Seahawks starting cornerbacks Marcus Trufant and Josh Wilson both did not participate in practice today and are listed as having concussions in the team’s injury report.
It appears both are sitting out just as a precaution, and should be back at practice at some point this week. Both were out on the field today.
DT Craig Terrill (shoulder) also did not participate in practice.
Running back Julius Jones (bruised long) is listed as out, but was out at practice this afternoon.
Center Chris Spencer (thumb) was a full participant in practice.
For Minnesota, DT Fred Evans did not participate in practice.
WR Bernard Berrian, CB Benny Sapp, FB Naufahu Tahi (ankle), CB Antoine Winfield (foot), QB Brett Favre (groin/hip) were limited participant in practice.
LB E.J. Henderson was a full participant in practice.
Count Minnesota running back Adrian Peterson among the Vikings happy that former Seahawks offensive guard Steve Hutchinson is part of their team.
“I’m doing a dance right now because we got him and y’all don’t,” Peterson said when asked about Hutchinson. “He’s the ring leader of the offensive line. It’s still funny to me how y’all let this guy go. But he’s a leader. He gets the job done. And he’s a beast. That’s the way I explain how he is on the field.”
Seattle wide receiver T.J. Houshmandzadeh talked about his decision to sign with Seattle over Minnesota in free agency during the offseason. Houshmandzadeh said Minnesota made it tough because he felt comfortable there and like the owner and the offensive coaching staff. Houshmandzadeh said the money was about the same between Seattle, Minnesota and Cincinnati, but that he ultimately picked Seattle because he felt most comfortable there and liked the Seahawks quarterback situation better at the time.
But with Brett Favre with the Vikings, does he feel differently?
“Had he been there I don’t know what would have happened,” he said. “He wasn’t there, so I felt I had to do what was best for me. And if you look at both teams, yeah I knew Minnesota was going to be good, but I thought we were going to be really good, too.
“So hindsight is better than foresight, you know? And like I say, nine games into it, it doesn’t look like I made a great decision, but it’s too early.”
Thanks alot, AP. Rub it in. And you’re right, he is a beast and a leader.
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“And like I say, nine games into it, it doesn’t look like I made a great decision, but it’s too early.””
Sounds like an acute case of buyer’s remorse to me. Have some more Jone’s Soda, Housh.
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Had no idea Trufant and Wilson got their bells rung. Maybe it’s just an excuse for getting abused by the Cards once again (Wilson not as much as Trufant). Like now we’re all supposed to say, “Oh, that must be why they were having such a hard time covering them.”
Also, you can’t blame AP (thought it was AD?) for his comments. I’m sure if we still had Hutch then Alexander, yes Alexander, would still be putting up big numbers and “doing a dance” as well. See, Ruskell could’ve covered his own mistake of signing Shaun to his big money deal if he would’ve franchised Hutch, because #37 would still be “looking” like a premier NFL RB.
Ruskell should be canned immediately after the game on Sunday after watching that dime-a-dozen LG of theirs clear the way for 200+ yards on the ground against HIS defense.
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To bad we’re beyond the trade dead line. Cincy lost Henry to a broken arm and I’m sure they would love to have him back. Enough so that they would offer a high draft pick.:)
Nothing personal Housh. You had an outstanding outing against the Cards but with Engram out of work I do believe we could manage with his rehire.
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The Minnesota media is making fun of the Houshe situation b/c if the Vikings would have signed him, they probably wouldn’t have drafted (the criminal) Percy Harvin (which was a steal). We get screwed by the Vikes in FA again. We eat up a bunch of money on an old, overrated possession WR, and then they get better anyways.
Lets talk for a moment about the ’98 NFC Championship Game. That was fun! Good times. I hope they make it to the Super Bowl and either get screwed like we did or lose on a 60 yard Hail Mary with no time left. Something that stings really, really bad.
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Our O line would be a hell of a lot better, but Alexander would still look like crap. He hit the wall and was to scared to get hit.
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what an embarrassing franchise.
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F you Mora
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This week is the perfect example of the differences between good suits and bad suits.
Someone send Wally Walker 2 packing.
Please.
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I think it’s going to be ugly on Sunday and hopefully this will he the end for ruskell, we are about to get our asses handed to us on offence and defence, I just can’t see how we can compete when we r about to be over powered on both lines. What makes it worse…..my five year old is a huge Vikings fan and even he is taunting me….don’t worry guys he’s grounded till he is forty and I took his ps3 from him…… Go hawks…….please
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Oh and go ruskell…. Please just go…..
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Due to my own bitterness, I hope like a blind squirrel occaisionally finds a nut, a Seahawk defender happens to collide with AP at full speed and breaks his body into 100 little pieces.
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Amazing to think that should the Seahawks make a deal with the devil and win this game, it will be their greatest road win since the 1990 game against the Chiefs. And that’s something when you consider all the talented teams the Seahawks have had since then.
Guys, the OL would have been better had they kept Hutch, but most of the rest of the offense was old and was on the decline after 2005. Hutch wouldn’t have stopped that. Jones played well in 07 and 08 but had a tough (by GoAT’s standards) 2006, Tobeck lasted only a few more games, Strong had to retire early in the 07 season, Hannam basically never played again, Chris Gray was just plain old, Alexander was hitting 30, Mili was old and Hasselbeck has had only one Matt Hasselbeck year (2007) of the last 4.
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I’ve been a Hawk fan from the beginning, but only read this blog for the last year or so. Did Ruskell really say that OG were a dime-a-dozen when Hutch was lost. If this is true he should be ushered out of town on that alone. Football needs good football players at each position……Period…….Ruskell is not only an idiot but an A$$hole as well.
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To Ruskell, Hutch was “just a guard.”
princeaden – I feel your pain about Hutch. I could have handled it better, but he came here of all places. A hall of famer in his prime. Terrible. Terrible. Terrible. I’m a bit extra sensitive about it this particular week.
