can stop it.

    I don’t root for specific players like you do Bobby, I root for the laundry. I’ll take OJ Simpson as the QB if he can deliver a Super Bowl Ring. I have blind loyalty to the team, not a specific player. I don’t show up to games wearing a specific jersey, I show up wearing a team shirt. I don’t want to be one of those guys holding onto my memories of what a player was rather than they become.

    I’ve been on this blog since the 05 draft and I haven’t been known as a “Hasselbeck Hater” until this year. Even last year, when he played horribly, I gave him the benefit of the doubt. But he has only had 1 year of the last 4 with a QB rating above 80. The team is among the franchise worst, so now it’s time to speak up.

    Maybe you can answer this question on Hasselbeck that I have been trying to figure out. This year he has been sacked among the least ever in his career on a percentage basis, yet he has fumbled the most ever on an absolute basis. He has fumbled the third most in the NFL. I was always amazed at the lack of his fumbling after watching Krieg/Moon/Kitna all those years. His care of the ball was incredible.

    So my question is, Has he lost grip strength due to injury and is this why his throwing ability is so limited?

  18. snydro22 says:

    I think it was a fair question, BobbyK.. Don’t speak for anyone but yourself.. And really, you are the biggest broken record in the history of the internet..

    pabuwal,

    I think history has shown with Holmgren that we can do MUCH better than a 4th round pick for Hass.. If only we still had Vinson..

    I love that all the fairweathers are jumping ship.. I like elbow room..

  19. ………………..This means for me that the browns are my new favorite team. I will still watch the hawks and cheer for the players I like but i wont live and die on sunday afternoons anymore. Personally as a fan, I put my loyalties with individuals rather than organizations. I will follow Holmgren wherever he goes. I became a hawks fan when ricky watters came here, and when holmgren came in and brought in (or was at least a part in bringing in) guys like hasselbeck and alexander, i fell in love with this team and have devoted more of my life to this team than i care to say. But i cant love this team blindly while there are such big problems going on. Mainly Mora, and the way the team has been run recently. Releasing Alexander the way they did (is it any coincidence we have been one of the worst teams in the league since he left? I think not. Remember we went to the playoffs even without hutch, but since Shaun left…? nope, we are now a laughing stock.) Obviously the release of SA isn’t the whole picture of why we are what we are, but these football people that have been brought in don’t know football that well. Ruskell and Mora come from a background (Atlanta and Tampa bay) that have produced a combined 1 SB appearance(it was a win but with gruden, a holmgren disciple at HC). while Holmgren has led three SB runs and two wins, (I count SBXL as a win in my heart, there is no question who the better team was).
    So yeah, go Browns, and heres to the hawks waiving forsett and the browns picking him up………………….

    Williambryan, Exact Ditto for me man. You have described exactly how I feel. Go Browns, it is going to be exciting to see how Mike will build the Browns? Do you think Mangini is out and Haskell and Zorn are in?

  20. Dukeshire says:

    “I love that all the fairweathers are jumping ship.” – No kidding. In this thread alone there are 3 people kicking the ‘Hawks to the curb for the Browns. Adversity really does reveal peoples’ true character.

  21. Before we start losing our hair, let’s let our GM scouting take shape. You never know if the names that we are looking at, have the next “big show” in the making among them.

    Thanks for everything Mike.

  22. nighthawk2 says:

    The only thing about Alexander that is affecting this team is that the money that should have gone to Steve Hutchinson went to him instead. I’m still not sure if we’re done paying for his contract.

    If Holmgren was such a mediocre judge of talent, how is it that 95% of the roster in 2005 that went to the Super Bowl were his guys? I don’t know if he’ll be a great team prez in Cleveland or not, but I do think he was treated shabbily by this organization the last couple of years.

