Letters to the Editor

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ELECTION: It can never be late enough

Letter by Charles V. Pregaldin, Tacoma on Aug. 27, 2012 at 1:48 pm with 155 Comments »
August 27, 2012 2:26 pm

Re: “Romney/Ryan, before it’s too late” (letter, 8-25).

Common decency forbids me to express my opinion of someone who’s actually nostalgic for the days in which people unable to work “lived in wretched conditions, often without adequate food,” water, sanitation or medical care, as the letter writer appears to be.

But he should certainly vote for Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan, as should all who similarly contemplate with lip-smacking relish the prospect of seeing their fellow beings suffer from extreme want; if those gentlemen are elected and carry their stated intentions into execution, there will be suffering enough to satisfy all but the most voracious appetites for witnessing it.

For my part, I have seen enough starvation, lack of clean water and sanitation, disease, despair and misery during my travels in Third World countries to sate my own admittedly small appetite, and I have no desire to see those things replicated here.

Leave a comment Comments → 155
  1. lylelaws says:

    Charles,

    Your rant is a pathetc example of how some people try to twist the facts. Anyone who says that I want conditions to return to what they were in 1933 is knowingly distorting my comments.

    My point was simply that many able-bodied people choose not to work because they can get by without doing so, and that the real victoms
    are the folks who are truly not able to support themselves who could be receiving much more assistance if not for the freeloaders.

    Do you have a problem with that?

  2. many able-bodied people choose not to work because they can get by without doing so

    How many is “many” and, what is your evidence?

    Cuz this just sounds like Reagan’s welfare queen revisited.

  3. lylelaws says:

    beerBoy,

    Who knows how many people are milking the system? Do you?

    For example most of those who receive food stamps may well be in need, but why should they be used to purchase lobster, fillet minion, snow crab, candy, sugary soft drinks, and gourmet take-out pizza?

    Just for the record, the number of people on food stamps has nearly doubled since Obama became President.

  4. Charles, if we follow Obama we will be a second class nation. You won’t have to travel to see disease, despair and misery.

  5. aislander says:

    Hey Charles: You won’t have long to wait before Obama and the Dems turn the US into a third-world nation…

    Where do you think the money came from to fund all those social-welfare programs you celebrate? Hint: the government doesn’t have its own money.

    We’ll ALL be starving if we don’t get the economy (THAT’S where the money comes from) on a firm footing, and spending MORE trillions borrowed from China or created out of thin air ain’t gonna do it!

  6. LeePHill says:

    “lylelaws says:
    Aug. 27, 2012 at 2:56 pm Charles,
    Your rant is a pathetc example of how some people try to twist the facts.”

    Such irony. Lyle accusing someone of twisting the facts.
    —————————————–
    “Hey Charles: You won’t have long to wait before Obama and the Dems turn the US into a third-world nation…”

    “Charles, if we follow Obama we will be a second class nation.”

    One person’s second class is another’s third…

    I guess they had to lose the “Al Quiada will attack” approach when President Obama and the SEAL team actually killed Bin Laden.
    ——————————————–
    “Just for the record, the number of people on food stamps has nearly doubled since Obama became President.”

    With only 8% out of work that speaks mountains for how little working people are getting paid. Tell me that President Obama is responsible for the wages of working families…..
    ——————————————-
    “why should they be used to purchase lobster, fillet minion, snow crab, candy, sugary soft drinks, and gourmet take-out pizza?”

    it’s called “politics”, Lyle. Try to tell the beef ranchers that their product can’t be sold…or the fisheries….or the drink folks like Pepsi and Coke…..or all of the industries that contribute to pizza stores…all of whom donate sizeable amounts of money to Republican campaigns. Oh, and if you think pizza is “gourmet”, you are eating too much cat food.

    The truth is that food stamp recipients DON’T purchase from your list (other than deli pizza that is cheaper than buying the ingredients and making your own). You and Glenn Beck have manufactured this crap in what’s left of your minds.

  7. LeePHill says:

    “You won’t have to travel to see disease, despair and misery.”

    Try the Appalachian states where mining coal and poverty go hand in hand, but the Republicans are telling them they are “salt of the earth workin’ folks”

  8. LeePHill says:

    http://www.fns.usda.gov/pd/34SNAPmonthly.htm

    January 2009 – 31 million recipients

    May 2012 – 46 million (latest data)

    “lylelaws says:
    Aug. 27, 2012 at 4:18 pm Just for the record, the number of people on food stamps has nearly doubled since Obama became President.”

    WHO IS TWISTING THE FACTS, Lyle??????

    The only thing more pitiful about food stamp necessity in the “wealthiest nation on Earth” is the constant lying from the CONservatives about food stamp usage.

  9. http://m.washingtonexaminer.com/feds-too-few-americans-turn-to-government-for-assistance/article/2506052

    This is what is wrong with govt. Don’t rely on self or family, get hooked on some rich man’s taxes and vote dem.

  10. LeePHill says:

    When are you going to quit quoting right wing publications, while complaining about “huffpo” etc?

    The author of that article also works for the Washington Times, a Reverend Moon company.

    doubling down on cons?????

  11. He was reporting a gov link. You think he is wrong? Prove it. Otherwise you are just whining.

  12. So Lyle – you don’t have anything other than “who knows” and a whole lot of bizarre speculation about foodstamp lobster and crab. Sounds a whole lot like Reagan’s unsupported speculation about welfare queens driving Cadillacs.

    You have nothing except class war propaganda on the poor

  13. CT – don’t quite understand what you think your link shows…..or how it relates to the thread.

  14. took14theteam says:

    I think PeeHill’s prior stroke is acting up today.

    Try the Appalachian states where mining coal and poverty go hand in hand

    Could that be because BHO and the ‘Rats hate coal and have done everything they can to shut it down? Because they want us back to the 7th century like Islam does?

  15. bobcat1a says:

    Took1, you actually think that poverty in coal mining areas happened since Obama became president?

  16. took14theteam says:

    No, I think he is adding to it, with the tree hugging dream of Unicorns and Fairy Dust power generation.

    Google his words about killing the coal plants, which will kill the coal industry.

  17. “but why should they be used to purchase lobster, fillet minion, snow crab, candy, sugary soft drinks, and gourmet take-out pizza?”

    Blame the lobbyists who control this country.

    Ideally, the food stamp program would be a clone of the WIC program, but the lobbyists wouldn’t allow it.