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Princeaden – I don’t remember Ruskell ever saying that exactly. His actions in handling his contract and subsequent attempts to replace him would indicate that is how he feels about the position, however.
Lefty24 – I don’t know about Tru but Wilson got his tackling Wells. He was laying on the ground for 2 or 3 minutes with Dr.s surrounding him before coming out. He missed several plays but came back in to finish the game.
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Icertainly hope that Ruskell takes his Little puppet Mora with him.
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Yeah, I thought Wilson got his bell rung pretty good. I thought it was a bad shoulder injury at first. He’s one tough little buggar! Can’t help but not like guys like Wilson.
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Just a couple things that make me feel a little better when I think about the Hutch thing:
What Minnesota did was dirty and underhanded. The poison pill was upheld in a court of law but it was certainly against the spirit of the league rules, invalidated the transition tag for all teams for the life of the CBA and angered the hell out of the other owners.
Minnesota hasn’t won diddly yet with Steve Hutchinson. 1 playoff game. A loss. At least Seattle has played 4 playoff games since he left and won two of them.
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Man, Im so sick of Housh’s quotes. The kind of guy who will only be happy in front of a mirror.
“Can’t help but not like guys like Wilson.”
I Totally agree BK, and thats one of the things that give me hope. I love guys like Wilson, Forsett, and Hawthorn. Not overly physically opposing, just work-hard, competetive football players. I wish we had more personalities like that on our team. Can’t put my finger on it…what word I would use to describe that quality…but it’s there…
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I don’t think I love him as much as Duke, but I sure like him.
I keep drinking the Derrick Morgan kool-aid. Definitely fills a need.
http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=4662972&name=nfl_draft&action=upsell&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fespn%2fblog%2findex%3fentryID%3d4662972%26name%3dnfl_draft
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I wish the GM and the rest of the Hawks staff would read some of the things that are written on here. They could definitly use some of the ideas you all have been saying!
I didn’t like the Housh signing to begin with. The Wide Receiver position didn’t need revamping.. At least not in my opinion! Especially not to the extent they gave it this year! I would see who wants Housh after this year and maybe trade for some decent Offensive Line help! I mean, at this rate, it’s not like they’d get many big offers for Housh at this point!!
Oh, and as a running back, isn’t it true (to some degree anyway) that your really just as good as your offensive line?
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jesus spirits are down on here – -
“We get screwed by the Vikes in FA again. We eat up a bunch of money on an old, overrated possession WR, and then they get better anyways. ”
That doesn’t even make sense – Vikes would have been happy to have Housh if we hadn’t done so; and I’m happy to have him on the team. He’s an asset, and will continue to be. Not sure what he’s done on the field that makes you wish the Vikes had signed him and not us.
“I’ve been a Hawk fan from the beginning, but only read this blog for the last year or so. Did Ruskell really say that OG were a dime-a-dozen when Hutch was lost.”
You know what Ruskell did? He offered Hutch more money than any guard had ever been paid in the history of the league. More money (i believe) than any O-lineman other than the top few LT’s in the league. Yes, in hindsight, he f-ed up by not franchising him, esp since we have failed to replace him, and he’s continued to be great – but sometimes the revisionist history drives me a little crazy. They transitioned him b/c they thought they could work out a long-term deal, and Hutch basically split town, ditching a team that had just made a super bowl, and, at the time, looked like it would make more, for a deal that he knew with certainty we couldn’t match b/c of the poison pill clauses. So, please, let’s not treat the guy like he’s some maltreated hero – he’s not. There was plenty of f–k Hutch sentiment at the time he opted to get out of Seattle.
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Well, either that or your as good as your offensive line allows you to be?! Im not to sure what I’m saying anymore, so I’ll pipe down!
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If the draft were today, we’d pick somewhere between 7-10. (Derrick Morgan) We know we’ll probably lose on Sunday so it could get higher (although I expect to win at St Louis the following week).
The Denver pick would be between 23-28. (Brian Bulaga) I think Denver is showing their true colors and won’t be picking this high, which means we may get Bulaga in the late teens or early twenties.
Several mock drafts have us taking Nate Allen, a FS from Central Fla, with our 2nd rounder.
I’d certainly be happy with a draft like that (depending on FA and if we could sign one of the better FA guards to create less of a need in the draft with respect to the OL). My only problem is I think we need a game breaking RB with 4.4 speed to compliment Forsett. I wonder if a guy like Best is available early in the 2nd if Ruskell would contemplate trading a #1 in ’11 for a chance to get a playmaker with speed. I’m not saying this is what I’d do, just throwing a scenario out there. If he does sign a 2 year extention, he may indeed feel the pressure to win in ’10 and that could/would promt a move like this.
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Cornutt, listening to the media, you just never know who the locker room cancer may have been. Housh out and Cincy back and rolling.
Couple week back Forsett fumbled inside right. The ball went right to the man covering Housh, inside left. Had Manmomma made any attempt to make a block the ball would have squirted out to him. Worse, pusszotta looked like peter pan on pixxy dust chasing after the then ball carrier. Seriously. Another case of the Ruskell character guy.
The kicker was pusszotta complaining to Matt for the line drive pass. Motioning for more air under the ball.
HEY Housh… grow some wheels,,, ya dino(sour) burger!
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pdway – for the record, I was irate the second Hutch wasn’t franchised. And my comments in the archives support this.
I think you may have misunderstood some of what I said. The Vikings have said that they would NOT have drafted Percy Harvin if they had landed TJ in FA. That’s what’s been in the news here in Minnesota. Obviously, Harvin has been one of the top rookies in the NFL (if not the most valuable). I hate the Vikings!!! I’m so mad!!!
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Guys, stop complaining about Houshmandzadeh. It is clear that despite his big mouth he is easily the most talented WR on the team and one of the finest in the NFC. Just think of the alternatives. Would you rather have Deion Branch starting? Frankly I’m tired of seeing Hasselbeck ‘overthrow’ him on passes that any other WR taller than 5’8″ would be able to catch with ease.
