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MARRIAGE: Intolerance we should not ignore

Letter by Don Simon, Bremerton on May 7, 2012 at 1:23 pm with 86 Comments »
May 7, 2012 1:23 pm

With the signing of Senate Bill 6239 on Feb. 13, Washington said no to exclusion and yes to inclusion. Our great state now sees people as people, eliminating one more form of discrimination from our society. Gay and lesbian couples are no longer secondhand citizens when it comes to their right to marriage.

Yet, some still feel they are better. Some still feel it is their right to discriminate, not on facts but on feelings. Some still insist on the segregation of them from us.

We hear about the sanctity of marriage and how the denying participation of gay and lesbian couples will somehow protect heterosexual husband and wives from a force so powerful that, if not extinguished, marriage as we know it will cease to exist.

Fear born of ignorance breeds bigotry, and with it we get homophobic individuals who are currently hiding behind church walls to spread their agenda of hate among the faithful. These pious people like to go on and on about their beliefs as if what they believe somehow gives them the right to restrict the life, liberty and pursuit of happiness of others.

This gathering of signatures to overturn this great state of Washington’s progress is an ugly, nasty, divisive and cruel example of an intolerance we should not ignore. Not now, not ever.

Leave a comment Comments → 86
  1. menopaws says:

    I agree……….Private relationships between loving people are something we should respect and protect. This doesn’t threaten anyone and if people are so afraid of this, they should renew the vows of their own marriages and strengthen their own relationships. Being different is not something to fear……..I wish people would learn to tend to their own houses before interfering in anyone else’s. Our society has become mean-spirited and fearful. There is nothing “Christian” about that. Or as my Grandmother would say,”Tend to your knitting and mind your own business”.

  2. GHTaxPayer says:

    Being homosexual is either genetically defective or unnatural behavior (or both). Either way our communities should not sanctify with marriage and we should ban them from adopting children. Hetero sex brings babies. Home sex spreads AIDS.

    And we are not “fearful” of homos. We’re disgusted by it.

    We maintain communities and civilization by having rules and principles. If we start eroding these, the whole community dissolves into anarchy – which is what is happening after years of liberal policies in our state and at the federal level. Morals matter !

  3. igotdabombfool says:

    Not that I’m for or against it….but, they are not hiding behind church walls, they are spreading what they believe in. Just like gays and lesbians. They are going on and on….just like gays and lesbians. Both sides are portraying their beliefs and they have the right to do so. But arguing that they are trying to spread their hateful belief onto everybody could also be said about gays and lesbians.

  4. igotdabombfool says:

    GHTaxPayer – FYI – Hetero sex spreads AIDS too. Thought you should be brought into the loop. Anything that is spread by gay or lesbian sex, is equally spread by straight sex.

  5. GHTaxPayer, We tolerate and do not legislate against quite a few things that disgust some people. Should we legisltate against drinking alcohol, divorce, driving SUV’s. There are people who are disgusted by those things, and much more.

    What we legislate against are things that will harm each other or harm the participants or harm society in a major way. Let me know how gay marriage harms others or harms society or harms the people involved, and I will be on your side.

    But, you can’t, because it doesn’t.

    If genetic changes make a person ineligible for marriage, then I guess you would outlaw marriage for people with inherited forms of cancer or people who have inherited conditions that make them a minority. That would put your beliefs in line with a government we soundly defeated for doing such things.

    Freedom and equality used is a thing people in the USA support. Too bad there are people like you who are trying to allow freedom and equality only for the people who think exactly like you do. Exactly like a jihad against gay people.

  6. bucks2 says:

    So why are the gay activists not including polygamy, incest and other combinations of people who love each other in their quest for equality? You would think that such intelligent people would be fighting for equality for everyone not just their little group. Are they afraid that if I marry two women our polygamist relationship will somehow harm them? How phobic are they to think that if I marry my mother it will cause harm. Come on activists, let’s be inclusive rather than exclusive. Write the laws to include everyone.

  7. bucks2, the US Supreme Court has already found that polygamy causes harm and states can outlaw it; they also found that incest causes harm and states can outlaw it. They have not yet ruled on gay marriage.

