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ELECTION: History shows the truth

Letter by William F. Johnston, Tacoma on Aug. 22, 2012 at 1:08 pm with 94 Comments »
August 22, 2012 2:33 pm

Columnist David Brooks tells us that “Romney’s the ticket” (TNT, 8-22). Brooks also spent eight years writing how great “Bushonomics” was until the economic disaster came crashing down around him.

On the other hand, from 2001 on, columnist Paul Krugman (TNT, 8-22) has warned of the “con game” that George Bush, the Republicans and now the Romney-Ryan ticket is trying to sell the voters yet again.

Krugman has not been a big Obama fan, but he has been consistently correct in his analysis of the Republican rich man con game. Brooks, on the other hand, has been little more than a party hack spitting out propaganda from Republican National Committee HQ in the D.C. beltway.

Who are you going to believe? Not hard to figure out; the history is obvious and there for anyone to read.

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  1. Krugman has not been a big Obama fan… Brooks, on the other hand, has been little more than a party hack spitting out propaganda from Republican National Committee…

    That giant sucking sound; William’s credibility in critical analysis going down the drain.

    Krugman is a fan of ANY democrat, but he’s married to Keynesianism – the preferred policy of so many failed European economies.

  2. GHTaxPayer says:

    HISTORY DOES SHOW THE TRUTH – Obama has flushed $5 Trillion down the drain and unemployment has been above 8% his entire term. Over 8 Million Americans have filed NEW unemployment claims JUST THIS YEAR ! And Obama’s solution is to give amnesty to 1.8 Million ILLEGAL ALIENS !

    Obamanomics = Massive Failure !

  3. The boiled down explanation:
    Obama bad
    Romney worse.

  4. Fibonacci says:

    I wonder if Romney read ALL the report, or just the part he wants to use–oh wait dumb question, of course he only read the part he wants. The report also said “if the tax and spending cuts” go through as planned in January that such fiscal tightening will lead to economic conditions in 2013 that will possibly be considered a recession.” So, if the Republikans would actually compromise we just might be able to avoid this. But everyone knows that they would be willing to see the country go down in flames if it meant they could regain the presidency.

  5. Candles16 says:

    “the history is obvious and there for anyone to read”…

    True but we have lots of what John Boehner calls ‘knuckledraggers’ who apparently can’t read or can’t comprehend our history. Most aren’t even literate enough to understand current events, much less history.

    Witness the big lies that the GOP is slinging around that so many of the gullible swallow whole. Joe Goebbels would be proud of the GOP’s big lies that Romney is putting out. Unfortunately we see that everything Romney is campaigning on is a lie and the knuckledraggers don’t have enough critical thinking to understand it.

  6. menopaws says:

    I had the opportunity to look at Mr. Brooks column .I enjoy his columns and while I am an Obama supporter, Brooks at least, unlike Charles Kraut whatever, isn’t either dumb or in need of better medication. So, we have to appreciate those with different viewpoints when they are presented in a cogent, intelligent way………..Unlike GH taxpayer, Mr. Brooks can make his points with intelligence and isn’t courting the whack job vote…….Even not agreeing with him—I am a real fan. In the world of conservatism, most of Fox is populated by zealots….or idiots. Respect those who work from logic and facts…….
    Speaking of better meds—GHtaxpayer, I can literally hear you shouting through this blog……..Chill out and pay attention to one of the FEW smart people making your case for you…..I do NOT like Paul Krugman and I am an Obama supporter…..He is toooo liberal for me………I don’t suppose you noticed that Mr. Brooks complimented the President for making some necessary cuts………Oh, wait—it’s all on Obama……..He has done NOTHING right……….This is where Republicans lose votes—their hatred of Obama goes beyond rational…..It is actually kind of sick and out of control. I don’t vote for mean and I don’t vote for whack jobs……….I also don’t vote for wimps……..That about covers most of the people you have got running. Mr. Mitt needs to find his spine…….that is truly why women don’t like him.

  7. ThomasSkidmore says:

    Wow…gotta admit it…”beerboy” hit it perfect this time!

  8. SwordofPerseus says:

    David Brooks is and author and columnist. I enjoy his writing and some of his observations are worth noting.

    Paul Krugman is a Professor of Economics at Princeton University, Centenary Professor at the London School of Economics, and an op-ed columnist for The New York Times. He has won a Nobel Prize for Economics.

    Not that David Brooks is not thoughtful and entertaining, I simply would look to Professor Krugman when it comes to economics and matters of foreign affairs and who would make a better president. Not sure who I’d rather have a beer with.

  9. took14theteam says:

    Proly Obama……

  10. BlaineCGarver says:

    Paul “Enron” Krugman will defend tax and spend down to the last dime America owns. BTW, Bush’s economy was doing just fine until the ‘Crat congress took over in 2007. Reagan’s tax cuts slashed the misery index that another infamous ‘Crat layed on us. Even JFK, cut the 90% upper tax rate, and the economy blossomed until Johnson declared war on poverty, and started spending us into the grave that Reagan rescued us from.