    I’ve always thought the WIC program was fantastic.

  18. LeePHill says:

    The poverty in coal mining regions hasn’t increased in the past 3 years.

    Neither has the learning capacity of conservatives.

    Poverty is what creates power for the ruling class – being the mining companies and those who would represent them in government. Those who are educated on the history of that industry knows how the companies keep the workers impoverished through script issuance, company stores and company housing.

    It must be a sad, sad world for those who are so ignorant to not know and be so angry to those who do know.
    ———————————————–
    “CT8 says:
    Aug. 27, 2012 at 5:57 pm He was reporting a gov link. You think he is wrong? Prove it.”

    Rather ironic that the inventor of “I don’t have to prove anything, you have to prove me wrong” demands proof. LOL

    “Reporting a government link” – hardly. He edited for content and then put is opinion on the issue. What the writer did say was that only 15% of people think the government should “be there” in times of need, which really makes your assertion look stupid, anyway….
    ————————————————-

    beerBoy – I doubt Lyle will comment much after I pointed out his hypocrisy on “twisting the facts”

  19. LeePHill says:

    good point, pawl.

    The reality is that people don’t really purchase luxury items with food stamps, despite the attempts by the CONS to paint that picture. People who are on food stamps are trying to make them last an entire month and purchasing luxury items is counter productive to that effort.

    There may be an isolated incident or two where someone abuses food stamps – bartering for drugs and putting the stamps in the hands of people who don’t need them for survival. Abuse and fraud are everywhere in government AND private programs – driving up the cost of doing business for both. Consider the fraudulent medical practices for Medicare money. They’ll cheat private insurance as well. They don’t care where their money comes from.

  20. Why not just show te quote instead of making stuff up, you ….

    “Given that only 15 percent of you turn to government assistance in tough times, we want to make sure you know about benefits that could help you,” USA.gov announced”

    Should be there or turn to govt?

    Why is the govt asking to give away more taxpayer dollars rather than relying on self or family?

    Bb, if you cannot see the connection here you have no business in a classroom.

  21. took14theteam says:

    Breaking my recently stated rule. PeeHill has hijacked another “moniker’s” “style” or is just being a DB as usual.

    I guess time will tell.

  22. lylelaws says:

    beerBoy/LeePHill,

    OK boys, you got me fair and square.

    I should have said that the total amount spent by the government on the program has nearly increased by 100% under Obama. However, the number of people covered has increased by half, going from 31 million to 46 million. (LeePHill’s figures)

    By the way if you don’t think that a lot of food stamp recipients don’t pay for their groceries with SNAP while paying cash for their booze and cigarettes,talk to a supermarket checker.

  23. aislander says:

    Sumbody’s living in the 1890s–scrip currency, company stores and towns! Hey! Watch out for the bulls!

  24. sumyungboi says:

    I kind of wonder if the TNT is in some sort of contest to see who can publish the most ridiculously dumb letter. It’s sort of a catch-22, really, I mean, it’s not as though we set idiots out on a cold night anymore, but there is something to be said for natural selection.

  25. lovethemountains says:

    One can hear and read every day comments from those who consider Obama a scary person with respect to the direction he and his handlers wish to take this country. What is more scary is the increase in the number of people who buy into this “government knows best” and “government is the answer to all our problems” beliefs. The people we send to Washington, whether Dems or Reps, are not setting sail for a smooth voyage. Obama will come and go and it is yet to be seen how much damage he will leave behind. Unfortunatley there are no knights is shining armor on the horizon to save us from the power grabbers we continue to elect.

  26. lylelaws says:

    sumyunboi,

    About your 9:37 comment. ?????? Please explain.

  27. sumyungboi says:

    Lyle, the letter writer is convinced that conservatives want to kill people and / or watch them suffer. This would indicate a sub-par intellect, and this person would have fallen victim to natural selection in days past.

  28. http://www.thedaily.com/page/2012/05/13/051312-news-romney-web/

    http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/DSouza-George-Obama-brother/2012/08/16/id/448863

    Now, let’s compare these two people. One delivers firewood on a cold night. One assists in the rescue of an employee’s daughter. One does not assist his own family.

    Save your rants on the websites, you know why these are not pushed by the networks. If you have a problem with the facts, dispute them.

    Any Obama supporter should be ashamed.

  29. Fibonacci says:

    CT8
    You just love to cut and paste from some obscure right wing website and then using that as “proof” that you are right. You then challenge those who disagree with you to “prove” you wrong. Your problem is that you are one of those gullible people that believe something HAS to be true if you read it on the internet. Here is a little secret there CT, NOST EVERYTHING ON THE INTERNET IS TRUE.

  30. “This is what is wrong with govt. Don’t rely on self or family, get hooked on some rich man’s taxes and vote dem.

    Here’s the website: http://www.usa.gov/citizen/topics/family/help-for-difficult-financial-times.shtml

    The words alleged by the link don’t exist on the web page. You’ve been lied to, and you swallowed it.

  31. averageJose says:

    When I read letters like this and then get accused of “fear mongering” by a prog I just gotta laugh.

  32. CT8 – what connection?

    What conclusions are you drawing from the data you put forward? You just linked ONE poll about how Americans get through hard times. The fact that the majority of Americans rely upon their savings and family and don’t have to rely upon government programs pretty much undercuts the whole “food stamp President” meme doesn’t it?

    Or are you concluding that, since the majority of Americans don’t need government programs to survive hard times, we should cut those programs out so that those who need them are left to starve or commit crimes to support themselves?

    You do realize that most of these polls are based upon individuals with landlines who agree to participate in the poll (I regularly turn down requests)? And that the homeless don’t tend to have landlines?

  33. Come on, the article was about govt pushing dependence.

    No, since his admin sees a measure of success in how many people they can make dependent, it does nothing to change that.

  34. The link led me to the results of a poll – no article.

  35. LeePHill says:

    “I should have said that the total amount spent by the government on the program has nearly increased by 100% under Obama. However, the number of people covered has increased by half, going from 31 million to 46 million. (LeePHill’s figures)”

    The dollar amount has not increase 100% either. The totals are on the spread sheet.

    No, Lyle, you should have said 48% increase, but I’m reminded that conservatives don’t do math so well. No sense in being accurate when you can….how did you say it…oh yeah…twist the facts

    Lyle, I know this is beyond you, but take a look where the upward trend started…..RIGHT AFTER THE MARKET CRASH of 2008.