“Ruskell should be canned immediately after the game on Sunday after watching that dime-a-dozen LG of theirs clear the way for 200+ yards on the ground against HIS defense. ”
I agree. Sunday is going to be the culmination of everything that Tim Ruskell has done to destroy the Seattle Seahawks franchise.
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Cornutt – Heart.
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Aaron Kampman is 29. There was some talk about him being older (he’ll be 30 in a few weeks). He’s a band aid. But a good 3 year band aid. Instant gratification. But long term answers are also needed on the DL. If we signed him and drafted a (new kool aid drink) DE like Derrick Morgan, we’d actually be able to pressure the QB in ’10.
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FireTR – Alternatives, you mean a guy like Rod Smith. Yeah, another over achiever. One that was never rewarded with the big PAY DAY by moving onto another team. Yet found solace in the little things… Such As… Blocking! Just happy to contribute in any way possible to obtain that W. eff hush.. he ain’t no 8 mill $ man or haven’t U noticed. Could have gotten his output from BE or hadn’t you noticed?
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” It is clear that despite his big mouth he is easily the most talented WR on the team and one of the finest in the NFC. Just think of the alternatives. Would you rather have Deion Branch starting?”
And Housh is tough too – he’s got a bigger mouth that I’d thought but he doesn’t back down, and gives us more toughness at the position than anyone I can remember in a long time. Even in what has so far has felt like a less than stellar year – he’s on pace for 85 catches and a 1000 yards – and he’ll likely top that if Hass stays healthy.
Yeah, Branch has really been a flop – this year cements it. I actually liked the signing when it happened – it felt like the kind of opportunistic signing that contending teams do. Hasn’t played out that way at all.
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“pdway – for the record, I was irate the second Hutch wasn’t franchised. And my comments in the archives support this.”
Not saying you weren’t – but what i am saying is that some of the sentiment on here makes it sound like we ran Hutch out of town – and that’s obviously about the opposite of what happened. They guy felt like leaving – and signed a deal that he knew w/absolute certainty that we couldn’t match. He’s really no better or worse than A-Rod .. .
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I’ve already sent my “please sign with Seattle” plea… You can too (if you want Hutch properly replaced).
http://jahrievans.com/
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WOW this article hurts man- AP clowns us about hutch, TJ showing seattle no luv and TRu & Wilson egos ( heads ) hurt because of the cards. This truly a low week to be a seahak fan. Can we please get rid of ruskell and bring in a big name GM It doesn’t even need to be holmgren. I’ll take anybody better
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pdway – He signed a deal any of us would have signed. The Seahawks hadn’t shown they would pay him that much (the reason for being cheap and going with the transition tag). And you know damn well the Vikings told him they wouldn’t sign him to that much money if he wouldn’t agree to the “stipulations.” Either Hutch gets a deal from someone else for less offered money (that the Seahawks would have matched) or he gets a boatload of money that he knew they Seahawks wouldn’t or couldn’t match (if we matched it, it would have been guaranteed). Please don’t tell me you’d change jobs if you were offered more money. Especially that much more.
For the record, all we would have had to do to keep him was guarantee the contract… I guess Ruskell thought that after year 4 he’d suck and want to release him… well, Hutch is 4 years in MN and about to be selected to his 4th consecutive Pro Bowl. Not too shabby.
I know you never know if he’d get hurt or whatever… but him leaving is/was a black eye and I’d respect Ruskell a hell of a lot more if he would have admitted this was a mistake. Hell, I’m one of the few on this blog who actually support giving him 1 more year. But I’d like it more if our GM would admit this was stupid (especially after knowing the “poison pill” crap could happen from a few years earlier with NYJ/Wash) instead of continuing to say it “wasn’t a mistake.” Yeah, neither was the Germans electing Hitler. Lets pretend it never happened.
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These highlights are unbelievable. We could use a RB who runs a 4.3 and can score from anywhere on the field at all times. Damn, I wish we had ANOTHER 1st round pick.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MooMhKt-wKw
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He’s fun to watch. Chris Johnson-esque.
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I’m definitely an advocate for getting someone like spiller or best in the first round along with an offensive tackle and then using our second round (assuming we have one- I thought we traded it to move up and get Max Unger?) for a gaurd. I think it’s time we focus a draft on the offense. If we decide to get a QB I hope we wait until the 3rd round. I think we should take care of the defensive side of the ball in free agency. We really only need one solid pass rusher and a safety. The Defense will improve with time.
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Lord knows we could use the big play ability (not to mention it’d be nice to watch him return kick-offs for us). Too bad we have that terrible OL and DL thing to worry about (not to mention FS).
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jmreid8 – we have our 2nd rounder, but the 3rd rounder was traded, along with other picks, for the right to draft Butler this past year.
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Glad to hear we have pur second round pick. I think we need to give our defense time to improve, Aaron Curry could go a long way if he learns how to rush the passer. A strong running game sets up the passing game and gives our defense time on the sideline – of course with someone like spiller it may not be long on the sideline
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But you’re right we do need to worry about the D-line and FS! If only we had 5 first round picks!
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But pdway, they had an eternity to re-up Hutch and Ruskell chose not to. That pissed off Hutch, and it should’ve considering how good he was. Ruskell never treated him with respect because he doesn’t respect linemen, period. He called them unsexy and he certainly drafts them that way.
Yeah, Hutch wanted out. But there was a reason why.
He’s still wasting space in a nice lakeside corner office in Renton and his team has won six games in two years.
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The Hawks O line is still below NFL average but they played better against the Cards than they have played in a long time. Maybe this cut blocking/zone blocking will eventually work for Seattle.
A sixth round RB gained over 2,000 yards one season for the Broncos when they used zone blocking. I still don’t like it. I would rather get some big hogs up front and use tighter split.
I watched Iowa LT play three times this season and he is a good pass blocker that will be available in the second round.
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“Yeah, Hutch wanted out.” I’ve never heard that before. He was on record as saying the ‘Hawks should take care of Walt, Shaun and Matt, he wasn’t going anywhere. Perhaps you are referring to only being transitioned rather than franchised and that was enough. But I never heard him express his desire to leave.