  11. SwordofPerseus says:

    Poorly attempted slam bcg not gonna bite. Yes tax and spend as opposed to borrow and spend like the Rethugliconz. Wow revisionist history at it’s worst BlameCG. Reagan raised taxes 16 times you clueless tool. At least Reagan had the balls and the brains to know when it was good for the country to raise taxes. Something the current crop of useless Rethugliconz in the House and Senate have miserably abrogated their responsibilities to run the country. All the while deflecting their irresponsibility. And when are you going to go study civics and find out who raises and lowers taxes. Democrats have consistently had to raise taxes to make up for Republicon deficit spending policies.

    Fact – when the Dems control the gov the people do better in every way.

  12. Is it possible to look at “what is” and attribuite it to “who is in charge”?

    If you like the way things are, keep the current leadership in charge.

    If you don’t; get rid of them in November.

    It is that simple.

  13. No one is calling for an extension of Bush policies. He spent too much and expanded govt. BHO was so bent on Obamacare he chose not to care about the economy, budgets, or tax reform and just kept the status quo.

    Krugman is more of a political pundit than economist. His bias is disgusting and an insult to the profession. In his world debts do not matter. Motivation does not matter.

    BHo has followed his principles, and we are stuck in this economy.

    Let’s remember BHO also got a Nobel prize…

  14. LeePHill says:

    Hey Clam…how’s that “liberal rag” Newsweek doing, since Daily Beast took it over?

    Newsweek is liberal…. Paul Krugman is partisan…

    Got any more? I need a few laughs.

    Obama has flushed $5 Trillion down the drain and unemployment has been above 8% his entire term.

    Bush doubled the national debt and unemployment increased 85% during his entire term.

    This, GHTaxslayer would call a success.

  15. SwordofPerseus says:

    Conc you clearly have no clue who Krugman is, new to the politics game aren’t you. Are you old enough to drink in this state?

  16. alindasue says:

    CT8 said, “Let’s remember BHO also got a Nobel prize…”

    When people start awarding Nobel prizes to themselves, then that observation will become relevant to this conversation.

  17. truthbusterguy says:

    For as long as I can remember I have had to hold my nose when I voted for Pres. I now realize that there is NO perfect candidate.

    Romney has his faults but obama is the worst president in history. And I voted for Jimmy Carter.

    Face it friends can you really say obama deserves to be re-elected? At least be truthful with yourself.

  18. TBG – I voted for Anderson so you can’t blame me for Carter or Reagan.

  19. “Bush’s economy was doing just fine until the ‘Crat congress took over in 2007.”

    Here’s a clue. When you make stuff up, you should at least try to make it somewhat hard to debunk.

    Unemployment rose steadily for two years after Bush’s “job-creating” tax cut. It took six years for it to drop back to where it started.

    “Reagan’s tax cuts slashed the misery index that another infamous ‘Crat layed on us.”

    Unemployment rose for eighteen consecutive months following Reagan’s tax cuts. It didn’t drop back down to where it started until almost four years later.

  20. “No one is calling for an extension of Bush policies.”

    Cut taxes! Reduce regulations! No, that isn’t at all what Bush or Reagan proposed, is it?

    “In his [Krugman's] world debts do not matter”

    No, that was Dick “Reagan proved that deficits don’t matter” Cheney, remember?

  21. took14theteam says:

    Looks like the _hill’s finally morphed into one.

    Good job dudes….

  22. Got any more? I need a few laughs.

    Have you checked the bottom of your shoes lately?

    Bush doubled the national debt and unemployment increased 85% during his entire term.

    By election day 2012 0bama will have doubled the national debt in four years (for the Larry’s of the world, that’s half of Bushes “entire term”), and increased long term unemployment by 100%.

    This, LarryPeeHill would call a “success”.

  23. Fact – when the Dems control the gov the people do better in every way.

    Yup, they’ve proved that over the last 6 years of anywhere from 66.66% to 100% “control”.

    Please, swoppy, I have a broken rib.

  24. “Have you checked the bottom of your shoes lately?”

    Thanks for the reminder that I stepped in some Clamat0. I’ll go outside and scrape it off.

  25. One party wants to address our tough budget issues, one wants to spend until we can longer spend.

    The BHO budget got zero votes from his party. Fact. Tough issues avoided.

    Bush- Medicare expansion, progressive tax code, expansion of govt. Leftist 101.

    Bush and Cheney are retired. Buck up and talk about today. No one wants the dem economy of 07-09 or the BHO years. Look FORWARD to the Romney years.

  26. “Buck up and talk about today.”

    Glad to. Unemployment is down about 20% from its high, and there are about 4 million more Americans working today than then. The stock market is up to about double its low point. The GDP has grown for eleven or twelve consecutive quarters. Although the recovery could admittedly be stronger, we aren’t doing so badly, all things considered.

    Romney wants to cut the budget dramatically, which will do to the economy today exactly what it did to the economy in 1937: it will cause a severe downturn.

  27. alindasue says:

    Clamat0 said, “By election day 2012 0bama will have… increased long term unemployment by 100%.”

    In order for unemployment to have been increased by 100%, it would have to be at 16.6%. As of July it was at 8.3%, exactly what it was in February 2009 right after President Obama took office.

    According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics
    http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

    From May 1997 until September 2001, unemployment sat at or below 5%. It dropped to it’s lowest point (3.9%), interestingly enough, during the period of September through December 2000.