  23. GO BROWNS
    GO MARINERS
    GO HUSKIES
    Enough said.

  24. snydro – I can’t speak for anyone else but you can throw out personal attacks like candy or butt into someone else’s comment conversation and that’s okay? I’m certainly not without flaws, but you are a real piece of work. Oh, I forgot, this is the part why you throw your pacifier and challenges someone to a duel and asks them to meet in whatever location. Maybe this type of childish behavior is accepted in a 3rd world country in turmoil, but a civilized society doesn’t need to resort to this classlessness. Go ahead and go off, I know you will, but I’m done mudslinging. I just needed to get something off my chest. The last word is yours…

  25. BORNHAWK says:

    CYRREEN/Williambryan:-I’m sure if you google “Cleveland Browns blogs” you can find a nice place to be bandwagon fans. Please make your way their and don’t come back once we start winning again, and with are owner I can promise you that it will happen again real soon. I love how these people jump overboard during the bad times but can sure hang around when theirs a chance to win. Go away, your like a bad rash.

  26. Have any of you ever told a parent that you hated them when you were a teen? I think a lot of us have (although I didn’t do it much – I have the scars to prove you talk back like that too often) even if we’re not proud of it. [and if there are any teen Hawk fans on the blog, getting on my high horse for a moment, please think before you do it b/c if you're like me there's a chance you lose one of them when you're a teen too].

    My point is that some of the people who are claiming to be Browns fans now… well, they are going through part of Duke’s 5 stages of denial that he mentioned on the blog the other day.

    It’s not (I don’t think) that they are turning their backs on the Hawks. They are just mad and saying some things (we all have) that they don’t really mean in their hearts.

    If, by some act of God, we find ourselves playing the Browns in the Super Bowl next season — you can rest assured that they are probably going to be here with us rooting for Hawks.

    But one nice thing about following the team through thick and thin… can you imagine how sweet it will be to actually win a Super Bowl?

    My only fear is that we end up like a Red Sox fan and live our life and never see a championship before we expire.

    But the law of averages are on our side (I’m being optimistic) in seeing one in the next 32 years:)

  27. “I love that all the fairweathers are jumping ship.”

    Amen. Sometimes I type LOL and I don’t actuallt laugh out loud. But seeing people actually say they’re deciding to be Browns fans…that made me literally LOL. That is funny, and infinately pathetic. Well done tossers.

  28. madpunter88 says:

    I can’t believe someone would switch allegiances from one team to another because they were so enamored with the Vice President of Football Operations. You guys need to take a step back and don’t jump ship yet. Paul Allen has a lot invested in this team and cares about success. Todd Leiweke is probably not the buffoon you think he is either. Give them a chance to make things right before you join the Browns bandwagon. After all, you begged and begged for Ruskell to be let go. That happened and before they can even name a replacement you’re crying about it.

    The only thing more absurd would be choosing a favorite team because you liked their helmets…wait, that makes complete sense to me!

  29. madpunter88 – that’s funny. LOL. Through thick and thin, my friend.

  30. This stings for people like hearing your ex girlfriend got married. But in the end, you find someone better. Don’t jump ship yet.

  31. BORNHAWK says:

    No, please jump ship, we don’t need people that weak, the team is already looked at as soft.

  32. Dukeshire says:

    hawks31 – Not bad. He included some names that he admitted would never come here. But all in all it was interesting.

  33. vichawkfan says:

    anyone have thoughts on who we might hire?

  34. Dukeshire says:

    I agree with this, and would encourage such a press conference.

    http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/11437/seahawks-need-to-reassure-fan-base

  35. Well – I will continue to care less about the Browns – though I suppose I wish Holmgren well, I certainly don’t wish him ill.

    I do think the desire for him to come back (mine included) was a bit of a grasp at straws, at the hope that his coming back would fix everything. And the reality is, it probably wouldn’t, certainly not in the real short run. And as credible of a coach as he was, he doesn’t have (not yet , at least) the franchise building credentials of Parcells or Jimmy Johnson.

    So – where do we go from here? This season has been a real dispiriting eye-opener, I honestly didn’t think we would be anywhere near this bad as training camp began, and now I wonder what I was missing.