    Try again with a rational comment.

  8. “Home sex spreads AIDS”

    So do you have sex exclusively outside of your home?

  9. The anti-gay marriage crowd (especially the religious groups) want to make their religious beliefs the law of the land.

    The pro-gay marriage crowds what a secular law that has no impact on religions.

    Which one is Constitutional and which one is not?

  10. anotherID2remember says:

    No we can get to work on recognizing plural relationships. Being in love with more than one person should not be illegal! Consenting adults should not be disciminated against. If I get 2 women and one other man to agree to marry me then why should this be illegal?

    FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT!

  11. GHTaxPayer says:

    The pro-queer groups want unnatural behavior to be the law of the land. The vast majority say no thanks, we only want marriage and children for natural behavior.

    If you want to engage in strange and unnatural behavior please don’t try and convince the rest of us that it’s normal – because it isn’t. Why do you think the term ‘queer’ was coined for homos in the first place?

  12. GHTaxPayer says:

    Amazing that the liberals are pushing for homo marriage, are okay with Shariya law that radically opresses women but criticize Fundamentalist Mormons for plural marriage.

  13. concernedtacoma7 says:

    Given the pressing issues of our time, an economy in the tank, a decade long war, a nightmarish tax code, no budgets, why is this a pressing issue?

    The left is driving the social conversation, ignoring real issues that effect us all. An extreme minority is gay/lesbian. With or without additional regulations, laws, policies, etc they are free to ‘love’ and do whatever they want with whomever they want.

    When all of the issues that effect the masses are addressed, we can worry about titles and other paper issues that do not effect the way people live.

  14. menopaws says:

    Pro-queer groups????? Okay how about the Gig Harbor moron groups??? Mean-spirited people who resort to name calling because they feel it’s their right to judge others. This is supposed to be a place to discuss issues—those with ugly mouths and no ideas need to sign off….

  15. buddyandelliott says:

    Someone sounds like a self-loathing closet case.

  16. My only opposition to plural marriages is that as the goat gets older, the ewes get younger.

    Unnatural behavior that has been with us since before the dawn of recorded history and is found many species other than man.

    GHtp,
    Liberals are not okay with “Shariya” law. We oppose all regions laws and any attempt by any religion to make their beliefs the law of the land.

    The main opponents of plural marriges are the mainstream Mormons, and the evangelicals who are using it against Romney.

    Ct7;
    Economy in the tank – because of the same failed policies Romney and the Republicons want to bring back.

    Decades long war – started by W and his have/have more base so the base can have more and being wound down by Obama.

    Nightmarish tax code – which the rpots refuse to change if it means the rich or corporations have to pay more taxes.

    No budgets – because the part time alcoholic lead house can’t pass a budget that won’t destroy the country.

    Left driving the social conservation – Rick Santorum is a lefty!!??

  17. RLangdon says:

    Why doesn’t someone propose a law that REQUIRES people to ONLY marry others of the SAME SEX? That would satisfy GHTaxdodger and bucky. Then they’d really have something legitimate to fight against with their bigotry. Right now they have to waste there energies on a law that obviously neither of them completely understands.

  18. concernedtacoma7, the law has already been passed. If you want no more energy or money or time spent on this issue, then I suggest talking to the anti-gay marriage crowd and tell them we don’t need an expensive election, the people’s representatives have spoken, so stop collecting signatures and wasting people’s time and money.

    The legislature can vote again if you elect other people to represent you, so spend time on the next general election if you don’t like how they are representing you.

  19. kluwer says:

    “So why are the gay activists not including polygamy, incest and other combinations of people who love each other in their quest for equality?”

    Why would they?

  20. concernedtacoma7 says:

    Tuddo, I did not think it was an issue worth addressing before (especially since a budget still had to get passed) and do not find its appeal a worthy issue now.

    Focus on the problems that are universal, like roads, education, debt, the economy, and put the social issues to bed. It is humbling since I feel gay marriage is BS, but the state and nation has bigger problems. By focusing on distractions, the right is just playing the left’s game (and losing the PR battle).