    As the kids would say…..”well, duuuuuuuuh!”

  36. LeePHill says:

    beerBoy – I’d not expect CT to comprehend, nor to back down at this point.

  37. LeePHill says:

    Can you imagine….the Federal Government telling its constituents where to find the services their taxes have paid for????

    Disgusting….huh?

    The problem with nimrods is that if a family loses their income to job outsourcing or the company being “Bained”, and the breadwinner(s) has to rely on programs for which he and/or she have paid into for years….

    in the alleged conservative mind….

    They are DEADBEATS!!!

    For gawds sake!! Why not sell coal on the streets to make food money?
    —————————————————–

    Oh and speaking of coal….

    “Scrip as a de facto form of currency within the setting of the mining or logging industry was discontinued around 1952.”

    Yes, folks, the coal companies were still doing script during the lifetimes of many Americans, including those that still work in the industry today. They remember the “good old days” of the company “caring for them”. That should keep them in line for another generation or two until you get a Republican congress to look the other way on labor issues.

    Leave it to aislander to misrepresent the issue, as usual.

  38. “the article was about govt pushing dependence.”

    The article was a big, fat lie.

  39. LeePHill says:

    ehill…of course it was. When a right wing “reporter” states an opinion in the first sentence, you can pretty well guess a lie is following.

    Since we have CONS that think Obama’s Administration is making life hard for coal…..

    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505245_162-57497656/coal-stocks-rally-on-pollution-ruling/

  40. If everyone could step back from the front lines of this dirt-clod fight and look at the bigger picture, it would be nice.

    President Obama’s dreams and visions for America are, I believe, to see us as just one of all the other global communities out there…no richer, no better, no more powerful. Dreams of his father. Not mere redistribution of wealth in America, but redistribution of wealth and power globally.

    Nostalgia aside, and sadly all too aware of the ways politicians and the greedy have corrupted the original vision of what America could and should be, many of us would like to return to the dreams of our founders. This does not mean we want to overlook the corruption or sanction it in some way. But do not be naive, greed and abuse-of-power will occur in any society. History has proven this to be true.

    Look at the long-range visions people. What do you want for America? If you want her to be reduced to just another flailing society in the midst of others, sign on with the president for another term. If not, I suggest you take another path. I certainly do not see Romney/Ryan through rose-colored glasses and will no doubt take issue with many of their positions along the way. I don’t love Romney and hate Obama, but when I look at the bigger picture, you can be assured Romney/Ryan will get my vote in November.

  41. tree_guy says:

    Let’s evaluate the letter writer’s argument.

    He doesn’t like third world living conditions.
    He doesn’t like the Republicans.
    Therefore, he concludes that Republicans must favor third world living conditions.

    Just a silly bit of illogic to amuse the readers.

  42. Scottc51 says:

    I think we can all agree, that those who tap into government programs by fraud are hurting everyone, especially those who truly need the help. The left leaners and right leaners should have common cause to aggressively root out those scamming the system.

  43. the3rdpigshouse says:

    For continued subsistence in a socialist pit –
    vote “OH-Bummer/Dummer”!!

    For the opportunity to do better as an individual and as a nation – Vote Romney/Ryan!!!

  44. sumyungboi says:

    ehill: “The .. was a big, fat lie.”

    Heard that a lot. Back in second grade at recess.

  45. Hill family, do you deny the federal govt has increased marketing on entitlement programs? The fact that taxpayer money is being used to sell the ACA alone is disgusting.

  46. “Heard that a lot. Back in second grade at recess.”

    You made it to second grade? LOL

  47. “do you deny the federal govt has increased marketing on entitlement programs?”

    You haven’t shown that they did. In this country, the burden of proof is on the accuser.

  48. For the intellectually (and reality-) challenged, let’s review the article cited by CT278.

    The article claimed that USA.gov “has created a “help for difficult financial times” page for people to learn more about the programs”, and that the ‘help for difficult times’ page “announced today [Aug 27] … ““Given that only 15 percent of you turn to government assistance in tough times, we want to make sure you know about benefits that could help you,”.

    Here’s the website being referred to. http://www.usa.gov/citizen/topics/family/help-for-difficult-financial-times.shtml

    Nowhere on that website do the quoted words appear. Nowhere on the wbsite does anything remotely resembling them appear. And before anyone claims that the website has been changed, scroll down and look at the bottom. The website hasn’t been touched since Aug 20.

    But the falsehood was immediately circled around the wrong-wing circle-jer … Uhhh … echo chamber, and was swallowed as gospel by the countless wrong-winger automotons who unthinkingly believe whatever their overlords tell them, including CT3498..

  49. LyleLaws wrote: many able-bodied people choose not to work because they can get by without doing so.
    __________________________________________________________

    BeerBoy asked: How many is “many” and, what is your evidence?

    Cuz this just sounds like Reagan’s welfare queen revisited.
    __________________________________________________________

    More than a few and a few is more than enough. Obama has his own welfare queen and it is Auntie Zeituni. Surely there is room enough in the white house for a mother-in-law AND an Auntie…..probably save the taxpayers $50,000 or so.

  50. Why not answer the question? Have YOU seen, heard, read more govt entitlement marketing since BHO occupied? Not a tough question, I expect you to lie anyway…

  51. “In a column published on FoxNews.com, D’Souza outlines how George Obama, the youngest of eight children sired by Barack Obama Sr., asked him to send $1,000 to cover medical bills for his young son who was sick with a chest condition.

    D’Souza confirmed that the boy was ill and wired Obama the money”

    Incredible. Would you treat a brother this way?

  52. sumyungboi says:

    ehill: “You made it to second grade?”

    Shocking as it may seem, outside of your circle of friends, that’s the rule, not the exception.

  53. alindasue says:

    CT8 said, “Incredible. Would you treat a brother this way?”

    Do you mean, would I – or one of us – send money (if I had the money) to a brother that needed it after confirming his need? Yes.

    Wouldn’t you?

  54. averageJose says:

    You missed the point alinda. Obama didn’t send the money.

  55. Thanks AJ.

    Yes I would Alindasue.

  56. LeePHilI says:

    There is nothing wrong with the Federal Government advising constituents of benefits available to them. After all, they paid for them.

    What is wrong with confirming a foreign request for money? There was an article in the Trib last week about a scam where a woman claimed to be someone’s grandaughter.