    Re the Mora question – one thing I noted today, I read some article about the Browns and Mangini’s situation, and more than one player said that they hoped he stays. Mora’s on a similar hot seat, and have i missed it, has any player come out and said that he hopes he’s around next year? I don’t think they have . . . not a good sign that he’s still got the team playing for him.

  36. I have been following this blog for over a year and I think it is the best Seahawks conversation place. That is why I am joining. All I want to do is talk Seahawks football. I hope nobody wants to tell me how dumb I am I can tell you right now that I am not the best Seahawks fan but I like them. They are my favorite team. I will say from other blogs that I do not like when people get on there high horse but I understand this is part of some. For the most part this blog doesn’t seem to go there to much. I do not usualy have alot to say but I hope its ok if I try to blog on here sometimes. Thanks to alot of you for making the blog what it is. Eric to. Thanks. I thought I would join now since we are at a low point and I want to follow them thru there highest point and I hope we get there one day. I am so happy Ruskell is gone. See what he has done.

  37. Dukeshire says:

    Welcome aboard, it’s a great time to get involved. Anyone can be a fan of success but nothing feels quite as good a winning after you’ve been totally invested. Don’t be a stranger and look forward to reading your takes.

  38. Dukeshire says:

    pdway – That was brought up yesterday as well. Not one player has taken up for Mora or any member of the staff with the exception of Ruskell, in the press. Very telling.

  39. Thank you. For what it is worth I have expecialy enjoyed your comments this last year. I will not ever pretend to know more aobut the team than someone like you but I hope people can accept other views to. Thank you again.

  40. Hawkfan1951 says:

    This was to be expected after the Seahawks less than “good faith” offer over the weekend. I wish Mike Holmgren and his family well. I will miss his interviews, et al.

    Now, for good or ill, Seahawks fans look to the new GM/President/Director of Player Personnel to see who will run the show… if they’re allowed too!

    I’m a Seahawk fan from the first day. I’ve lived thru Patera, Behring/Flores, Ericson, Mirer, Stoffer and Brian Bozeworth… I’ll live through this.

    To me, being a fan is like having a “Best Friend.” I may not like everything my Best Friend does, I may kick him in his assessts when he does something especially stupid… but he’s still my Best Friend. I’ll stick with him threw thick and thin.

    This is one of the Seahawks “thin times!”

    Best of luck Mike. Thank you for your time here!

    Now, GO HAWKS!!!

  41. Seahawks2620, good point about Nick Reed. he’s basically disappeared, & it isn’t like the front 4 is exactly tearing up the opposing qb………….

    Paul Allen, PLEASE fire Mora. Please……………. Pretty Please………..

  42. I’m wondering Cleveland is going to get seriously dinged on Rooney, & if not WHY NOT?

  43. When you are down in the dumps, as we are, it’s always more fun to look towards the future.

    One frustrating thing about this year, as another blogger pointed out a few weeks ago (sorry, don’t remember which one to give credit to) is the uncertainty of the CBA.

    If anyone wants to understand, what I didn’t understand, here is a really good read to see who will actually be a FA if there’s no CBA:

    http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d81423860&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

    If there’s no CBA, this means there’s no way we can use FA to fill any major holes (not that FA fills ALL the holes — or the Redskins would be worldbeaters)…

    Good-bye to any real OL that we NEED such as Jahri Evans, Logan Mankins, Marcus McNeill, or whoever.

    Hello to a “sucktastic” existence with respect to our franchise in the next few years with respect to competing.

    Case in point, this is a terrible time to have a CBA “freeze” on FA if you’re a terrible franchise (like us). There’s no way to go out and get a guy like Jahri Evans, who you can be almost guaranteed will be a Pro Bowler in 2011.

    Basically, I have wanted to try to ignore this aspect, but with a terrible season upon us and, mercifully, almost over… it’s time to think next year (as many have, like some of us, for over a month).

    If this is the case, I advocate a QB (pabuwal, you will be happy) and as many trade downs as possible. And I don’t feel the need to trade down for picks in this years draft, as it seems we’re doomed for mediocrity anyways (unfortunately)… I am talking about adding as many picks as possible for ’12 and ’13. If we can’t have “now” there’s no reason we can’t have the future.