  21. taxedenoughintacoma says:

    Here is why we must overturn the gay marriage agenda. It starts in NC with Tuesday’s vote to ban it. A state that voted for obama.

    1. Gays & lesbians make poor parents.
    2. Children need to be raised by their biological parents
    3. A child with same-sex parents will be subjected to hate
    4. Marriage is only feasible if the couple is monogamous; same-sex couples cannot control their desires.
    5. Same-sex spouses cannot bring children into the world by themselves

    the most important reason
    6. The “slippery slope” concern:
    If same-sex marriages are legalized, then decriminalization of prostitution, polygyny, polyandry, and incest will necessarily follow. Men will marry two or more women; women will marry multiple men; multiple women and multiple men will form group marriages; men will want to marry their dogs, whom they dearly love; etc. Once the floodgates are opened, there will be no stopping the changes.

    GHtaxpayer is right. When you think about the act itself homosexual is either genetically defective or unnatural behavior (yes both).

  22. LornaDoone says:

    “GHTaxPayer says:
    May 7, 2012 at 1:59 pm Being homosexual is either genetically defective or unnatural behavior (or both).”

    What is natural about an obsession with other’s sexual orientation?

  23. bobcat1a says:

    5. Same-sex spouses cannot bring children into the world by themselves

    I suppose you never heard of hetero couples using in vitro fertilization or surrogate mothers or sperm donors.

  24. LornaDoone says:

    1. Gays & lesbians make poor parents. Baseless assertion
    2. Children need to be raised by their biological parents. many successful people were raised by other than biological parents
    3. A child with same-sex parents will be subjected to hate Yes, thanks for demonstrating it
    4. Marriage is only feasible if the couple is monogamous; same-sex couples cannot control their desires. Ask Newt Gingrich
    5. Same-sex spouses cannot bring children into the world by themselves
    the most important reasonnor can many hetero couples
    6. The “slippery slope” concern:
    If same-sex marriages are legalized, then decriminalization of prostitution, polygyny, polyandry, and incest will necessarily follow. Men will marry two or more women; women will marry multiple men; multiple women and multiple men will form group marriages; men will want to marry their dogs, whom they dearly love; etc. Once the floodgates are opened, there will be no stopping the changes.
    GHtaxpayer is right. When you think about the act itself homosexual is either genetically defective or unnatural behavior (yes both). Just plain silly, if not a result of a genetic defect that makes him think this crap is true. Someone keep an eye on my dog, who is probably not safe around this person

    “the act itself” – participated in by many hetero couples

  25. RLangdon says:

    GHTaxdodger and bucky seem to have a lot in common with IQof88. (Perhaps similar IQs.)

  26. RLangdon says:

    GHTaxPayer, MAYBE YOU ARE RIGHT!!! Maybe marriage should ONLY be between a man and a woman.

    Do you have a daughter?

    How would you feel if your daughter married a GAY MAN?

    That’s okay, right?

  27. Pacman33 says:

    “This gathering of signatures to overturn this great state of Washington’s progress is an ugly, nasty, divisive and cruel example of an intolerance we should not ignore.”

    It is called the Referendum Process. It was enacted in Washington back in 1912. It would have passed in 1907 but it was stalled by drunk Neo-Progressives because they feared voters would enact a Prohibition initiative. Commies need booze to keep a foggy head and it helps them cope with the guilt when going to sleep at night.

  28. concernedtacoma7 says:

    Pman- tone down the assault on booze. Judging/engineering my lifestyle is something progressives do.

  29. Pacman33 says:

    I say we should all get drunk and find something gays hold dear, like sleazy gay bars or antique shops and hijack it. Be all radical and claim a hep C infested dives with all gay customers is heterophobic, ignorant, discriminating, intolerant, bigoted and close enough to racist, it might as well be. When we threaten to tattle to our nanny government, who’ll cooperate or we call them names also, the gays will be like ‘No look, see we have a couple of hags here’. Then we will be like ‘Sorry fancy lad and butch cassidy, separate but equal isn’t equal. We’re going to Olympia to strong arm reps into making Thursday and Friday nights Football-GunShow-KimBasinger-Night at all gay bars.’ Then they will be like ‘That’s weak’, except for a couple lesbians who like Kim.