    Only a fool would send $1,000 overseas without first confirming it.

    Of course, the entire story is probably made up by the GOP….

  57. LeePHilI says:

    Oh. I see.

    A FOX “journalist” claims George Obama contacted HIM because Barack wouldn’t send him money.

    I forgot to mention that D’Souza’s cousin called me and said that he’s a liar.

  58. LeePHilI says:

    “Have YOU seen, heard, read more govt entitlement marketing since BHO occupied?”

    Has the need increased since Bush left the place in shambles?

  59. “Why not answer the question? Have YOU seen, heard, read more govt entitlement marketing since BHO occupied?”

    Obama was elected. Fail. Try again.

  60. LeePHilI says:

    Well…there goes a theory down the tubes.

    Ehill and I posted at exactly the same time.

    LOL

  61. “Incredible. Would you treat a brother this way?”

    Think anyone noticed yor attempt to shift focus away from thel lies in the website you cited?

  62. sumyungboi says:

    lee: “A FOX “journalist” claims George Obama contacted HIM because Barack wouldn’t send him money”

    D’Souza is not a Fox journalist. He’s been around though, he’s the guy that Richard Dawkins was afraid to debate, remember?

  63. Watching these two dance is hilarious.

  64. Since I posted the link straight to USA.gov, figured you would man up and admit defeat.

    In the future, cut and paste the quote into google. Incredible how simple that little procedure is and how effective it is to preventing you from looking like a fool

  65. LeePHilI says:

    D’Souza has an obsession with Obama that Orly Taitz would admire. I guess as long as people are willing to pay good money to see that trash in print, he may as well keep writing.

    I can imagine how someone with the following credentials would avoid “debating” a fiction journalist.

    Maybe you can put Kitty Kelly up against D’Souza. At least we’d all know the class and division.

    Here’s what an AP writer has to say about one of D’Sousa’s masterpieces

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/48809895

    Yeah, yeah…I know…the AP is leftist…blah blah blah….

  66. LeePHilI says:

    CT – you still haven’t established what is wrong with the government advising its citizenry of entitlements (since they paid taxes for those programs to exist, they ARE ENTITLED to them, just like you)

    Man up, tell us what is wrong with any government keeping its citizens in the know.

  67. LeePHilI says:

    Sorry, forgot Dawkins’ credentials:

    “Clinton Richard Dawkins, FRS, FRSL (born 26 March 1941) is an English ethologist, evolutionary biologist[1] and author. He is an emeritus fellow of New College, Oxford,[2] and was the University of Oxford’s Professor for Public Understanding of Science from 1995 until 2008″

  68. Ah, now the goalposts are moved. To funny.

    What is wrong with an admin trying to get more people hooked on govt? You know better. You also know how much ‘entitlements’ cost us (well, me the taxpayer).

    They are entitled due to statute, that is all.

  69. ‘too’

  70. took14theteam says:

    “Well…there goes a theory down the tubes.

    Ehill and I posted at exactly the same time.

    LOL”

    Hey PeeHill, you accused me of being averageJose on another thread.

    Read more here: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2012/08/22/todd-akin-was-right/#comment-235488#storylink=cpy

    Did you not see my reply? If you didn’t go back and look, here it is for your viewing pleasure.

    Apparently PeeHill is not a “Rocket Scientist”

    I thought I was Sondra K? You know, Forward K A R D N O S.

    Keep living the dream.

    Like beerBoy suggested, I have “moved” on from worrying about “who is whom”. You should try that.

    LOL

  71. LeePHilI says:

    “Ah, now the goalposts are moved”

    No. The “goalposts” have always been the same. Social Security and Medicare are insurance policies…so is unemployment.

    Food stamps, TANF, etc are paid by taxpayers.

    When was it otherwise…or did you just learn “goalposts” and thought you’d try to use it?
    ——————————————-

    “I have “moved” on from worrying about “who is whom”.

    Yeah….shall I post your comment from the other thread when I wasn’t even online?

    “Breaking my recently stated rule. PeeHill has hijacked another “moniker’s” “style” or is just being a DB as usual.”

    Did your “move” just start? How long do these resolutions usually last?

    Go fool George Bush. He doesn’t know the “you can fool….” saying.

  72. LeePHilI says:

    “What is wrong with an admin trying to get more people hooked on govt?”

    Paranoia strikes deep. Into your life it will creep.

    In most cases the government has a legal obligation to provide information about programs, but don’t let that stop your delusions.

  73. LeePHilI says:

    Oh, and one of D’Souza’s more brilliant statements…

    “The cultural left in this country is responsible for causing 9/11 … the cultural left and its allies in Congress, the media, Hollywood, the non-profit sector and the universities are the primary cause of the volcano of anger toward America that is erupting from the Islamic world.”

    Right up there with Pat Roberton and Jerry Falwell.

    I wonder who he will blame for Hurricane Issac? I’m sure his mythical God won’t be to blame….

  74. took14theteam says:

    Looks like a Hill is starting to archive…

    LLAO

    Whatever dude. Just keep on keepin’ on with your MO.

  75. averageJose says:

    Check this out…

  76. averageJose says:

    … I posted at the exact same time.

  77. averageJose says:

    :D

  78. took14theteam says:

    Damit. I must be you…..

  79. Dude, say it straight out- call him a liar.

    Otherwise, well, you know

  80. lylelaws says:

    LeePHill,

    Don’t be shy; feel free to make a comment once in a while.

  81. LeePHilI says:

    “Looks like a Hill is starting to archive…”

    Uh…your comment is on this thread. It’s the archive.

    No way, Josie. Why don’t you tell us how long your resolution will last?

    ———————-

    Lyle – I’d take up the habit of writing the Friday LTE, but I don’t want to steal your thunder. I guess you aren’t taking my corrective posts very well. Try avoiding “twisting the facts” and you won’t give me so much to work with. Meanwhile, Lyle, feel free to comment whenever you have something of substance to contribute. But if you’re just going to display your anger with me….well……

    ———————-

    CT – Uranus is made of green cheese.
    Otherwise…..you know

    Logic 101 says that he who makes the claim must prove it. Now do you see why a credible person would laugh at D’Souza about a “debate”? There is no position of fact when speaking of mythical beings.

    “God’s real because my mommy said so”

  82. No, keep it shut. He has taken his trip to crazy and irrational even further. The speeches tonight were fantastic. Hill will wait for the NYT analysis instead of listening himself.