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A good GM should get an above average starter in the first round, a solid starter in the second and a good backup in the third. I realize even the best can’t do that every time but he should hit the mark 70% of the time. I don’t downgrade a GM for any pick from the fourth round on but he should be given props for any good sleepers. Using that criteria, Ruskell hasn’t drafted that badly. Wish I could say the same for his free agent moves.
If Seattle could draft a D lineman that is so good he has to be double teamed every play it would make the rest of the D line so much more effective. A young Cortez Kennedy would make the Hawks D line dominant.
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He signed the poison pill. The pill was designed to make it impossible to return to Seattle.
If that’s not wanting out, I don’t know what is.
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Always judge an athlete’s actions, never his words, because almost everything he tells the media is a deflection of the truth.
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bobby k said “Please don’t tell me you’d change jobs if you were offered more money. Especially that much more”
I guess that means I’m the only one with the following opinion…. If I was that good, I would entertain all offers, but in the end it would be all about the location of the teams interested. Im not all about the money. Whether I received a 15 million dollar contract or a 60 million dollar contract, what the hell does someone NEED all that money for? I think it really comes down to GREED. If I was offered 15 mil to play in Seattle and offered 60 mil to play in cleveland, I would go with Seattle. There isn’t anything out there that I need 60 million dollars for. I could live comfortably for the rest of my life on that money…
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longco44 –
If I made 60 mill in Cleveland vs 15 mill in Seattle, sign me up with the dog pound. Don’t be serious. A nice Lake house outside of Cleveland, and a nice Lake house on Lake Washington. I’d have my Lear all warmed up and ready to go back to rainy Seattle when I had any free time.
Give me 4X my current dollars, and force me to move to Cleveland..hmm ok.
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Let me clarify, I’d change jobs for that much money, especially if my boss said he’d negotiate a new contract and then never did (case with Hutch). I’d be bitter and would jump ship for someone who wanted to show some love. I blame Hutch zero percent. That’s all on Ruskell trying to save a few hundred thousand bucks. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.
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BobbyAyala – Perhaps, but one could argue that by not applying the franchise tag and saving $600,000 (that was the difference in the franchise vs transition tags that year) that the Seahawks no longer valued his services and were no longer interested in retaining him. I think that’s a bit different than him not wanting to stay in Seattle. After that slap in the face, his attitude may have changed, however. Mine would have.
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“I’m doing a dance right now because we got him and y’all don’t,” Peterson said when asked about Hutchinson. “He’s the ring leader of the offensive line. It’s still funny to me how y’all let this guy go. But he’s a leader. He gets the job done. And he’s a beast. That’s the way I explain how he is on the field.”
FIRE RUSKELL!!!
I am totally eating my words from this offseason. I hope Wilson is ok. He is about the only goos thing going for our secondary. He makes plays, he tackles better than most of the guys that have 100 or more pounds on him.
Aside from linebackers and Forsett, Wilson is the only draft pick thats worth a damn.
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oops good not goos
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I really wish the Hawks would play a more Ravens style Defense. I heard Ray Lewis talking after the game Monday night about talking to his young CB’s, telling them to ” get contact w/ their player, just for a secong and we’ll get there(meaning the QB)” it forces quick decisions. Even if you don’t get the Sack, you get hurries tipped balls and hits on the QB. Which IMO is as good or better. But, to sit back with 6or7 DB’s and watch a Warner disembowel our team is infuiating and demoralizing. I can only imagine how it makes the players feel.
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BobbyK,Spiller looks like the real thing for sure. That is REAL 4.3 speed. The guy pulls away from eveybody.Unlike our4.3 guy who seems to pull away from no-body…..Mystery to me….But, just based on what I’ve seen in the Pac 10, and the few SEC games I’ve seen, we can get a very good talent for that position later in the draft. We need to put most, if not all our focus on upgrading the line play on both sides of the ball. IMO. And as far as the “character of guys we draft”, I don’t want hoodlums, but at the same time we don’t need choir boys either. This is football and it’s down and dirty. Best played by men with mean streaks and who absolutely put the hurt to people.
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The defensive game plan against the Cardinals is another signal that our DC is in over his head, so much for the attacking defense we were promised. It’s another signal that the pass rush is unreliable,but that has been the case for some time. It’s another signal that Ruskell, like we needed another, has failed in his ’5 year plan’ to build this defense (his supposed specialty), and should not be renewed.
The Peterson comment is sadly telling how stupid Ruskell was in ’06 and how poorly/negligently he has reacted to or fixed his fumblerooskie.
Favre will eat this defense alive this weekend, it will not be pretty to watch. Housh needs to zippit, truth or not.. Any bets Ruskell didn’t tell Housh about his supposed ’2 year plan’ that he has now devised as a justification to be renewed?
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princeaden – That is exactly what I want to see out of our defense as well. This defense was touted as something of a Tampa 2, with many variations. That requires the corners to play up and physical with the receivers. But the reality of it is the polar opposite. I totally agree with your take. It is amazingly frustrating to watch.
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INDEED!!!!!!!!
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Seattle wants to play the cover 2 but its D-Line and Safety play are horrible. They can’t do it. They would get killed even worse than they are now. Babs shouldn’t be a starting safety and the players on the D-Line ( Jackson, Kerney, Redding, & cole) can’t get to the Qb unless you send LB help. This team is lacking talent in many areas and guess who is to blame for this Defense- Ruskell he signed, traded and drafted every player on the defense side of the ball. Now if we are talking the Offensive side Ruskell gave us flashy but not dependable WR core and used a 1st rd pick to get Branch, O-Line that can’t stay healthy and spent money carelessly on RB (Duckett & James gone but making 4 mil) let F Weaver leave and he was given a pro bowl QB by Holmgren. Now tell me where is the upgrades from that 06 superbowl team if not at least competitive. Ruskell doesn’t deserve another year. I’m just sayin
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BobbyA has got the Hutch situation right. I distinctly remember Hutch being frustrated the season before because he and his agent were wondering about an extension then. Ruskell just blew them off and put it off as long as he could. By then you’ve already shown the player that you really dont give a crap and that he’s not a priority. The hutch situation is indicative of two things about our guy Ruskell.