    SB8124 Bar-Stool-Equality

  30. CT7 – gay marriage does not require a budget. I fact it will create funds for the state and boost the local economies.

    The Dems are willing to talk about the items. The rpots are not unless the rich get more tax breaks.

    Taxed;
    1 .wrong.
    2. wrong.
    3. wrong.
    4. wrong.
    5. wrong.
    6. most wrong.

    Pac – the process is not being questioned.

    Based on the rest of you ramble – Have you considered taking the cure?

    CT7 – the right is even more into social engineering.

  31. XBJ98N says:

    You can legislate all you want to. Pass all the laws you can.

    Reality is you will never be able to guarantee “inclusion” or tolerance by passing a law. The vast majority of people see homosexuality as wrong, or as it’s already been posted, “disgusting”. There is a reason only a small handful of States (and all of them overwhelmingly liberal) have passed laws in support of this lifestyle.

    The only way it seems that this lifestyle will ever be remotely accepted is by brainwashing over time, which the liberal education and social re-engineering system is employing on young minds. In time, after being fed a steady diet of “gay is good” new generations will grow up thinking it is acceptable.

  32. XBJ98N says:

    And yes, most people DO think its wrong, despite what we are being fed.

    Its been said many times, and I think its a true observation, ask any parent if they hope their kid turns out gay. The general response is the deflected (liberals are good at deflecting!) response of, “I just want my child happy.” But you will never find any parent saying “Gee I sure hope I have a gay child!”

    It will never happen. That alone shows how most people REALLY feel. They just never say it out of political correctness.

  33. Most recent Gallup Poll says 48 – 55% of Americans view homosexuality as morally wrong.

    Hardly ‘over whealming’, and the numbers are falling.

  34. XBJ98N says:

    Exactly as I said “xring”…

    Over time the brainwashing takes effect. And no doubt that “poll” involves a lot of people under thirty. And my guess is the poll was taken in one of those predominantly liberal enclaves.

    Besides, polls are just polls. Not very accurate.

  35. XBJ98N says:

    When some of us were younger it was common to go into a public school classroom and see kids standing and reciting the Pledge of Allegiance.

    Today, I wouldnt be one bit surprised the kids all gather round, holding hands in a big group love circle wearing their rainbow school colors and sing…

    ….”Momma said there’d be gays like this, there’d be gays like this my Momma said!!!”

  36. There is one poll that counts – it will be in November – if your thugs can
    manufature enough signatures.

  37. Frankenchrist says:

    Why are Republicans obsessed with what is happening in other people’s bedrooms? I guess because nothing is happening in theirs.

  38. LornaDoone says:

    xring – if we look at the California case, these “popular votes” will not stand the test of the courts

  39. LornaDoone says:

    “XBJ98N says:
    May 8, 2012 at 6:54 am And yes, most people DO think its wrong, despite what we are being fed.

    Most people thought (and many still do think) that interracial marriage is/was wrong

    But you will never find any parent saying “Gee I sure hope I have a gay child!”

    Most people don’t wish for a Downs Syndrome child, but they accept that child as their own. Of course, during more ignorant times, people thought that disabilities were a reason to institutionalize.

  40. LornaDoone says:

    “Reality is you will never be able to guarantee “inclusion” or tolerance by passing a law.”

    Yes, we know. All we have to do is watch the mental gymnastics that conservatives go through attempting to prove that President Obama is something other than an American citizen.

    Bigotry can’t be legislated.

  41. I believe the real objection here is that the gay community seeks to have folks validate and bless their unions. This is impossible for those who view it as morally wrong. Gays and gay supporters need to show some respect for those who hold this view whether you think it righteous or stupid.

    That said, the ugliness on this thread is really disgusting. Many, probably most people objecting to gay marriage do not feel this kind of hatred or spew this kind of toxic waste. You only make matters worse by saying some of the things you’ve said here.

  42. LornaDoone says:

    “sozo says:
    May 8, 2012 at 8:42 am I believe the real objection here is that the gay community seeks to have folks validate and bless their unions.”