    The contrast between the republican party and the dems was summed up well, one party will tax the rich and give away BC, one will bring back the greatness that is America and save Medicare. .

    The two articles up above show the choice of the men. Run scared. You are lying to yourselves if you believe BHO is the better human or leader.

  83. LeePHilI says:

    “The speeches tonight were fantastic”

    If you are part of the 30% that hate Obama. Other than that, there were no surprises, from a group of people who can’t surprise anyone.

    Their last surprise was Sarah Palin. Remember how that went?

    I think Bloomberg says it best:

    A majority of registered voters in the U.S. viewed Mitt Romney unfavorably as Republicans gathered in Tampa, Florida, to select him as the party’s presidential nominee, according to an ABC News/Washington Post poll.

    Romney is the first party standard-bearer to have a higher unfavorable rating than favorable at the start of his party’s convention since Walter Mondale became the Democratic nominee 28 years ago, according to the poll.

    The poll showed 51 percent viewed Romney unfavorably and 40 percent viewed him favorably.

    Better luck with Teddy Bear Cristie in 2016, who did a brilliant job of self promotion tonight….no surprises there, either.

    “Hey Cristie – tell us how you can claim to be so successful with 9.8% unemployment while railing at Obama for 8%.”

    Some things will never change…..”Republican” and “hypocrisy” will always be synonymous

  84. LeePHilI says:

    oh…and “save Medicare”?????

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA…..

    Even us old people ain’t stupid enough to buy that pile….

  85. Balanced the budget without new debt. Unemployment changes just about the same as the national changes (and he only took charge in late 09).

    http://www.google.com/publicdata/explore?ds=z1ebjpgk2654c1_&met_y=unemployment_rate&idim=state:ST340000&fdim_y=seasonality:S&dl=en&hl=en&q=nj+unemployment+rate#!ctype=l&strail=false&bcs=d&nselm=h&met_y=unemployment_rate&fdim_y=seasonality:S&scale_y=lin&ind_y=false&rdim=country&idim=state:ST340000&ifdim=country&tstart=633506400000&tend=1338181200000&hl=en_US&dl=en&ind=false

    You really old people do not care if it runs out of money. The rest of us without one foot in the grave/nuthouse care.

    You have taken a real smacking here lately. Take some meds and a long nap. Come back in 2013 when you can once again blame a republican president for your personal failures.

    Ann Romney was pure class. Take a cue from her

  86. LeePHilI says:

    “You have taken a real smacking here lately.”

    I love these self-congratulatory internet warriors.

    CT doesn’t understand economics and now is going to fix the debt, with the help of people whose plan has already changed to attempt to BS the voters.

    I have only one question, as a waltz off to bed…

    What is “CDB”?

  87. You really think that was funny?

    You did not have a rational point to debate. You were defeated on every lie and piece of rhetoric BHOs emails fed you.

    Pops, maybe you can play the piano, but you are lost on any relevant subject.

    Now, why not post your comments from the previous “cost of doing business” thread? That was one of your weaker deflections.

    Hang your head in shame

  88. sumyungboi says:

    lee: “Sorry, forgot Dawkins’ credentials: blah, blah, blah…”

    And yet, he was still afraid to debate D’Souza.

  89. LeePHilI says:

    Oh really?

    http://collidinguniverses.blogspot.com/2008/07/universe-dinesh-dsouza-debates-richard.html

    Someone didn’t give you the partisan memo, sumyung, or maybe you just lack the knowledge about the subject.

    Granted, it didn’t make the major press and a very partisan blogger covered the event….but….it seems it happened, much to the contrary of YOUR reports.

    I was particularily impressed with THIS outtake from the blog:

    “But who said God was complicated? God has always been presented as a unity. Even a child would understand this.”

    A child, indeed. LOL

  90. LeePHilI says:

    CDB, CT.

    It’s a common term in business and other budgeting. I’m surprised that it escapes a self-proclaimed business genius.

    “You were defeated on every lie and piece of rhetoric BHOs emails fed you.”

    Now I’m on Obama’s email list? Oh, this gets better as it goes…LOL

  91. LeePHilI says:

    “So let’s say right now, a guy walked into our bar and said, ‘the private sector is doing fine.’ Well, do you know what we’d do? That’s right: we’d throw him out,” Boehner said in the Tampa Bay Times Forum. “If a guy walked into our bar … and said, ‘if you’ve got a business, you didn’t build that,’ do you know what we’d do? Throw him out. …”

    Nice analogy, Boehner. As if most people didn’t already know you drink too much…. Hint: the constant slur gives you away.

    Now, if you could sober up long enough to get the president’s quotes correct….

  92. His brother will not even go him for help. Romney saves young women and delivers firewood to the cold.

    Who is the better person?

  93. Now you accuse someone of being an alcoholic? Another low.

    Please send me a link to an SEC document that lists CDB. Heck, I’ll take any mainstream business magazine that used that acronym. Thanks! Petro one does not count.

  94. LeePHilI says:

    I’ll accuse someone of demonstrating alcoholism, anyday.

    Boehner has a constant slur – the possible sign of what is called “wet brain”.

    Boehner cries at the drop of a hat.

    Boehner is frequently seen drinking in public (not a requirement for office). He has taken the podium intoxicated.

    Last, but not least, using a barroom reference to the politics of electing a President of the United States? How low can you go?

    http://boehnerbooze.wordpress.com/about/

    To think that some people would ignore the very distinct possibility that the third in line for the Presidency shows so many alcoholic tendencies is really tragic. Remember, this is the person that could possibly have his hand on the nuclear attack of another nation. It would be nice to not see these tendencies.

    For the truly incapable of pulling themselves up by the bootstraps:

    http://www.nppa.org/professional_development/business_practices/cdb/

  95. LeePHilI says:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Kenya

    Uh…I hate to ruin the show, but it appears that health care in Kenya is government run, therefore George Obama wouldn’t need $1,000 for a child’s malady.

    ::::hooked finger in mouth sign:::::

    Someone caught a lot of fish, but it’s easy when trolling for bottom feeders.

  96. normajean says:

    Many of you are missing a very vital point. When it just so happens that Obama became president after one of the worst economic meltdowns in history, it seems you have all forgotten that whomever was at the helm would have had nothing to do with the banking crisis that occurred because of the greed & corruption of others. The aftermath was devastating & had global consequences. While we are not voting dem nor reb. in my household for many reasons, I can not blame the sad state of affairs on Obama.