1. He’s a horrible judge of talent (especially offensive). If u couldn’t tell that hutch was a special player then ur a total moron.
2. He’s incapable of judging what fair market value is for free agents. In addition to this one I’d also reference Branch, and J Jones contracts and terms.
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I’ve been pissed. And I’ve been dissing our DEs lately, and dreaming that we might change to a 3-4 D to better take advantage of what talent we have on defense by moving to a 3-4 OLB pass rush.
But I’m done over-reacting.
But after watching the Cardinals game again, its clear there is a lot of talent on our D. Beating the Cardinals monster passing game was beyond us at this point, but that doesn’t mean our players suck. Our D was often closer to stopping the Cardinals than other teams have been lately, but like that old saying about “close only counts in hand grenades”, we got blown up.
Add one great DT and one solid FS and this would suddenly be a very very good defense, IMO. But as of now, those holes can be exploited. Sorry Cole, Terrill, Babineaux, and Milloy, you guys are not the answer.
There is a synergy between pass rush and coverage, when one fails even slightly the other fails also. Upgrade the DT and S positions and both the coverage and pass rush could start to work together well enough to make this defense very very good.
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bulldog80 – That season Hutch actually said he was fine with the team taking care of the other 3 (Walt, Matt, and Shaun) before him. He may have been disappointed privately but the transition non-sense was the final straw, it would appear.
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Stevos – ditto.
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Duke, I’m glad you didn’t say ‘mega-dittos’. that guy scares me.
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BobbyK says:
“To Ruskell, Hutch was “just a guard.” ”
BobbyK, you and I usually agree on most things, but I think this is making up some history, dude.
Here’s what happened:
Ruskell tried to sign Hutch, but was hamstrung during the period while the Collective Bargaining Agreement was being renegotiated the salary cap was frozen. He tried to find a way to negotiate with Hutch to keep him on the Seahawks long term.
What happened was the NFL changed the rules TWICE on us within a month and the Seahawks as an organization got scammed. Hutch got his wish to leave Seattle, and he accepted less guaranteed money than Ruskell had already offered him.
Ruskell offered Hutch $6.39M 1-yr transition salary instead of $6.98M 1-yr franchise salary. He did that in order to begin negotiating a long-term deal with Hutchinson. Franchising Hutch would have led to a stalemate, not a new contract. Ruskell had already offered Hutch a great contract and Hutch refused it, so Ruskell wanted to break the stalemate with Hutch’s agent by getting him to negotiate with other teams to set his new salary, then match/beat whatever another team offered to keep Hutch in Seattle long-term. Any smart GM might have done the same.
The salary cap was $95M when the transition tag was applied. Under that cap, no team could afford to pay an OG $7M/yr. Right after Ruskell filed the transition tag, the NFL rewrote the CBA and unexpectedly increased the salary cap from $95M to $102M.
The salary market had suddenly changed, and Minnesota lawyers decided to game the system. The poison pill contract the wrote said that if Hutch was not the highest-paid offensive lineman on the team the moment he signed the offer sheet, the contract would become fully guaranteed. That clause could not be triggered in Minnesota, only in Seattle.
Seahawks lawyers filed a complaint with the league arguing the clause was capricious and illegal since it created a rule that applied to only one team. A court of law might have thrown that contract out, unfortunately the NFL is not run by laws, but by a wealthy insiders club who change rules as they go. The NFL Special Master okayed the contract, a decision that the Seahawks front office argued was wrong, but there was no way to appeal.
The Seahawks front office tried everything they could do to negotiate with Hutch and sign him for the long-term , but they got scammed. Plain and simple. No one knows why the league sided with Minnesota on the Poison Pill Contract, or what happened behind the scenes. The league has never okayed another contract with a clause like the Hutch clause.
Saying Ruskell thought Hutch was “just a guard” is fictitious. He offered Hutch the second-highest OG salary in the league. Hutch said “no.” It was not the size of the contract that the Seahawks couldn’t match – their whole strategy was to get the chance to match it – it was merely the amount of guaranteed money created by the poison pill contract they could not match under the cap. Hutch went to Minnesota for a lot less guaranteed money, this is why it seems clear to me that Hutch wanted out.
As for Ruskell not valuing guards? The next year Ruskell offered the same money to Chris Deihlman (Deihlman signed for less money with the Chargers in order to stay in sunny San Diego). Ruskell proved he greatly valued Hutch and valued OG in general and he proved it by putting his money on the line.
Did Ruskell make a mistake by not offering the franchise tag instead of transition tag? Sure, that’s easy to say now, knowing that the salary cap would change and league would approve a poison pill contract three weeks later. But on the day Ruskell made that decision, it was a shrewd method of restarting a stahlled negotiation with Hutch to sign him long term. That was a worthy goal.
If Hutch had not wanted out of Seattle, none of this would have happened. Hutch was offered every opportunity to stay and sign a very rich long term contract here. He refused.
I want to see Mebane and Tapp put some cleat marks across his face on Sunday.
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Duke, Thats what he said when he was still a Seahawk. After the transition tag debacle, Hutch stated in interviews that he’d tried get some kind of commitment out of the Seahawks well in adviance of his contract expiring and that Ruskell wouldn’t even return calls. He was saying that he just wanted to know that they were committed to him and just got the shaft. That’s why when it came down to crunch time and Ruskell finally HAD to deal with his contract Hutch had pretty much already made up his mind.
If we’d have made any effort we could signed him a year in advance of his contract expiring and probably for less money. This was mismanagement at it’s finest. You have to show your core players that you give a sh!t or expect them not to be your core players anymore.