    Which goes to show that you can believe something, but that doesn’t make it true. The message from the “gay community” (as though they were segregated) is that they want legality and if you don’t like it, that’s tough.

    Once many “good Christians” thought interracial marriages to be “morally wrong”. Luckily we are not a church run state (country).

  43. Bandito says:

    These comments are proof that you are correct, “This gathering of signatures to overturn this great state of Washington’s progress is an ugly, nasty, divisive and cruel example of an intolerance we should not ignore. Not now, not ever.”

  44. Sozo – the gay community wants the state (and only the state) to validate and bless their unions – just as the state blessed and validated your union.

  45. sozo believes that other people think they way she does – a sort of narrow, twisted version of Christianity where secular legal rights are somehow a “blessing” from God and not a way people have decided to govern themselves in a way that allows the most freedom and equality.

    My true Christian belief, as opposed to the corruption of Christianity, is that gays are not morally bankrupt, that gay marrriage is not morally wrong and Jesus would have blessed gay marriages.

    Since our two Christian beliefs are incompatible, we should solve it the same way the founders did, by relying on reason and the Constitution and declaring that all people are created equal and all should benefit from the laws of this nation equally.

    That takes religion completely out of it, and we don’t have to declare war on the freedoms and equality of a minority to prop up a bankrupt version of Christianity that has turned its back on the true message of that religion, turned toward hatred instead of love and ignores its primary mission to “do unto others as you would have them do unto you.”.

  46. An example of the way some Christians have perverted the Gospel:

    A Catholic bishop is refusing to allow a Catholic high schooler to receive a $40,000 scholarship at graduation because the presenter is the Matthew Shepherd Foundation, which supports anti-bigotry efforts and the recipient is an openly gay student.

    The school board president echoes my sentiments.

    “O’Neill, the school board president, said he was disappointed with the bishop’s decision, according to local media reports. ‘We preach tolerance and acceptance but then we turn around and we don’t practice what we preach.'”

  47. commoncents says:

    So let me get this straight…we want to make it so two people can’t be married because they engage in exactly the same behavior that two other people who are already married also already engage in? And in fact, more straight households engage in these behaviors than there are gay households already. And this is not trying to legislate what goes on in our bedrooms how?

    As for the raising of the children…until we permanently outlaw divorce and require that both parents participate fully in the act of raising the children this is a complete non-issue.

    As for the slippery slope – we already have laws that outlaw such behavior that have been found to be constitutional. Being gay and engaging in said behavior is not illegal.

    What’s left???

  48. “Here is why we must overturn the gay marriage agenda…..”

    Dumbest thing I have ever read.

  49. “I believe the real objection here is that the gay community seeks to have folks validate and bless their unions.”

    No they don’t, they simply want, rightfully so, to be treated like any other American citizen.
    No one cares or needs to validate anything, but we all do need to treat each other equally, why is that so hard for you so called christians to do?

  50. BlaineCGarver says:

    The politicians have spoken….Now, the people will speak.

  51. BlaineCGarver says:

    If you can’t see the results of “Freedom From Religion” of the last sixty years, then you are not paying attention. The “Anything Goes” hippies of the sixties have raised their children, and they are continuing to throw out the standards that made the country great for so many years.

  52. LornaDoone says:

    Blaine – yeah, we needed more of the racist values of the parents of the 40s and 50s to linger on and make a “great country”. The “standards of making some people ride on the back of the bus is truly American. Really great stuff.

  53. concernedtacoma7 says:

    Only one telling people to ride on the back of the bus is BHO.

    We do need the values of the past. 2 parent households, duty, work ethic, etc.

    The destruction of the family is the highlight of progressivism.

  54. RLangdon says:

    John Stewart of the The Daily Show reports nationwide

    47% FAVOR Gay Rights and Gay Marriage
    43% Oppose
    10% Swing both ways

  55. LornaDoone says:

    “concernedtacoma7 says:
    May 8, 2012 at 4:02 pm Only one telling people to ride on the back of the bus is BHO.”

    Racism is demonstrated when someone thinks the completely false statement they’ve made is funny.