  97. But you vote for Biden. LOL!

  98. Lynnwoodfats says:

    Now that Romney is the official nominee, I would like to give my official prediction about the election.
    Prediction 1: If Romney wins, in four years we will have a higher national debt, and still have a drug war, a police state, troops in 150 countries, and a national security/warfare state. Prediction 2: If Obama wins, in four years we will have a higher national debt, and still have a drug war, a police state, troops in 150 countries, and a national security/warfare state.

  99. sumyungboi says:

    Sorry, lee, but in your world of Google-search to copy-and-paste within 60 seconds, you failed to understand that the the al-jizzera “debate” was not a debate at all, neither participant were in the studio at the same time. This was per Dawkins, or he wouldn’t have appeared at all, ergo, he was afraid to debate D’Souza.

    Sorry pal, EPIC FAIL.

  100. Try again Hill. In theory it is subsidized. In practice you pay if you want immediate and quality care.

  101. Uh…I hate to ruin the show, but it appears that health care in Kenya is government run, therefore George Obama wouldn’t need $1,000 for a child’s malady.

    ::::hooked finger in mouth sign:::::

    Someone caught a lot of fish, but it’s easy when trolling for bottom feeders.
    _______________________________________________________

    The World Health Organization ranks the Kenyan government run health care system 140th in the world. Most would probably take even the slightest ailment across a few borders. Maybe George is smarter than his brother when it comes to evaluating national health outcomes.

  102. LeePHill wrote: Well…there goes a theory down the tubes.

    Ehill and I posted at exactly the same time.

    LOL
    _______________________________________________

    I have never subscribed to the ongoing theory that both Hill’s posting are one and the same. Even years of liberal brainwashing could not produce such perfectly identical clones.

  103. LeePHilI says:

    “you failed to understand that the the al-jizzera “debate” was not a debate at all, neither participant were in the studio at the same time.”

    Oh….I’ll have to remember that the next time Hannity “debates” someone in a remote location, on delayed video tape.

    EPIC FOOL.
    —————————

    Now that I’ve disclosed that Kenya has government health care and that the entire “George Obama Story” has about as much credibility as one of D’Souza’s “documentaries”, the excuses are being made on the fly, with no data support, mind you.

  104. LeePHilI says:

    Sumyung….please tell CT that he can’t be debating anyone on this forum because we’re not in the same room.

    I’d tell him, but he’d ask me to prove that we’re not in the same room.

    I’m amused that the WHO is a communist plot against American health care, until someone needs to quote it to “substantiate” a D’Souza claim

  105. LeePHilI says:

    “But you vote for Biden. LOL!”

    from someone who voted for Palin?????????????????

  106. sumyungboi says:

    lee, you keep digging a hole for yourself, because you don’t have a clue how the al-jizzera “debate” went. D’Souza was interviewed in the first segment, and Dawkins, (his insistence) was interviewed in a following segment. There was zero back and forth. Neither was able to respond to the other. Dawkins set the rules because of D’Souza’s history of making mincemeat of the atheist religion during various debates, most notably the Hitchens debate.

    You should take the time to learn the truth about what you’re popping off about, rather than read some atheist blog, take their word for it, and run in here and make a clown of yourself. As I said, and this seems to be a pattern for you: EPIC FAIL.

  107. LeePHilI says:

    “D’Souza’s history of making mincemeat of the atheist religion”

    First – atheism is to religion as bald is to a hairstyle.

    There is ZERO support data on the side of religion on any debate format, regardless of how you build up D’Souza. Hawkins probably had more pleasant things to do – like shave his head with a cheese grater while chewing on tin foil.

    A true atheist finds no need to debate that which doesn’t exist.

    What does his physical presence do, scare you that he might want to arm wrestle? (save it, I’ve seen his picture)

    As I quoted the Rightee blogger earlier –

    “But who said God was complicated? God has always been presented as a unity. Even a child would understand this.”

    Maybe it should be “ONLY a child”

    EPIC FOOL

  108. sumyungboi says:

    lee: “Now that I’ve disclosed that Kenya has government health care ..”

    What you’ve “disclosed” is that government health care is sub-par, wherever it’s tried. Following your logic, no Canadian ever comes to the US for a procedure or other health issue, since Canada has government health care.

    If you think that, in Kenya, a thousand bucks doesn’t buy you a spot in line, or a doctor willing to have his palms greased, you’re a bigger fool that I’d previously thought.

  109. LeePHilI says:

    Here, sumyungboi…..I’ll debate you. (even though you’re not here to drive the fear of an arm wrestling loss into my heart)

    My stand is that you are a complete fool for not believing in Zeus.

    Now, you get to prove that Zeus didn’t/doesn’t exist.

    I’ll check in later for laughs.

    By the way….as to the format for the D’Souza/Hawkins debate…did that mean that D’Souza couldn’t put his fingers in his ears and holler ‘lalalalalalalalalala’?

  110. LeePHilI says:

    “If you think that, in Kenya, a thousand bucks doesn’t buy you a spot in line, or a doctor willing to have his palms greased, you’re a bigger fool that I’d previously thought.”

    And you have proof of this, of course….

    Sort of like the proof that George Obama asked D’Souza, well know Obama hater, for the $1,000?

    One would think that a copy of a cancelled or cashier’s check would be presented (even if faked), just to sort of bolster the claim….

    If you accept D’Souza’s claims without valid proof, you are not a bigger fool than I thought, because my mind is open to all possibilities. I just have to let you keep going to raise the bar with each comment.

  111. sumyungboi says:

    lee, nice to see you’ve admitted defeat in the D’Souza / Dawkins debate topic.

    Also, atheism requires faith in something that cannot be proved, therefore atheism is a religion. Atheists have the double whammy of trying to prove a negative.

    I’m not a religious man, but there’s that one question that simply can’t be answered by science or religion. The brightest minds in the world can’t answer it, ever. And that’s why atheists debating their faith is like playing tic-tac-toe, the very best outcome you can hope for is a draw.

  112. sumyungboi says:

    I checked into a hotel in Mombasa once, not one of the nice ones north of town, but a crappy inner city hotel on the island. Within minutes, two Kenyan cops showed up, came into the room uninvited, and just “happen” to find some weed in a dresser. A hundred American bucks later, they left. Kenya, even at that time, (late 70’s) was not exactly third world, and the point of the story is that money talks. Don’t give me the “show me the proof” crap, no matter where you’re at, money talks.