    From September 2001 until September 2008, the rate bounced up and down between 5.0% and 6.3%. Then it began a steady climb reaching 7.8% four months later during President George W. Bush’s last month in office. It continued to climb until it peaked at 10% in October of 2009.

    The rate stayed in the mid to high 9% range throughout 2010, then dropped to 9.1% beginning in 2011. It finally dropped to the low 8% range (8.1-8.3) in January of this year where it has been sitting since.

    Now, if we compare President Bush’s lowest point, 3.9%, with his highest point, 7.8% in January 2009, there is actually a 100% increase. If you look at individual terms though, the largest climb was between 4.4% and 7.8% during President Bush’s second term.

    Unemployment from the first February of a term to the last July of that term (for equal comparison):

    President Bush 1st term 4.2% – 5.8%
    President Bush 2nd term 5.4% – 5.8%
    President Obama 8.3% – 8.3%

    I’m not one who thinks any president has full influence over the employment rate in this country. However, the historic numbers do not support your claims about President Obama.

    As for Mitt Romney… history says he has potential to be a half-way decent leader BUT his best work (in Massachusetts) is the very work he’s been separating himself from…

    Once he’s finished catering to the party line, what’s left of Mitt Romney?

  28. blakeshouse says:

    The socialists are all here regurgitating crap they have gleaned from Huffpo and MSNBC. Better to keep your mouth shut and have people think you a fool than to open it and remove any and all doubt.

  29. allindasue, the key phrase was “long term”.

    According to the BLS, when Barack Obama was sworn in January, 2009, 2.6 million people were reported as having been unemployed for longer than 6 months. But as of June 2012, that number has “soared more than 100 percent to 5.3 million.”

    HTH

  30. The hills – firing up the insult machine, I see. What up mole? Daddy call for some help?

    Your shoe was a nice start. But in your case, you’ll need a full body scan – head to toe (not that the results will amount to anything more than a confirmation). And, unfortunately, you won’t be able to scrape the hill off.

  31. LeePHill says:

    http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/NPGateway

    Insert the dates January 20, 2001 to January 19 2009

    Debt went from 5.7 trillion to 10.6 trillion.

    While not a PERFECT doubling….close enough for government work.

    As to unemployment, it went from 4.2% to 7.9% during the Bush Administration – an 88% increase from 2001 to 2009.

    I’m not sure why conservatives challenge statistics that are easily found on the internet. They always end up looking stupid.

    Kinda like calling Newsweek “liberal” when they’ve been bought out by an ultra conservative publisher…..

    As to “socialists”….I prefer being a “socialist” to being an “anti-social-ist”

    “The BHO budget got zero votes from his party.”

    The grownups in the room understand what that vote was intended to signify. This was a procedural move to force a new bill with the revisions want.

    Like I said…the grownups.

  32. menopaws says:

    The righties are getting pretty desperate…..CT8—doesn’t want to talk about Bush-“past history”….How does he think we got here?? The selective memory of the right just is fascinating. 2008, Bush’s Treasury Secretary Paulson desperately trying to keep the banks from closing their doors, Wall Street in total meltdown……….There were a few days when it was questionable whether anyone would have access to their own accounts………..
    Well, those who refuse to learn from history are DOOMED to repeat it………Mark your ballots–if Romney wins, our money will be buried in the back yard……..The Koch Brothers and all his corporate masters have BIG plans……..I respect Obama for trying to clean up this mess in the face of no help, little respect and even attempts to make things worse…….Nothing like “patriot” Republicans getting our credit downgraded…….Makes you all warm and fuzzy, doesn’t it???? CT8—-Try to learn something–the warmed over Romney plan ISN’T Reaganomics. Reagan had sense enough to RAISE taxes when the country needed more revenue. These morons just want more money for their bottom line……Why do they NEVER mention his raising taxes??? that piece of history apparently doesn’t fit their propaganda machine.

  33. Nice rewrite of history. Zero votes because it was a failure.

    No one is claiming Bush economic principles are the path forward. Why are you stuck on that?

  34. All of us – on any side of the political spectrum – should be very, very concerned about the case of Brandon Raub who was, according to authorities, “not arrested” by the FBI, CIA, and local police who handcuffed and, without reading him his Miranda Rights, and took him in for psychiatric evaluation against his will because of Facebook postings.

    Straight out of Stalin’s USSR – those who commit “thought crimes” against the State are, obviously, mentally insane. Aren’t you glad we have a secure homeland that diligently protects us from potential terrorists?

  35. CT – but there are several, including you, who are claiming that Romney’s Bush redux plans are the path forward.

  36. SwordofPerseus wrote: Fact – when the Dems control the gov the people do better in every way.

    Fact rewritten: When Dems control the people the gov gets bigger in every way!!!! Krugman would even agree.

  37. I’m not sure why conservatives challenge statistics that are easily found on the internet.

    LMAO!

    Uhhh, Larry, no one is “challenging” anything but your straw man statement right now.

    I merely pointed out that 0bama has managed to accomplish far worse than Bush thus far. Difference is 0bama’s done it in 4 years – not eight.

    Looney libs love to move the goal posts 100% for conservatives. Shall we compare Bush’s first 4 years of spending and unemployment totals with 0bama’s?