    The decades of black people being forced to sit in the back of the bus is a disgusting legacy of The United States. To say that a black male in the United States is telling people to ride on the back of the bus is close to the most ignorant thing that has ever been posted on this forum.

    “We do need the values of the past. 2 parent households”

    How many single parent households were created by Newt Gingrich?

  56. anotherID2remember says:

    Favorite arguments made so far…

    Being gay is like have a down’s syndrome child.

    The government is concerned about what goes on in my bedroom after I tell them about it over and over and ask them to recognize it.

    Darn Christians keep trying to save me.

    My grandparents were racist in the 40s.

    Black people are being told to sit in the back of the bus?

    I want my union blessed like yours but don’t bless anyone else’s because they might be polygamists.

    (I added that last one)

    I read the comments for the sheer entertainment.

  57. concernedtacoma7, so when are you starting the petition to outlaw divorce? That is the main reason for the “destruction of the family”, not two people trying to pledge their faithfulness through marriage.

    If big government should tell everyone hiow to live their lives, maybe outlawing divorce would have a bigger impact since it certainly is a much bigger number involved in such destructive behavior.

    Maybe you might want to start a petition drive to outlaw one-parent families since you blast them so much. Of course that would hit straight people harder than it would gays.

    About 1% of the total number of currently-married or registered same-sex couples get divorced each year, in comparison to about 2% of the total number of married straight couples. Maybe you are targeting the wrong group there, too.

  58. averageJoseph says:

    WCR… how very intolerant of you.

  59. “most people DO think its wrong … polls are just polls. Not very accurate.”

    Oh, the irony! LOL

  60. concernedtacoma7 says:

    Clown, BHO did tell Republicans they had to ride in the back of the bus. Look it up.

  61. gowenray says:

    I don’t know who stated it, I don’t know when it started, but when the governments of our states began issuing Marriage Certificates the line in the sand was drawn.
    Up to then, marriage was little more than a religious ritual to legalize what? Sharing a bed? Giving a birth-right name to an off-spring? Making two instead of one responsible for incurred debt?
    I guess I’m just pointing out that the arguments about who has a right to marry seem a little bazzar when you consider the totality of just what the ritual is trying to accomplish.

  62. XBJ98N says:

    “intolerant”. Always funny listening to liberals. They preach tolerance, but by and large are extremely intolerant of anyone or anything who disagrees with them! Just gives an clear meaning of the description of hypocrisy.

  63. wildcelticrose says:

    I may be intolerant of stupidity, but I’m not trying to take away anyone’s right to be stupid ;)

  64. concerned, it was FoxNews that misquoted Obama and said he used a “back of the bus’ analogy. What he actually said was more of a family car analogy:

    “We can’t have special interests sitting shotgun. We gotta have middle class families up in front. We don’t mind the Republicans joining us. They can come for the ride, but they gotta sit in back.”

    I don’t think there is a “shotgun” seat on a bus. Sitting in the backseat is where the little Republican kids in Congress should have to ride strapped into their car seat with a pacifier in their mouth.

  65. I will abide by the law. I would never deny a gay couple their civil rights. All I’m saying is that whenever this goes to a vote of the people, as it did in California, it is an act of integrity to vote in accordance with what you believe. In CA the people said NO to gay marriage, so the courts stepped in and made the voice of the people meaningless.

    And btw, there IS a push to have gay marriage legitimized in the heart and mind as well as in the law. If you can’t see this, you are willfully blind and deaf.

    Why is the president remaining mum on this subject at the moment? Here’s what I think. Many representing his “base” were the ones who voted against gay marriage in CA and he knows it. He must let others do his talking for him at the moment or he will lose a large measure of voters in November.

    Oh wait, didn’t he say he was opposed to gay marriage?

    Where does our president stand on this issue? Anyone know?

  66. LornaDoone says:

    “Where does our president stand on this issue? Anyone know?”

    It’s really quite easy to find answer to this question.

    So, am I to assume that if Obama “agrees” to something, that the conservatives will agree also? Obama “agrees” to health care reform, so the conservatives must agree in kind.

  67. LornaDoone says:

    BHO did tell Republicans they had to ride in the back of the bus. Look it up.