  113. Hill, please keep this up. It is nice to see the wacky left floundering for all to see.

    It would have much smarter for you to say “BHO is disenfranchised from his brothers” than to pull your ‘prove it’ crap. Why should he post a copy of the check? There is no grand investigation or reason to suspect lying. His brother already knows the producer of 2016.

    You are not being critical, you are being childish. Admit that BHO is just not a good person. He is worth millions yet his family is starving. Dreams of my Father. LOL! He is just like dad, abandoning family.

  114. And why would people click on a random youtube link?

  115. SandHills says:

    Not you CT, you’ve already drunk too much Tea….but it fits the topic…

  116. LeePHilI says:

    “lee, nice to see you’ve admitted defeat in the D’Souza / Dawkins debate topic.”

    Someone though they were reading the President’s comment and could intepret it however they wish, regardless of the factuality of their statement.

    Between you and CT, I’m not sure which is funnier with your self-adoration.

    However, I’m amazing at how a debate can’t happen unless both parties are in the room…..unless it’s you and someone else on a TNT forum. You switched positions faster than Mitt Romney.

  117. LeePHilI says:

    CT – if the left is “floundering”….why is it that you don’t know anything about the “cost of doing business” and the economics application, there in and when your ignorance of the subject has been washed, dried and hung out to dry, you turn the conversation to pubescent congratulatory rhetoric? Not to mention fairy tales.

    You are not the first rube to buy into one of the Obama “documentaries”. Heck, in 2008, there was a fool on this forum that daily brought up Obama’s gay sex in limos topped with cocaine binging. Did you happen to notice how well that worked for McCain and Natasha? I think the term “landslide” was used.

    Trash like this is exactly what drive moderate independents to the corner who is the quietest about the subject matter. Intelligent people know the difference. D’Souza’s followers are nothing other than the 30% who wouldn’t vote for Obama if he walked on water and they’d just point out that he can’t swim.

  118. Could someone explain how a non-debate about theism/atheism is relevant to this thread’s topic?

  119. sumyungboi says:

    lee, you are a despicable, low person. You honestly think that you can twist and lie about a “debate” which was not a debate, and in any case your guy looked dumb, and come out looking good. You are truly, truly, a misguided and effed up individual. The other day, when I was lamenting the end of natural selection, you are the poster boy of whom I spoke.

    beerboy, mind your own business.

  120. Hill, still waiting for that link. That would affirm your major victory! Wow, in a debate over FEDERAL DEBT you throw out “CDB”. Yes, I had no f ing idea what that was in context.

    As a matter of fact, please tell me what that had to do with that subject. Thanks. Please post a link to an educational document or financial publication first. Go ahead and google it. A quick scan shows the photographers use it. Real mainstream. CNBC used the term “cost of doing business” with no acronym. Same for WSJ.

    Your only victory was wasting 1 minute of my time. The cost to you was looking like a total d-bag clown. That is the CDB.

  121. sumyungboi – really? That is your explanation for this thread drift? “mind your own business”?

  122. LeePHilI says:

    beerBoy….the relevance is nothing, other than sumyungboi trying to bolster the resume of the lastest in a long list of Obama Haters and their fairy tales.

    Funny how sumyung loses his cool when I point out his hypocrisy, huh?

    At 9:00 this morning, sumyung declares that only a face to face meeting qualifies as a debate (missing the point when I brought up Hannity’s favorite “debate tactic” of debating a formerly filmed video of his adversary). But….a few hours later….he’s declaring “victory” in our “debate” which was online……

    Kinda cute, huh?

  123. LeePHilI says:

    CT – oh you need a link where the Federal government uses the terminology “CDB” (which is not an acronym, by the way)? Do you need it on the first Tuesday of the last month of the first year of the decade declared at a later date, when the moon was full, tides were high and aligned with Uranus and Neptune?

    You are really a child, aren’t you?

    If my link to a business cite:

    http://www.nppa.org/professional_development/business_practices/cdb/index.html

    Isn’t example enough that it’s a common ABBREVIATION for adults in business, then you’ll just have to continue on with your childish routine similar to “why” repeated over and over.

    You’d be less embarrassed if you just admitted that you didn’t have a clue on the subject of economics and budgeting and get on with your life.

    There isn’t one thing that I’ve learned in life that wasn’t preceded with me admitting that I didn’t know it in the first place. Admission of ignorance is the first step to knowledge.

  124. LeePHilI says:

    Hey…CT…here’s a clue for you. I’m not a photographer and I’ve known of “CDB” since doing budgets for businesses clear back in the 1970s.

    Sorry, sonnyboy, I’m not doing your homework for you.

    Like someone usually says….”I don’t have to prove anything, you have to prove me wrong.

    LMAO

  125. Great work Hill. I already stated only a photography org uses that term. I was not into economics or alive when you were actually working (a claim tough to believe in it’s own right). It is not found in modern accounting.

    How petty of you keep this up days later on another thread, but I am game. Makes you look ridiculous.

    The great irony is after you completely failed on a debate over the federal budget, you deflect to this.

    And stupid, it is an acronym. Look that one up. Wikipedia will spell it out for you.

  126. LeePHilI says:

    “I already stated only a photography org uses that term.”

    And you were wrong there also. It’s a long used term in business.

    Next?

    “ac·ro·nym [ ákrə nìm ] word formed from initials: a word formed from the initials or other parts of several words, e.g. “NATO,” from the initial letters of “North Atlantic Treaty Organization”

    ab·bre·vi·a·tion [ ə brvee áysh'n ] reduced form: a shortened form of a word or phrase
    reduction: the shortening of a word or phrase to be used to represent the full form

    Difference? One creates a word, the other need not.

    Why do you foolishly argue such issues with someone who (1) has a background in communications and (2) has a computer in front of him????

    I’m still amused how I “completely failed” a “debate” that cannot take place unless it is face to face (thanks to sumyungboi) and said debate couldn’t be addressed by you because you didn’t even understand what “cost of doing business” (one of the essentials of budgeting) was.

    THAT….by the way….is “moving the goalposts”. LOL

    Stick with me, kid. You’ll be talkin’ really good like me do.

    Just curious….how would you pronounce the “acronym” CDB?

    Cdaba?
    Cudb?
    CDeeBee?