    Besides, it’s always easier to trade down for future picks (as GMs don’t always think long-term… b/c if they lose, like Ruskell, they won’t be around long enough to make those picks anyways). I remember Atlanta and KC last year talking about Gonzo. KC wanted a 2nd rounder in ’09 and Atl didn’t want to offer one until ’10. Well, no matter what, it’s still going to be a 2nd rounder (so now Atl doesn’t have its 2nd rounder this year)… and if we don’t get picks until a year or two from now… I don’t care… I want an unfair Seahawk advantage (like Pitt in SBXL) any way I can get it and if it means with respect to the future… so be it…

  44. Oh by the way, SFHawk, as Duke said — welcome aboard. The more, the merrier. What is “SF” anyways? I think I know what the “Hawk” part is:)

  45. As much as some can make fun of the Browns:

    Can we say we have a franchise LT? Do we have lots of draft picks from ’09 and ’10 (the Browns have loaded up, in part, by trading guys that have made them suck THIS year like Winslow and Edwards, to name a few).

    As much pride as we have in our team… not saying I agree with this… just throwing it out there… but maybe Holmy thinks that he has a better or easier chance to win with the Browns???

    They do have some ‘young’ talent. We are better but our talent is older. Maybe he simply decided the Browns offer was better (money/talent/draftpicks)? Sure, we have an extra #1 this year, but the Browns have their #3 (in addition to a BUNCH of other picks). Just saying…

  46. hickhart says:

    Should have used the franchise tag on Holmgren.

  47. williambryan says:

    Cyrreen,
    I definitely think Mangini is out and some familiar faces will show up in cleveland. Mike Lombardi said today on NFLN that Mangini’s and Holmgrens philosophies are so different it just doesn’t make any football sense to keep him.

    And about Alexander, how many playoffs have the hawks made since he was cut? someone tell me please?…. whats that? oh yeah, the hawks haven’t sniffed 500 in the time since have they? Look, I dont want to rile up anyone, some people love alexander some dont, and it really doesnt matter anymore, so I will let that go.

    And for me personally, I am not jumping ship. many fans may be “jumping ship” but i put my allegiance in people. I respect all of the hawk fans that bleed blue and, these days, lime green. I really do. but mow you guys are at the mercy of whatever some “firm” decides is best for the team…That has to instill some confidence right? how many of those guys have ever bothered to watch a hawks game? eventually the hawks will win again, maybe as soon as next year if some one with a shred of common sense takes over and gets rid of Mora and his whole staff. and when the teeam comes back you can say that you were there through the worst of times and never stopped believing, and thats awesome. I will always be a hawk fan but not to a fault that i will pay to see a disfunctional product that could have easily been avoided. I love Holmgren and will go wherever he goes. I love Forsett I will go where he goes, I will always love Alexander and Ricky Watters. When Clyde Drexler went to the Rockets I cheered for him just as much as i did when he was a blazer. I hope that some of you can respect that there are all kinds of ways to enjoy sports and you don’t have to be tied to a football team that is led by any number of people who we will never know, and they will never know us, pulling the strings of a team that means so much to you but only a paycheck for them.

  48. the hawks are still my team. i’m not going anywhere.

    whatever i think of the moves the front office/holmy/timmay! made or didn’t make, i still cheer for one team and one team only.

    a TEAM. individual players retire, get hurt, or never live up to their draft stock, but the TEAM moves on.

    none of this “go browns” crapola, here… i bleed seahawk blue.

    but that neon ultra green stuff… that’s pushing it ^_^

  49. I have also been reading this blog for a long time and often come here for some perspective on the Hawks news every day.
    As a Hawk fan from the UK, I will not pretend to know everything. But following SFHawks footsteps, I too think this is a time to rally around our Hawks and not to jump ship. Thanks for making this blog entertaining, and I hope to add to the discussions where I can. Go Hawks!