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“Hutch stated in interviews that … Ruskell wouldn’t even return calls.”
Source??
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Stevos said
“The Seahawks front office tried everything they could do to negotiate with Hutch and sign him for the long-term , but they got scammed. Plain and simple. No one knows why the league sided with Minnesota on the Poison Pill Contract, or what happened behind the scenes. The league has never okayed another contract with a clause like the Hutch clause.”
Horse Crap! See Will Wolford, Bills LT 1993
Relieved, he signed and then dashed to the airport to make his calls. All that remained was to await the arbitrator’s ruling on Buffalo’s protest. The Bills had made Wolford one of its two “transition players” in 1993, meaning that if another team made him an offer, they could keep him if they matched it. The Bills agreed to match the money, but Indianapolis had inserted a clause into the contract guaranteeing that Wolford would be the highest-paid player on its offensive team. While this was easy for the Colts, there was no way that Buffalo could match that clause by paying Wolford what it paid Kelly and Thomas. The Bills argued that the two teams’ disparate salary structures made the clause unfair. Arbitrator Arthur Stark disagreed, however, and on April 23 he ruled the contract valid.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1005597/3/index.htm
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bulldog80 – “He was saying that he just wanted to know that they were committed to him ” Yes, and the trans tag was not a real commitment to him. As I said before “He may have been disappointed privately but the transition non-sense was the final straw” Additionally, Ruskell does not (rarely) negotiate contracts before they expire, for good or ill.
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exile – interesting.
I had never heard of that contract and I took the work of the journalists who reported that no similar poison pill contract was ever upheld by the league. So, only 2 contracts with that clause over a 12 year period. That is extremely rare. I think its fair to say it was unexpected and caught the team’s front office by surprise.
my point was that Ruskell and the Seahawks valued Hutchinson and wanted him signed long-term. They gave him every opportunity to sign a huge contract here. He refused to sign here. People who say otherwise are making up stories.
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Stevos – thanks for the back-up info; that version is how I remember it as well. It’s easy now to lump this on as “ruskell’s biggest error” b/c many folks here are unhappy with how he’s shaped the team – and I’m not here to say they’re wrong.
I just think that the whole Hutch story has been twisted around to fit the pre-conception that Ruskell is a terrible GM, which may be true, but his actions around the Hutch signing were not as they are now being depicted.
Also, I wanted to make the point – just b/c Hutch is a great player, doesn’t make him a great guy.
Anyway – the only reason we still talk about it is b/c we’ve failed to adequately re-stack the position – as I mentioned the other day, every successful team loses quality guys – it’s how you re-fill those positions that determines your continued success, or not.
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Few GMs will negotiate with a player who is still under contract. The time to negotiate is after the season is over and when the contract is close to expiring. There is nothing disrespectful about that. Agents and athletes are accustomed to that. It is not disrespect.
My pet theory about Hutch is that he became jealous of Shaun Alexander. Hutch and Walt did much of the work but Shaun got all the glory. Hutch became a jealous, angry, spoiled, multi-millionaire athlete and he said (in the words of Eric Cartman, “screw you guys, I’m going home!”
A bigger man would have thanked Mr. Allen for the chance to be a multi-millionaire just for playing football, and he would have gone back to work.
C’mon Mebane, knock the spoiled brat on his a$$.
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Ruskell had made comments about some positions not being valued as highly as others. Guard was a position not as highly valued. In comparison to the more important Left Tackle position, Hutch was “just a guard.” I don’t need to give you a source to tell you what our record is. I don’t need to give you a source to tell you the sun will come up again tomorrow. Through the actions and what Ruskell had said about positions not deemed as important, it’s clear though actions that he was simply a guard. And, yes, I have heard of the quote that Ruskell thought Hutch “was just a guard.” I don’t remember where, but that doesn’t mean I didn’t hear it or remember going over this topic year after year for 4 years and counting. Just because I don’t remember the final score to the Rams – Seahawks play-off game some years back, that doesn’t mean I didn’t watch the game. Calling someone a liar is a serious accusation if you want to be taken seriously yourself.
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In all of the info leading up to the poison pill… I remember an article or articles about how Ruskell told Hutch’s agent that they would like to get an extention in place prior to ’05 and then it never happened. This made Hutch bitter.
This is the part where Stevos is going to call me a liar… so for the rest of you bloggers… do you guys remember hearing about this too???
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ah, much heat still glows about the old Hutch fiasco.
I’m not calling anyone a liar. Especially not any of my bros here. We all have different interpretations fueled by disappointment in our offensive line woes. its all valid.
And I’m not saying Ruskell is a great GM. I’m not saying he didn’t make a mistake at the time he lost Hutch. I am saying he was trying to work a plan to pay Hutch big money and keep Hutch here for the long term. He got beat.
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Mike Reinfeldt performed contract negotiations for the Seahawks. He was brought back to straighten out the flux of the Hawk salary cap just before the hiring of Tim Ruskell. So in all likely hood it was Reinfeldt to blame for the Hutch fiasco. TR likely was but a bystander in the hole ordeal. But let it be known that when Mike Holmgren left for Indy and the combine he was under the impression that Hutchinson was to be Franchised. The T-tag came about after his departure.
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Bobby, Yes, the Seahawks refused to renegotiate the contracts of Hutchinson or Alexander before they expired. That’s common practice. Hutch became bitter and refused to negotiate in ’05. Alexander smiled and negotiated when his time came in ’05. Alexander did what successful people do; Hutch did what bitter jerks do.
I sure wish it had happened the other way around, Hutch had wanted to stay and Shaun had wanted to leave, too bad it didn’t.
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Are we the laughing stock of the NFL? Here’s an article that makes fun of Mora for sending in so many grievances to the NFL from the AZ game:
http://bleacherreport.com/tb/b1BTs
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Stevos, not sure I can follow your reasoning. Just b/c TR may have said he had the best intentions for Hutch (haha) slapping the t-tag on him was a definite slap in the face. Hutch and Holmy had a great relationship. Holmy thought he would be franchised so obviously it was a forgone conclusion. I’m sure that Hutch had been informed of the decision, least wise by MH. Then the 600,000 dollar pay cut, an immediate employer willing to pay top dollar and off he went.