    Didn’t think so.

    Of course, lame Larry will insist on skewing the ugliness of unemployment numbers by using percentage of increase rather than total unemployment. And never mind actual unemployed.

    UE rate; January and February 2001: 4.2%
    UE rate January 2005: 5.2%

    Gee… wonder if 0bama would take that 5.2% rate right now?

    Larry, an apple is not an orange painted red… or green… or yellow – no matter how hard you try. But then your contemporaries here don’t know the difference so… carry on. I always appreciate laughing at you – good for the heart.

  38. LeePHill says:

    “UE rate; January and February 2001: 4.2%
    UE rate January 2005: 5.2%”

    UE rate; January 2009 – 7.9

    7.9, subtract 5.2 = 51.9% increase in UE since January 2005!!!!!!

    BTW – the increase from 2001 to 2005 was 20%!!!!!

    Enjoy the math lesson as well.

    Remember Bush’s call for a stimulus?

    A certain Congressman spoke passionately about passing this bill…

    “What we’re trying to accomplish today with the passage of this third stimulus package is to create jobs and help the unemployed,” Ryan said. “What we’re trying to accomplish is to pass the kinds of legislation that when they’ve passed in the past have grown the economy and gotten people back to work.”

    Yep….THAT Ryan…..LOL

    That unemployment must have gotten really bad for Paul Ryan to want a stimulus bill passed

  39. Ok, so he learned from that mistake. BHO tripled down on Keynes. We are now more broke. Many stimulus packages later and nothing to show for it.

    The attempt to make this about Bush is pathetic.

  40. BHO tripled down on Keynes.

    Explain please. Krugman complained that Obama’s attempt at a stimulus was half-hearted – not even a “single Keynes” let alone a “tripled down” Keynes.

    “many stimulus packages later”

    identify the “many” please. I am aware of the TARP and the Stimulus.

  41. CT – remember, that “third stimulus package” that Ryan was complaining about was during the Bush Administration.

  42. GHTaxPayer says:

    BREAKING NEWS: 372,000 Americans just filed NEW unemployment claims last week, bring total for year to updated 10.8 MILLION.

    Obama’s solution to massive unemployment and 50% increase in poverty under his policies? More fundraising and golfing !

    Let them eat cake !

  43. GHTaxPayer says:

    Help is on the way for the Middle Class – but extremely bad news for libs as most accurate Presidential winner model shows Romney winning !!

    http://www.colorado.edu/news/releases/2012/08/22/analysis-election-factors-points-romney-win-university-colorado-study-says

  44. “firing up the insult machine, I see. What up mole? Daddy call for some help?”

    ROFLMAO – that’s hysterical, coming from you!

  45. 7.9, subtract 5.2 = 51.9% increase in UE since January 2005!!!!!!

    There go the goal posts again.

    Hmmm… wonder if 0bama would take 7.9% right now.

    Yeah, fun to play with unemployment increases when expressed as a percentage ‘cuz actual numbers hurt. Meanwhile the longest, slowest recovery since the last depression continues with no end in sight.

  46. SandHills says:

    Now we are hearing from Ryan of a Romney Plan, to be put into effect in January (if elected) to eliminate the automatic cuts to the budget.

    Remember, Ryan is part of the process that logjammed Congress so that it had to put these trip-wire cuts in place.

    Wow, again put foot in mouth – publicly announcing that now, by Ryan no less, is along the same lines as the abortion issue. Both are part and parcel of the GOP vision for America, and really has no impact on the voters Romney already has locked up.

    But can’t Democrats see how hypocritical this is for Ryan to NOW have a plan to keep the draconian budget cuts from happening, when he was one of the main reasons they were established in the first place.

    As I keep saying, Romney has all the votes now he is going to get, he just has to hope for a low voter turnout from those who voted for Obama in ’08. But along with the abortion issue, the GOP platform, and blatant hypocrisy from Ryan, Romney’s campaign seems hell bent on rousing the same voters who gave Obama the WH in ’08.

    But being raised rich, one certainly can understand how Romney can be so unaware and out of touch with how a community organizer like Obama can use this as ammunition to play the right tune.

    Again my simple analogy: The cruise ship of self interest, the SS Romney, or the Pied Piper of class warfare….given the numbers and types of uncomitted voters out there….who would you bet on?

  47. The side that acted like adults and passed a budget. Not the side that presents a budget and gets ZERO votes. Not one token symbol of support.

    House passed a budget after Pelosi handed off the gavel. Senate (run by dems for those ignorant of current political affairs) is where nothing happens. Harry is too busy lobbying for his kids employers to care about the average citizen.

  48. LeePHill says:

    “Hmmm… wonder if 0bama would take 7.9% right now.”

    Woulda, coulda, shoulda….

    Here is what we KNOW to be true.

    Unemployment escalated 88% during the Bush Administration. During the Obama Administration, unemployment hit a record of 10% and is now at 8%, thus a 20% improvement from the high of 10%.

    I’ll bet Bush would have taken a 20% decrease versus an 88% increase.

    Meanwhile, no one wants to talk about Paul Ryan and the stimulus? Doesn’t anyone find it interesting how Ryan talked about the need for stimulus during the Bush Administration, but changed his tune when Obama took office (even though he made sure his district got some)?