  50. BobbyAyala says:

    It’s hard to stomach this franchise right now.

  51. I don’t know williambryan,

    I agree that as consumers, we MUST make sure management is aware of our dissatisfaction with the product. Further, I don’t hold it against anyone who’s distaste for the current direction of the franchise forces them to quit on them.
    All that said…
    Don’t take it personally, but diehard fans never quit. We put bags on our heads and call for the heads of failing leadership. We go for the comraderie more than the game itself. We go and watch our beloved Hawks, we enjoy having them, win – lose – or worse, lose to Tampa. Personally, I am seriously concerned about the direction we are headed, but in the immortal words of the late Heath Ledger, “I can’t quit you”. I will never quit on the Hawks. I will voice my opinion on the “state of the Hawks” and call it like I see it, but always root for the Seattle Seahawks. Besides, while the games are painful to watch, the bad times make the offseason more exciting!!

    Understand, this is my opinion and my take… I don’t pretend to judge others “fandom”, we are all different humans… you do you and I’ll do me… ok?
    As for me… I have been a Hawks fan since boyhood, my first game was a Raiders-Hawks game (I’m from Sac) and I loved them since that day. I wore #80 in Pop Warner and in High School (went with #32 in basketball, since you don’t have 8 fingers on one hand…)

    ~ Jake

  52. Alexander was actually a very good pass blocker his last few years with the Seahawks. How many times did you see free blitzers coming through to nail Hasselbeck with him picking up blitzes? Jones and Forsett not only guess wrong in pass protection but Jones gets blown up way too much. Free blitzers have a party now on Hasselbeck.

    BobbyK, I’ll take you at QB at this point if you can get the job done. You seem tall enough although a bit on the older side.

    If a new GM comes in, I doubt he keeps Hasselbeck and Wallace. These guys generally like to start with their own QBs.

  53. pabuwal – and I’ll take you at left guard:)

  54. Good comeback – that’s funny.

  55. chuck_easton says:

    I can’t believe how many people are saying they are going to now root for the Browns just because they hired Holmgren.

    Obviously these people didn’t start rooting for Seattle until 2005 when the team finally became something on the NFL radar. Good riddence. As Snydro said just makes more room for us true fans that have been rooting for this team through thick and thin (and there was a LOT of thin in the 90′s).

    If your only reason for rooting for a team is to root for the GM/coach you aren’t a real fan and we can do without you. As the saying goes, ‘don’t let the door hit your rearend on the way out…’

  56. chuck_easton says:

    A little history for those people who are either too young to remember or only started following the team when they started winning this decade.

    The Nordstrom family originally bought the franchise. They ran the team in from the late 70′s into the late 80′s. They were good owners but they really didn’t know football and stayed out of things.

    Ken Behring bought the team in the 90′s. It was obvious that his one and only desire from day one was to move the team to California and he did everything he could to put such a bad product on the field so he could drive the fans away. When attendance dropped he was able to claim that Seattle wouldn’t support an NFL team and the moving vans were ready to go.

    Paul Allen came in when no other local business people would buy the team and saved football in Seattle. For that alone he has my personal everlasting gratitude. The fact that under his ownership the team turned into a winner is secondary to the fact that they are still the SEATTLE SEAHAWKS and not the Fresno Seahawks.

    I can take players coming and going. I can take coaches coming and going. I will live with Mike Holmgren not running the show. But I could never root for the Seahawks again the day they no longer are attached to SEATTLE.

  57. Dukeshire says:

    “Alexander was actually a very good pass blocker his last few years with the Seahawks” With due respect, that is revisionist history. He became passable. But the reason free blitzers were not allowed to get to Matt uncontested was Mack Strong and better blitz recognition up front. He was bigger than either Jones or Forsett and that had as much to do with him slowing the pass rusher down as technique. In fact I’ll take Forsett and Jones over Alexander if it’s a only matter of fundamentals, but of course there is more too it than that.

  58. HawkSoop says:

    “Paul Allen came in when no other local business people would buy the team and saved football in Seattle. For that alone he has my personal everlasting gratitude.”