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Bobby is right here. Ruskell, at the time (not certain how he has adjusted this over time) assigned a value to a position, not the player. The $600,000 difference (between trans and fran that year) represents more money than he was willing to commit to the guard position for the ’06 season. That appeared to be the final straw for Hutch.
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The Hutch nightmare would be a uncomfortable, distant memory if TR had a plan to replace him adequately. The fact that we’re here 4 years later without even a glimpse of an OG that could hold Hutch’s jockstrap is further testimony that either TR does de-value this position or that he’s just not very good at evaluating OL talent. In any event, I don’t feel good about going forward w/TR pulling the trigger on F/A, drafts and trades,during this most important off- season. I don’t know it well enough to say who should be in charge. But, good grief there must be someone out there.
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Duke, I really I don’t think saving $600K had anything to do with it. The Seahawks were trying to give Hutch a huge multi-year deal. Hutch was refusing it.
So, Ruskell applied the franchise tag to Hutch because that tag puts the team in position of forcing the player to accept a new contract from us once we matched any offer he got.
The franchise tag would have ended any chance for negotiation and locked up a bitter and angry Hutch, who would then be a risk to hold out of camp. (in hindsight, that may have been ok, but at the time it was not the best option.)
By applying the transition tag, the Seahawks FO was creating a way to sign Hutch a long-term deal. That was their goal. The transition tag would have forced Hutch to accept a multi-year offer from us once it was presented as a matching offer.
The Seahawks were trying to force a multi-year deal, not save money.
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In defense of Ruskell, he did try signing Dielman to put masking tape on his blunder.
I honestly think that the only way Ruskell can shut the masses up about Hutch is to sign Jahri Evans this off-season. I know I won’t complain anymore if he can. Evans is getting to the point where he’s very close to being equal to Hutch. And Evans is 26 whereas Hutch is on the wrong side of 30. I know Evans has been a RG, but I’m sure he’d dominate at LG and then NOBODY can ever say we don’t have a dominant LG anymore. Or if we do have problems, nobody can say it’s because we don’t have one of the best LGs on the planet.
All I know is that we need to have a side of our OL that we know will gain 1 yard on 3rd or 4th down. The defense knows what we’re going to do and yet we do it anyway. That’s what Evans/Willis could do for our right side (if we chose to keep him at RG).
I don’t know why the Saints would risk losing him but, as TR has proved, stranger things can happen when we’re talking about a left guard. Evans is probably the only player at his position entering FA who can legitimately say that he’s one of the top 2-3 at his position in the NFL. No free agent RB, WR, TE, OT, DE, DT, LB, DB can say that. While I like a guy like Peppers at DE… I don’t consider him top 3 (even though he has the skills to be). And he’s a guy who I could easily see cashing it in after he gets his big payday (Albert Haynesworth).
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Bobby, I won’t be surprised if Ruskell goes after a high-priced G like Evans. And I hope he does.
Why? Ruskell has a history of valuing guards and offering them big money.
Offered Hutch multi-year contract in ’05, Hutch declined the offer.
Offered Hutch $6.38M, second-highest OG contract in league.
Offered Deihlman $7M x 7 years, Deihlman declined.
Offered Wahle $5.6M/yr, Wahle said “wow, thanks a lot!”
Over five years, drafted four interior O linemen within the first four rounds:
C/G Spencer
G Sims
G Wrotto
C/G Unger
Sure looks like a GM who values the guard position A LOT, and is willing to spend more on it than most GMs do.
Wrotto has been a disappointment, and Spencer’s future is uncertain, so spending for a veteran FA guard would make sense.
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But the fact is the transition tag and the non-exclusive franchise tag are the same with the difference being ave. salary for top 10 with trans and top 5 with fran. (Additionally, the Seahawks would have received 2 1st round picks should they choose not to match) Had the Seahawks wanted to keep him they would have still had to match another teams offer (poison pills not withstanding). A long term deal would still have had to be reached in either case. I don’t see how there is a difference there. We’re not referring to an exclusive franchise tag where he could not negotiate with other teams. Ruskell didn’t value the position enough to apply the fran because the draft picks usually keep bidders at bay and he didn’t want to extend his assigned value to the guard position. That’s how I see it anyway.
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If he was sincere about keeping Hutch and valued the position “A LOT”, he would have franchised him and worked something out. He has learned since then, one can presume, but as I see it, he allowed a cornerstone player walk because he thought he replacing him would be easier that it turned out to be.
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Stevos – You ever heard of the phase ‘try, try again”?
Drafts corners in consecutive years but fails so signs Lucas who he let loose a few years back.
Cuts a couple of safeties drafted by the Hawks who had never missed the playoffs. We know have an extremly highly paid SS and a FS who could not beat out either of those cut.
You sir need to come to the conclusion that Ruskell messed in Hutchinson’s business. There were two dogs in the fight. TR punked Hutch and the best guard in football feed the worst GM (as Holmgren claimed from the beginning – TR was a ‘Glorified Scout’) his lunch. This happened over 4 years ago – get over it already.
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Or you can say that in 4 years he has drafted 2 OL in the first 3 rounds.
The first 3 rounds are, normally, your bread and butter picks. I don’t have a source, but this generally seems to be the feeling of GMs, fans, etc. when talking about the first 3 rounds. Yes, there are some damn good players that have been drafted in rounds 4-7, but it seems, on average, that there are a lot more instances when you start drafting guys for depth and hoping they can help you down the road (expect nothing, or hardly anything their first years) whereas you expect that guys in the first 3 rounds help you out by year two and if they turn out like David Greene or Chris Spencer… you get mad.
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Not sure what all the fuss is over the loss of Hutch at the moment. Re-watching the Cards game and Sims is looking like a bad mofo. Pan cakes Campbell then next play leaves another on their back. It was Locklier who struggled. Losing an all pro LT is going to become ever so evident over the coarse of time. Locklier is better than our backups but far from a solution.