    I wonder how many people know that Paul Ryan voted for over $6 trillion dollars in spending that created deficit….yet pretends to be Mr. Debt Elimination.

  49. LeePHill says:

    “CT8 says:
    Aug. 23, 2012 at 11:36 am The side that acted like adults and passed a budget.”

    You don’t pass a budget if it’s a bad budget.

    Business 101.

    I would think that everyone knows….oh…nevermind.

  50. SandHills says:

    But CT, when the GOP only comes forth with self-interest proposals, where than can be no compromises expected, this is the logjam that Ryan was a main engineer of.

    But rather than getting too deep in the weeds…please answer my analogy.

    Of course you may not like the depiction of a rich man’s cruise ship…so what about a stiff Morman, competing for the types of votes you and I both know are not well read in economic principles and the finer points of politics.

    How do you think Romney can compete with a community organizer for these votes….as I believe all the more finer points of this election can be debated and discussed into infinity?

  51. LeePHill says:

    “CT8 says:
    Aug. 23, 2012 at 7:52 am Ok, so he learned from that mistake. BHO tripled down on Keynes. We are now more broke. Many stimulus packages later and nothing to show for it.
    The attempt to make this about Bush is pathetic.

    1. Ryan gets to make mistakes. How nice.

    2. “Tripled down”????????

    3. We weren’t broke at $10 trillion, but we are at $15T????

    4. Nothing to show? Ask Ryan about his news toys.

    5. About Bush? NOPE. About Ryan.

  52. SandHills says:

    In fact I have the most sure way to predict the election now. Go to every county clerk and see the numbers for voter registration. And a sample could be made here in Washington.

    Only if the Eastern Counties here in Washington have made great gains in voter registration would it make much of a difference to the I-5 corridor block of Democrat control (why it is almost a given Obama has our electoral vote).

    Take a look at the Red State – Blue State maps of ’08, at the county level. If the info on voter registration gains were available, the election could be called today.

    I suspect the strategists in the GOP already know this, and why voter ID was pushed harder than ever in certain sates.

    So if its not too late, motivated Dems better be knocking on doors…apathy is the only candidate Obama has to defeat, and voter apathy is the only way Romney gets into the WH

  53. Now we are hearing from Ryan of a Romney Plan, to be put into effect in January (if elected) to eliminate the automatic cuts to the budget.

    Uhhmm… if congress fails to act on the debt ceiling “in the lame duck session”. Left a few critical details aout there, Sandy.

    Have you read the latest CBO report on what will happen if sequestration is allowed to occur? FYI:

    http://www.examiner.com/article/cbo-warns-of-recession-if-us-falls-over-fiscal-cliff-congress-can-change-future

    Do you think 9.2% unemployment and another recession is a good thing? (I know, I know, little patty murray does).

    Remember, Ryan is part of the process that logjammed Congress so that it had to put these trip-wire cuts in place.

    How so? How many House debt ceiling bills did harry reid shoot down on orders from the White House, as a measns of playing a desperate game of brinksmanship with the American economy?

    Wow, again put foot in mouth – publicly announcing that now, by Ryan no less, is along the same lines as the abortion issue. Both are part and parcel of the GOP vision for America…

    What the eff are you talking about? Beyond hyperbole.

    But can’t Democrats see how hypocritical this is for Ryan to NOW have a plan to keep the draconian budget cuts from happening…

    Good Lord man, please read this and pay attention to the meaning of “sequestration” and what Ryan/ Romney are promising to do to prevent it’s (according to the CBO) ruinous effects on the economy:

    http://content.usatoday.com/communities/onpolitics/post/2012/08/ryan-romney-sequester-plan-january/1#.UDZ4bEK-rao

    As I keep saying, Romney has all the votes now he is going to get, he just has to hope for a low voter turnout from those who voted for Obama in ’08. But along with the abortion issue, the GOP platform, and blatant hypocrisy from Ryan, Romney’s campaign seems hell bent on rousing the same voters who gave Obama the WH in ’08

    LMAO, better read this too – these guys haven’t missed in 32 years:

    http://www.mercurynews.com/elections/ci_21382461/romney-will-win-election-state-by-state-study

    But being raised rich, one certainly can understand how Romney can be so unaware and out of touch with how a community organizer like Obama can use this as ammunition to play the right tune.

    http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/059/143/Ohwow.jpg

    Again my simple analogy: The cruise ship of self interest, the SS Romney, or the Pied Piper of class warfare….given the numbers and types of uncomitted voters out there….who would you bet on?

    I’d bet SH is an alias. Proof positive is Larry’s coronation of you as this site’s foremost conservative.

    This comment is one for the archives.

  54. SandHills says:

    Not a conservative cheerleader stuck in the Fox News bubble either clams. My main theme has not been to cheer for either candidate just point out their flaws to their syncophants.

    I labled Obama as the Pied Piper community organizer as well. i'” stick by my opinion that Romney has all the votes he is likely to get already. Can you state, other than wishfully, where he expects to pick up anymore?