    Amen.

  59. Dukeshire says:

    Well said Chuck. I think for those who don’t remember or weren’t around for the move scare, it’s really difficult to illustrate how awful that was. I will never forget driving across the Aurora Bridge and listening to the DJ on KMTT cut in and tell us that moving vans were poised outside Kirkland headquarters. Oh my god, I was sick. I could not believe it was happening. They had mini camps in Anaheim that year too. Then Mr. Allen stepped in… I’m with you Chuck.

  60. Ok, so Alexander had better blitz recognition and was bigger – but he still slowed/stopped the blitzer and this is more than we can say about the current crop of RBs.

    Speaking of revisionist history, you guys have some here with Paul Allen. He only bought the team because he forced the State of Washington to build himself a brand new state of the art stadium. He wasn’t going to buy the team without this. The vote narrowly passed due to tremendous support in King County and low support statewide.

    Thanks to this incredible subsidization, the Seahawks were one of Paul Allen’s few good investments of the past 20 years. And he thanks the fans for this! But he wasn’t doing anyone any favors for free here.

  61. I find it funny to see that a Blog entry regarding Holmgren signing with the Browns, can end up discussing the merits of past and present RB pass blocking abilities. That is the charm of this blog though – a new opinion can spark a whole new set of entries.

    I think that Alexander did improve his pass blocking, however, didn’t he mostly get taken out of obvious pass plays so that Mack Strong could take care of Hasselbeck?

    I think this is the real problem with our situation at the moment, Hass doesn’t trust those around him! Holmgren groomed an offense to suit Matt Hasselbeck – without his support (both OL and RB’s), he has lost confidence, and his performances have been more and more unpredicable! Another thing Ruskell failed to address.
    An offense should be built from the O-Line, but built around a QB (whoever that may be in the Hawks future).

  62. princeaden says:

    I’m afraid that whoever is hired to fill the position(s) left by the TR resignation is walking into a beehive. We will need patience. This is not going to be a quick fix. As long as the team is moving in a positive direction, I for one will support them(IMO that means getting rid of this coaching staff to begin with). Even if they don’t immediately dismiss the Coaching staff, as long as they have a good draft, FA period and cut loose some of the obvious overpaid non productive players, I would call that improvement.

  63. bulldog80 says:

    I think that the idea of a “state of the franchise” press conference is a good one. The fact that they aren’t releasing any info, to me, shows that they might not really understand the frustration of the fan base.

    I hope you guys getting excited about Holmgren can get a grip. Sure it would have been a feelgood story, but it’s just as likely that he will fail again as a GM. He was far from excellence in that position and there really isn’t any evidence to show that he’d be any better on the second time around.

    I’m far more worried about our coaching situation than our GM situation. The coaching has much broader implications on our product on the field. Good coaching puts players in the right positions and prepares them for success in those positions regardless of the players talent level. I am now sure that our lack of success this year has everything to do with poor coaching and leadership.

    Changes need to be made on this team across the board and we need a new GM that will do that without hesitation. I don’t believe Holmgren would have done that. He has always shown loyalty to a fault even when the player, or coach, has proven himself to be ineffective.

    We only have one direction to go guys, up

  64. Dukeshire says:

    pabuwal – I never said Alexander had good blitz recognition. Just the opposite, he was terrible at that. I said the “guys up front” meaning the offensive line. Alexander avoided contact in the backfield, whether carrying the football or on the rare occasions he stayed in to block, like the plague.

    And how is the generalization that Paul Allen stepped up and bought the team when no one else would, revisionist?

  65. HawkSoop says:

    “Speaking of revisionist history, you guys have some here with Paul Allen. He only bought the team because he forced the State of Washington to build himself a brand new state of the art stadium. He wasn’t going to buy the team without this. The vote narrowly passed due to tremendous support in King County and low support statewide.”