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No offense to Sims THIS year, but Hutch is a Pro Bowler and future hall of famer. Sims will never be in a Pro Bowl. He no longer sucks, but we have all been guilty from time to time of thinking our players are better than they are.
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I hear ya but All World LT Walter Jones replacement seems more significant. He isn’t coming back and if he did, don’t expect the 33 year old version at the ripe old age of 36.
LG on the other hand has an up and coming Sims. Did I say Pro Bowl. Blink again…didn’t think so
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excite – I hate it when people put words in my mouth. I’m sorry, but your post seemed to insinuate that not having Hutch wasn’t a big deal since we had Sims. I think Lock is to LT (compared to Walt) as Sims is to LG (compared to Hutch). Both options suck. The only reason one sucks more is because Walt is probably done, whereas Hutch is still the best guard in the NFL and is still going to Pro Bowls. If we still had him, we wouldn’t have a need (and if Sims were at RG… we’d all be talking about how great our interior OL is with Hutch/Unger/Sims… instead all we can talk about how our entire line sucks). Even though it pains me not to have Walt, I understand the circumstances (health) whereas Huch is more to do with stupidity of Ruskell. Hutch is healthy and fine.
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Yes Duke you’re right that they could match an offer based on either the franchise tag or the transition tag. But almost nobody ever offers a contract to a player with a franchise tag. Its the transition tag players that teams go after and make offers to. That’s why the Seahawks thought the transition tag would give them a multi-year contract to match.
It was a strategy. Obviously it didn’t work. It failed. I’m just tired of hearing people say Ruskell didn’t try, or didn’t value Hutch. They tried and failed, and none of it would have happened if Hutch had not wanted out. Hutch made things as hard on the team as he could, and he got out.
Please don’t let this suggest I’m defending Ruskell. We are talking about a failure here, afterall. I’m just trying to get the history straight.
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Another take on the Hutchinson debacle. ‘the truth’ from LB Dave Wyman. A good read.
http://www.mynorthwest.com/?nid=292&sid=243909
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You want “the truth?” You can’t handle the truth.
Lets be Dave Wyman… lets talk about the short yardage situation against the Redskins in ’05… Lets not forget that we seemed to run the ball over LG/LT about 939,498,394,493,282,490,993 other times on short yardage situations during ’05 and seemed to make them all. Lets not forget that when Walt was in him prime (still) and he had a moron of a partner (Sims, Wahle, etc.) that the Hawks sucked in those very situational comparisons. Oh, wait, lets be Wyman and conveniently forget those parts (note sarcasm).
I thought Alex Gibbs, when he still had his original brain, and hadn’t retired from the NFL about 1,000 times, used to be a good/great NFL OL coach. Of course, Dick Stockton used to be a good announcer too (like the 1980s). At this rate, any team paying a guard over minimum wage will cut their players at the end of the season (sarcastic prediction).
I bet Adrian Peterson will be pretty excited that the Vikings get rid of that worthless piece of crap LG of theirs after the year. Afterall, he’s just a guard. He sucks. Any guard in the Hall of Fame should be removed. They don’t count.
Lets ask Colin Cole on Sunday afternoon how crappy Hutch is (that is, if Cole can still walk/talk after getting his ass kicked up and down the Metrodome).
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Oh, by the way, the Wyman read is one of the dumbest reads I’ve ever read in my life. I am actually dumber for having read it. I used to respect the guy, but don’t anymore.
I guess I should respect Wyman for playing in the NFL. I used to. That means I know nothing compared to former NFL players. Don’t worry, I’ll never claim to be smarter than Warren Moon (unless I beat my wife), Rae Carruth (unless I decide to kill her [or the other her] if she’s having a kid I don’t want), Lawrence Phillips (MoronsRUs), etc.
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I can’t believe how much you guys hate everybody.
Hate hate hate.
Housh, Ruskell, Deion, Josh, Trufant, Matt, Hutch, Wyman, Cole, Terrill, Mora
Wah.
I think some things need to change at the end of the year too but this wining is too much.
Although the team got worked at the end, We played better vs the Cards this time (on the road) and I expect them to get better this weekend too. Cards are a good team.. WHen you guys say were gonna get our asses kicked up & down the field are you talking about a score of 45-0? 30-10 or what? Think it will be worse than against the Lions last week? 27-10?
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For the record, I love Matt, Hutch (still), Terrill (so long as he’s a back-up), and Josh. I like Tru. I’m also one of the few who want to give Ruskell/Mora 1 more year. But, yeah, I know you’re not talking about just me and I don’t care for Deion, Cole (just b/c he’s terrible)…
Peace. Love. War. But peace is the best option (or love… too early to think deeply).
Stevos – peace out:)
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IMO the talent level from team to team in the NFL is very close. The main difference between winning and losing is preparation, game planning and confidence as a team that you can win. I heard Mora say to Tony V. that like Holmy, the first 15 plays or so are scripted. It seems to me after those 15 plays are gone the offense loses it’s creativity and the playcalling can’t adjust accordingly as the game unfolds. Same for the Defense(although I would like to see them press the WR and blitz the QB more and stay w/it).
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No worries Stevos – We may disagree on the particulars but we are in agreement on our overview of the situation and Ruskell’s misjudgment.
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“It was a strategy. Obviously it didn’t work. It failed. I’m just tired of hearing people say Ruskell didn’t try, or didn’t value Hutch. They tried and failed, and none of it would have happened if Hutch had not wanted out. Hutch made things as hard on the team as he could, and he got out.
Please don’t let this suggest I’m defending Ruskell. We are talking about a failure here, afterall. I’m just trying to get the history straight.”
Right.
Anyway, I suppose the Hutch talk was inevitable given that we’re playing his team . . . we all know it’s time to move on from this issue. What we need to think about is the new 0-Lineman we’re gonna find. . .
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