    Having Ryan as his running mate served more as a red flag for democrats as it it did for his campaign. He could have picked anyone, and his voters – mainly motivated by beating Obama than any other issue – would have been just as happy (as happy as all those Southern voters who voted against Romney in the primaries).

    I still say apathy that draws down the yet not committed (a helluva a number who never discuss politcs, and rarely vpte at all) from making it too the polls is the only shot Romney has. Its not cheerleading it is my opinion, whether anyone agrees with it at all. But having Ryan (almost as bad as if Romney had picked Akin) surely stirs the emotions of the democrats – having the Fox news bubble discount that emotion as a factor is doing so without realizing how it does reduces apathy. And Romney can’t win if he gets the voters he had in ’08 – to think Romney can win some of those votes is a pipedream – only those voters not voting at all helps him.

    And it certainly appears Ryan serves as a lightenrod, whether you see it or not.

    So even without getting into the weeds, I will only submit again my succinct point. A stiff Morman (who now has a running mate who does best at inflaming Democrats) running against a Pied Piper community organizer who uses all the amunnition privided by Romney/Romney to wage class warfare?

    I take many hits from both sides on this forum because I am not a blind cheerleader for entrenched political views,
    I will survive yours as well clam…as beerboy/publico/ menopaws have certainly taken their shots….

  55. SandHills says:

    ..Romney can’t win if “Obama” gets the votes he had in ’08…..

  56. Ryan was selected to try to mollify the Paul delegates…..and pick up that $10 million campaign donation.

    Short term decision that, in the long term, will make the etch-a-sketch approach to the campaign very difficult to sell.

  57. alindasue says:

    Clamat0 said, “Good Lord man, please read this and pay attention to the meaning of “sequestration” and what Ryan/ Romney are promising to do to prevent it’s (according to the CBO) ruinous effects on the economy:”

    From that same article: “Ryan did not offer details of what would be in the sequester-replacement package…”

    So, what exactly is he promising?

  58. They are promising to not let the economic train wreck known as sequestration take place. You ask for specifics (which, of course they would be foolish to release at this time) – where are the “specifics from 0bama?

    0bama could do the same thing as Romney/ Ryan are promising, but the dems have been content to play their game of brinksmanship with our livelihoods for the last year and a half, and little patty murray has made it clear they’ll let the economy go over the cliff, no matter who’s in charge, if Republicans don’t cave to all of their demands.

    Meanwhile, 0bama submits laughably absurd budget after laughably absurd budget that not one of even his own party endorses, and Dirty Harry fiddles and consults his imaginary friends for help in dreaming up bald-face lies about Romney.

  59. Clam, the complete rejection of his budget, like the stimulus, Fast and Furious, Biden, the Arab Spring, etc are all topics the left will avoid discussing at all costs.

    They want social issues on the front page. They lead with fear and hyperbole.

  60. LeePHill says:

    Polling says that 94% of African Americans are voting for Obama. Is there any surprise as to why Republicans in charge of voting in many states are making it as difficult as possible?

    ““I guess I really actually feel we shouldn’t contort the voting process to accommodate the urban — read African-American — voter-turnout machine,” Doug Preisse, chairman of the county Republican Party and elections board member, told the Columbus Dispatch. “Let’s be fair and reasonable.”

    Preisse voted against weekend early voting hours, days that have traditionally resulted in high African-American turnout.

    “How far should the taxpayers be asked to go to accommodate that political operation? That’s where we’re having a difference of opinion,” he told Buzzfeed.”

    Now, mind you, if Ohio was Iraq, we’d pay our military to make sure that there was a 100% turnout to vote for the muppet leader our government put in place.

    “fast and furious” – son of “wide receiver”. CT always leaves that part out. Let’s discuss it, CT….except, you don’t get to leave out the parts that you don’t like.

    “Social issues” – the birthrights of Americans are not social issues. They are Constitutional rights.

  61. I leave it out because it is not relevant. If anything, it makes fast and furious look even worse. A program designed to actually follow the guns failed, so BHO and Holder double down, letting them walk with no intent to monitor them.

    Nice Bush deflection. The republicans were held responsible and BHO won in 2008. When will you hold BHO responsible for anything?

  62. “And while they applaud his move to mail absentee-ballot applications to all eligible Ohio voters, African-Americans are more comfortable echoing the civil-rights-movement mantra of “voting with their feet,” as Franklin County Elections Director William Anthony put it.”

    So they can vote. Period. No wonder why you skipped the link. Talk about some crap. Very low of you.

  63. averageJose says:

    In a recent testy exchange, Jake Tapper asked White House press spokesman Jay Carney if Obama’s reference to Romney family pet Seamus was “a part of this important policy debate?” LMAO…

  64. LeePHill says:

    Yeah….don’t mention Romney’s pet issue. It’s not part of the policy debate like the “Kenyan” issue is.

    “CT8 says:
    Aug. 23, 2012 at 4:42 pm I leave it out because it is not relevant. If anything, it makes fast and furious look even worse”

    Oh yeah…although it was then precurser to “f&f” it’s not relevant enough to throw out on the thread several times a day.

    Was the Obama administration aware of the gun running escapades? No. What did they do when they found out? Shut it down. Well know facts. You leave that out as well.

    I think the comment was “You are too partisan to care about reality”

    Do you recall who the author was of that?