    Too much fun. I should pay extra for this entertainment.

  127. LeePHilI says:

    “I was not into economics or alive when you were actually working”

    No kidding?????????

    Geee….I didn’t know that…..

    School’s out for the day. Class dismissed.

  128. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acronym_and_initialism
    http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/acronym

    Hey stupid, they do not have to make a word. See the example of “FBI” and “CEO”

    Now you made a fool of yourself multiple times tonight. I already pointed out the ONE organization that uses your ACRONYM. Not exactly a trend, nothing to do with the federal debt.

    You are truly a POS.

  129. LeePHilI says:

    CDB is an abbreviation, not an acronym.

    If you are incapable of comprehending the dictionary defitions I posted, I can’t help you.

    Your temper tantrum is just like what I say Scott Walker do when the MSNBC crew cross examined him on his and Ryan’s lie about the closing of the GM plant in Janeville, WI. They tried to blame it on Obama but it closed, other than a skeleton crew, in 2008.

    Republicans think that they can lie and misrepresent sometning…then repeat it enough times to make it true. It doesn’t work that way and definitely doesn’t work that way with me.

    The only fool is the one incapable of reading and comprehending English.

    Try a dictionary, as opposed to a “wiki”. They’ve been around for centuries.

  130. LeePHilI says:

    Read your own Webster’s link.

    The first sentence tells you the difference.

    Sheesh…I’ll read it for you.

  131. LeePHilI says:

    And just to clear the air…

    Here is what Obama DID say to Janeville workers in February of 2008:

    “I believe if our government is there to support you, and give you the assistance you need to re-tool and make this transition, that this plant will be here for another hundred years,” Obama said, some eleven months before taking office.”

    As usual, Ryan and Walker misrepresented Obama’s words, claiming he promised that the plant wouldn’t close.

    The “government there to support” was led by GEORGE BUSH in 2008.

    That’s what Ryan, Romney and Walker deliver….lies, lies, lies and lies

  132. davehill90 says:

    What evidence is there for any of this? It’s just crazy ranting of things this person has been brain washed to believe. He’s “seen” bad water in other countries and ‘assumes’ conservatives want that here. What a bunch of hooey

  133. “also: …..”

    Right in the link. What a joke.

    Nice attempt at thread shift and blame Bush garbage. Do you have any pride?

  134. Lee – it is actually an initialism, not an abbreviation.

    So many nits, so little time.

    CT – gotta laugh about you complaining about an “attempted thread drift” on a thread that debated the motivation of Dawkins deciding to avoid debates with D’Souza about the validity of Creationism.

    Goose, meet gander.

  135. Or, the debate argument bored me. If it was a rebuttal to a taped interview, that would not qualify as a debate. Hills silly theory that you have to be in the same room killed the topic.

  136. LeePHilI says:

    beerBoy….as I pointed out in CT’s link….

    ——————–

    “Hills silly theory that you have to be in the same room killed the topic.”

    Someone didn’t read sumyungboi’s rant:

    sumyungboi says:
    Aug. 29, 2012 at 9:08 am Sorry, lee, but in your world of Google-search to copy-and-paste within 60 seconds, you failed to understand that the the al-jizzera “debate” was not a debate at all, neither participant were in the studio at the same time

    I guess your silly theory is that sumyungboi can say something, and I get blamed for its stupidity because I quoted it

  137. LeePHilI says:

    Oh and CT….since the thead/letter is about Paul Ryan’s campaign, I’d say his campaign speech, although after the letter, is quite contextual.

    You’re just uncomfortable that Ryan and Walker got drilled by a crew of pundits because they lied.

  138. Hill, he then clarified. Grow up.

  139. “Since I posted the link straight to USA.gov, figured you would man up and admit defeat.”

    Liar. The only links you posted were to the Washington Examiner, Newsmax, and The Daily.

    Stop lying.

  140. averageJose says:

    How many times can I…

  141. averageJose says:

    …post at the exact same time ???

  142. averageJose says:

    3?

  143. sumyungboi says:

    lee: “However, I’m amazing at how a debate can’t happen unless both parties are in the room”

    I’m amazed at how you can sit there and lie, after I pointed out the facts. I shouldn’t be, because you’re a leftist, and lying is what leftists do.

    * I’m very familiar with the D’Souza / Dawkins Al-Jazeera episode. You’re not.

    * I pointed out that Dawkins was afraid to debate D’Souza. He was.

    * You Googled it, found a blogger that’s almost as dumb as you are, and came back here and made a fool of yourself.

    D’Souza and Dawkins never debated on Al-Jazeera. They appeared in two different segments, and at Dawkins’ insistence, he (Dawkins) had the last segment.

    You are now trying to re-define the word “debate”, because you embarrassed yourself, got spanked, and sent on your way. Sorry bub, Dawkins is still a coward, and you’re still dumb.

  144. http://blog.usa.gov/post/27988803354/how-can-the-government-help-you

    The comment was removed. Not a challenge to find, a simple copy and paste of the quote.

    Be better.

  145. Wow, the federal government telling citizens about some of its programs. How terrible!

  146. “The comment was removed.”

    LOL, sure it was. And the check is in the mail. And the dog ate your homework.

  147. LeePHilI says:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Popper_debate#Other_forms_of_debate

    It seems that more people than I classify “debate” as something other than two people yelling at each other in the same room.

    I’m still wondering if D’Souza is a WWE character in his other life, thus Dawkins “feared” him……

    As per your definition of debate, Hannity can no longer “debate” a video clip of a guest.

  148. Nice deflect Hill Jr. You were proven an idiot, yet again.

  149. sumyungboi says:

    lee, seriously, this is one of those times where you admit to yourself that you were a dumb a$$, and you learn and move on.

  150. LeePHilI says:

    seriously boi, don’t you get tired of trying to use those ridiculous “did you stop beating your wife” tactics in your argument?

    You’ve been caught changing the direction of the river (more than once) and are now trying to use the “you know you’re wrong so give up” method of arguing.

  151. “You were proven an idiot, yet again.”

    More projection.

  152. sumyungboi says:

    lee, seriously, you’ve been beaten. It’s painful watching you try to defend your position. Give it up, man.

  153. Not a good thread for the Hill klan.

    Incredible how much more credible and intelligent they would come off if they just admitted they were wrong.

  154. averageJose says:

    the hills have lies

    Laugh my a** off!

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