    Allen invested heavily in the team even at those critical moments… here is an article from the time by Peter King of SI.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1009951/1/index.htm

    So yes he wasn’t going to by the team without a new stadium, but he was willing to contribute up to $200 million of the estimated $425 million needed.

  66. Duke – fair enough.

  67. “I can take players coming and going. I can take coaches coming and going. I will live with Mike Holmgren not running the show. But I could never root for the Seahawks again the day they no longer are attached to SEATTLE.”

    Exactly right.

    Which is why it still tears my heart a little bit every time I see Kevin Durant lighting up a boxscore. Can’t root for the Thunder/Sonics any more than I could the Oklahoma Seahawks . . .

  68. PA bought the team for $194M, then Washington Legislature gave him $300M. The value of the team went to $1,010M in ’08 and has gone back to like $997M or so this year. Revenues are up but so are players expenses, so profit is down for the first time since PA bought the team. That was Behring’s excuse to move the team, that and complaints about the Kingdome. LA guys are talking to PA, still trying to buy the Hawks for the largest market in the west.

    Hawks need to start winning like they used to or butts will leave the seats. Even if revenues don’t drop, an uncapped year means players agents are drooling at this coming offseasons profits they’re expecting from windfall-type player contracts. Not a good time – profit-wise – to be rebuilding a team with FAs, but at least Hawks can legally clear alotta dead cap from yet to be paid guaranteed bonuses for players who no longer contribute much on the field.

    The GM that PA & TL end up with had better be the very best there is, because he’ll not only have to land running, he’ll have to restock the Hawks pantry with players who’se talents match the needs of Mora’s schemes while getting miserly contracts – giving away PA’s $s like throwing manhole covers.

    PA’s not a well man. If I have a cold and bad news hits me I tend to snap back. The fuse is shortened. This GM has to be the right fit, or else.

  69. williambryan says:

    I was going to let the alexander topic go but then this happened:
    Dukeshire says:
    December 22, 2009 at 6:14 am
    “Alexander was actually a very good pass blocker his last few years with the Seahawks” With due respect, that is revisionist history. He became passable. But the reason free blitzers were not allowed to get to Matt uncontested was Mack Strong and better blitz recognition up front. He was bigger than either Jones or Forsett and that had as much to do with him slowing the pass rusher down as technique. In fact I’ll take Forsett and Jones over Alexander if it’s a only matter of fundamentals, but of course there is more too it than that

    Dukeshire, You are obviously a good contributor to this blog and that was evidenced by the staff giving you the first guest blog (congratulations). But its revisionist history to say what you did above. you speak in such general terms. the games i watched (in the SA era) there were several times SA was left alone in the backfield in a singleback set and there were several times Mack was left alone in singleback set. SA made a number of blocks and of course he made errors in pass pro, EVERY BACK WHO HAS EVER PLAYED HAS! even mack strong, even LT, Jim Brown, any back you can name has been beat in pass pro. My point is that SA did his job at a high level including blocking and pass catching. If the ball is not thrown your way you cant get catches (as was the case post 2005 for SA. Somehow he managed to get plenty of catches before that, over 40 for 3 straight seasons and in 04 he had 4 recieving TD’s).
    Example: miles austin…. if you dont throw him the ball, as the cowboys didn’t up until halfway through this year, he is a no body. Romo throws him the ball…Now he is a star, a playmaker, blah, blah. He is the same guy he always was but now he gets the ball. If holmgren wanted to call 10 screens a game SA would have got at least 9 receptions a game. Alexander can catch, he can block, and he is the best RB the seahawks will ever have known. the numbers dont lie.

  70. The more i think about it, there was SOMETHING dysfunctional in the relationship between the Hawks & Holmgren, which has played out pretty publicly. I have no idea whether Holmy, Lewicke, both or someone else is to blame, but my current thinking is no matter how good MH is (& I was rooting for him to get the job0, with this much drama & dysfunction already between the 2 parties, it flat out wouldn’t have worked.

    It may have been a simple power struggle between Lewicke & Holmgren, or it may have been much more; but why doesn’t really matter; it flat out would have been a mess.

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