  65. Where are you on that voting issue? Busted with a selective cut and paste, spinning the story far from the truth.

    If Holder did not know that alone is enough to fire him.

    The Bush op did no go as intended, and they shut it down. Nothing to do with F&F. Zero. No reasonable man would continue to push your weak blame game. It really only makes BHO and his admin look even more incompetent.

    Why take an op that did not work well, weaken it, and try it again? Kind of like 12 years of stimulus.

  66. If Holder did not know that, that …

  67. menopaws says:

    ClamatO—Would those be the automatic budget cuts, the ones they agreed to, signed off on during the last meltdown where compromises were made???? Just curious why keeping their word is not important. Where I grew up, men of honor sign off on agreements and keep their word….It is a MATTER OF HONOR TO KEEP YOUR WORD…..Guess that isn’t important when defense contractors are stuffing your pockets with money, is it??? Let’s spin it like Obama held a gun to their heads and MADE them agree,right??? Wow–the sky in your world must change color every damn day……..always an excuse to blame someone else and break your word…..WMD’s were the tip of that HUGE iceberg………..They made a deal–now the spin is it was a bad deal……So, are they stupid or liars???? Simple question……Let me know the answer when Fox tells you what it is……The biggest con is that these morons were the victims….I have a huge bridge for you to buy if you are dumb enough to suck down this con job……

  68. “.It is a MATTER OF HONOR TO KEEP YOUR WORD”

    http://money.cnn.com/2009/02/23/news/economy/fiscal_summit/index.htm

    “President Barack Obama pledged Monday to cut the nation’s $1.3 trillion deficit in half by the end of his first term.

    He identified exploding health-care costs as the chief culprit behind rising federal deficits during a bipartisan “fiscal responsibility summit” convened to discuss ways to restore fiscal stability without deepening the recession.”

    Did he keep his word? He expanded entitlements and ignored Simpson Bowles.

  69. ClamatO—Would those be the automatic budget cuts, the ones they agreed to, signed off on during the last meltdown where compromises were made???? Just curious why keeping their word is not important… blah, blah, blah

    Truly, meno, you don’t know what in unholy Hades you talking about. Further, your irrational bent and wildly tangental rants are becoming a bit disconcerting.

    Maybe a dose of research on what sequestration and the deal struck as a result of kicking the debt ceiling can down the road last August truly means will help you.

    democrats – specifically little patty murray – have threatened to let us go over the cliff next January.
    Ryan and Romney are promising to prevent that economic catastrophe by taking steps to thwart the democrats threatened suicidal move, if agreement on the the debt ceiling is not reached in the lame duck session before the Romney/Ryan inauguration. If on the other hand, 0bama wins, little patty will probably get her way, and the CBO says that means 9.2 unemployment rates and another recession.

    No one is proposing removing budget cuts that were agreed to in 2011. What we are talking about is avoiding draconian cuts called for in sequestration – cuts that will certainly kill what’s left of our economy.

    Got it?

  70. took14theteam says:

    Pretty sure she doesn’t get it, because she is concerned with “white guys”, the “war on women”, and Bush/Romney.

    And BHO gets a pass….

  71. yabetchya says:

    took, as meno would say,,,,,,,with lots of vigor…………..!!!!
    My puncuation says it all…..and……take that……. my words mean nothing.

  72. Clamat0 – they aren’t providing specifics because, when they do, independent analyses demonstrate that the numbers don’t hold up.

    Don’t understand why you are excusing empty words and promises without specifics on the campaign trail from either side – we are talking economic policy not foreign policy.

    All you are doing is making rationales and excuses for the not-Obama. IF Romney wins I predict that you – and several of the Romney apologists – will be distancing yourself from his trainwreck in a couple years…..or explaining how it wasn’t really his fault – just like you guys did with Bush.

  73. LeePHill says:

    “If Holder did not know that alone is enough to fire him.”

    Why would any Attorney General know about a secret FBI mission BEFORE taking office?

    CT, when you make comments like this, I don’t know whether to laugh AT you, or cry FOR you. Such a comment shows how far into Bircherland you really are, not to mention just lacking plain common sense.

  74. LeePHill says:

    “And while they applaud his move to mail absentee-ballot applications to all eligible Ohio voters, African-Americans are more comfortable echoing the civil-rights-movement mantra of “voting with their feet,” as Franklin County Elections Director William Anthony put it.”

    Check the voting record of the people in question in Ohio. 47% of them voted early and at the polls.

    You love to talk about spin and can’t see where a partisan county elections director is trying to save his buddy’s butt.

    The FACT of the story is that voting is being restricted in a selective manner. There is no reason for it.

    Maybe the reason why no one wants to vote by mail is they are seeing these shenanigans and they are not stupid enought to realize their ballot could get “lost”

    Here is a link to the Ohio Democrats’ official blog. They are trying to restore voting rights to 2008 levels, not spew partisan politics as you are.

  75. LeePHill says:

    CT – by the way, take a look at the 2004 election, where a county totalled 2000 votes for Bush, in a precinct where there are only 660 votes.

    Oh…yeah. Ohio.

    Here’s the link I forgot to post.

    http://ohiohousedems.wordpress.com/

  76. Clamat0 – they aren’t providing specifics because, when they do, independent analyses demonstrate that the numbers don’t hold up.

    beerBs, they aren’t providing specifics because what you call “independent analysis” will in fact be the MSM shilling for 0bama yet again.

    Team Romney/ Ryan know that they can’t get a fair shake from the overwhelmingly liberal airwave-broadcast and print media – especially in this election year, and especially considering their opponent. And, unfortunately, those outlets still define the narrative on issues as far as a large segment of the population that actually votes is concerned.

    Romney/ Ryan say they will not allow the economy to tank as a result of the latest CBO findings regarding sequestration. That’s one hell of a lot more than 0bama has said, and the polar opposite of what little patty murray and her fellow democrat economy kamikaze’s have promised.

    I take Romney/ Ryan at their word, and I’ll ask again; where are 0bama’s and the democrat’s specifics? We know what little patty and the kamikaze’s will do and why; what’s 0bama’s proposal?

    I think Ferguson answers that question succinctly in his Newsweek piece; 0bama’s demonstrated lack of leadership ability will cause him to naturally follow Reid, Pelosi, and (now) murray over the fiscal cliff and drag what’s left of the economy with him.

    As you wrote your 6:04, it occurs to me you may have had an inkling that what you wrote is more than a bit ironic, vi-a-vis the 0bama campaign ’08, Presidency, and current reelection campaign. I mean… short on specifics – long on promises could be their slogan, if not the defining phrase of such a non-performing presidency.

  77. philichi says:

    Leephill and others, Your lefty silly ideas do not work and have not worked. Europe is bankrupt, Mao, Castro, and all of the others have failed.

    You desperately try to prove your silly theories with half truths and partial statements. Let me make this easy on you. With your tremendous skills and wordsmithing talants, you cold even disprove gravity and atmospheric rules. However, when it is all said and done, you are simply putting off the inevitable. You will wake up some day, staring at the blank walls in a bankrupt country and realize that every thing that you have been taught by liberal professors and union leaders was wrong. You have been forced to live this lie for years. You might as well accept it now.

    Repeat after me. “Obama and his silly lefty ideas have messed up my county. I am sorry that I fell for this crap again and screwed my county and our children over. I will vote better next time.”

  78. Clamat) – AGAIN – I saw the problems with Obama during the ’08 campaign, voted against him in the primary and the general election. For me to point out the “same” problems with Mitt isn’t ironic.

  79. TBG – real history shows that Presidents spend nothing that Congress has not authorized, and that the GOP has spent the last four years blocking every reasonable attempt by the President deduce the debt.

    Pchi – Europe is bankrupt because they tried using ring-wing freakonomics to balance their budgets on the backs of the non-rich, while letting the rich get richer.

  80. If we are going to follow the example of European countries (funny how Europe is awful….except for when it is good) – I suggest we look to Iceland – that didn’t bail out the banks, went through a couple of rough years and came out much, much better.

    Until, and unless, America frees itself from its bondage to international banks we will never be truly prosperous.

  81. LeePHill says:

    philichi does a baseless assertion rant to say:

    “You desperately try to prove your silly theories with half truths and partial statements”

    He submits no data…not even “half truths” or “partial” statements.

    Just baseless assertions.

    Probably can’t hear himself, for all the noise in his brain.

  82. SwordofPerseus says:

    The lessons are all there for history to teach us if we are willing to listen. I could not agree with beerBoy more, end the FED, regulate Wall St., Reverse the SCOTUS’s unwise Citizens United decision. Limit campaign finance and limit time allowed for campaigning.

  83. Pat yourself on the back, while ignoring some huge facts. The deep recession started when Nancy and Harry took over. Clinton’s fortunate timing with the Internet bubble ( that imploded, leaving W to clean up).

    One could argue that dems benefited from republican policies taking effect. They can also argue timing of recessions, then debate forever on who or what caused each one.

    And the Bush years added tons of debt, expanded govt, and little job growth. No one is claiming that is a model for the future.

    Can you honestly say BHO is not just bragging about a recovery that has happened after every recession since WWII? Now, his is the worst recovery by many metrics.

    Last, every pol claims they can fix or grow the economy. They can set conditions to foster growth, but command is limited. Reality. Think about BHOs famous promises with the stimulus. Imagine where we would be if he simply opened the floodgates of domestic energy product….

  84. Pat yourself on the back, while ignoring some huge facts.

    followed by

    The deep recession started when Nancy and Harry took over. Clinton’s fortunate timing with the Internet bubble ( that imploded, leaving W to clean up)

  85. I take Romney/ Ryan at their word

    Why? I never take ANY politician at their word. You never seemed naive to me before.

  86. took14theteam says:

    I gots me some cherry pie tonite………

  87. Bb- was the line you quoted factually correct? I’ll answer for you. Yes.

  88. Why? I never take ANY politician at their word. You never seemed naive to me before.

    So you doubt that Romney will insure sequestration and its ruinous effect on the economy won’t take place?

    You never seemed so cynical.

  89. My cynicism has grown significantly ever since Clinton’s administration.

  90. To clarify – ever since Clinton’s first inauguration.

  91. “The deep recession started when Nancy and Harry took over.”

    Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

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