    Well, as usual, two things:

    1. Obama is taken out of context

    2. Ct7 can’t look up his own sources

    He said Republicans had driven the economy into a ditch and then stood by and criticized while Democrats pulled it out. Now that progress has been made, he said, “we can’t have special interests sitting shotgun. We gotta have middle class families up in front. We don’t mind the Republicans joining us. They can come for the ride, but they gotta sit in back.

    I don’t see one word about “bus” there, and in fact, you don’t sit or ride “shotgun” in a bus. All of the context would be referring to a passenger car, if anyone really needs that explanantion.

    More faux outrage by the conservative sound machine.

  68. LornaDoone says:

    Why are the ultra-conservatives so worried about Obama’s stand on gay marriage? When you google the subject there are dozens of recent stories and op-eds.

    Do ultra-conservatives follow Obama on any subject, waiting for his answer?

    The answer to this is if Obama says he is for gay marriage, they gin up the campaign money for a message to the anti forces. He he says he opposes gay marriage, they spend money to take a negative message to the Democratic base.

    Either way, the constant is “if Obama says so, we oppose it”.

    Nothing new here.

  69. LornaDoone says:

    “And btw, there IS a push to have gay marriage legitimized in the heart and mind as well as in the law. If you can’t see this, you are willfully blind and deaf.”

    And if YOU can’t point to the alleged “push”, you are just making up more garbage that you can’t support with data.

    Nothing new here, either.

  70. LornaDoone says:

    “WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama declared unequivocal support for gay marriage on Wednesday, becoming the first president to endorse the politically explosive idea and injecting a polarizing issue into the 2012 race for the White House.”

    Let the games begin. How long will it take before there is an attack on Obama?

  71. wildcelticrose says:

    Yes, but he took the cowards way out and totally bowed down to North Carolina by saying, “It should be up to the states”.

    Uh, was slavery “up to the states”? (after the civil war)

    Was women’s rights to vote “up to the states”.

    No, he’s just trying to appease both sides without actually taking a stand.

    It is after all and election year.

  72. I heard the president’s “coming out” statement this morning and LOL at his use of the word “evolve” to describe his change of heart. That’s one quick process of evolution!

    Evolve is not the right word. Acquiesce is the right word. And appease, yes these are what his grand statement was about today. If it’s what he really believes, then more power to him for speaking with integrity. But this just wreaks of politics as usual. It will be interesting to see what many of his African American Christian supporters will do with this information…especially since it was presumed to be that cohort that got Prop 8 in…before the CA justices threw it out.

    I am so glad we have an elite class to correct us when we vote wrong.

  73. RLangdon says:

    This is one of those very rare times when one wishes that American government was a Monarchy rather than a Democratic Republic.

    Then King Barack could simply issue a Royal Edict stating that Same Sex Marriage is legal in all the states of the realm, and be done with it! It would be the law of the land, and we would not have to listen to these dimwitted bigots argue against “state sanctioned same sex marriage,” which has NOTHING whatsoever to do with Church or religious sanctioned marriage.

    But then, I would want King Barack to go back to being our democratically elected President Obama once again, because we really do not want a monarchy in this country (unless you are a Republican!).

  74. I think that, like so many US citizens, Obama finally realized what this issue is all about.

    Here are the realities he had to work with:

    -Marriage is a basic human right (SCOTUS)
    -Gays are humans
    -All humans are guaranteed equal protection under the laws of the US

    To deny equal protection under the law, then one must deny one of the above postulates.

    All of the arguments against gay marriage are presented in a way to make gays seem “different” from real humans who can get married. Some people come right out with their homophobia and declare gays to be defective, degenerate and not worthy of being called human. Others are more subtle but still say that gays do not deserve equality under the law or must choose a partner for marriage that they see designed only for the real humans amongst us.

    I think his decision was inevitable, just like our nation will inevitably realize that gays are human and should be treated equally under the laws, just like we decided for other minorities whom we considered as less than human for too long.

  75. His “evolution” is more interesting. Seems he was for gay marriage in 1996, then against it in 2008. Guess there was a hiccup in the evolutionary process along the way. Hiccup = election campaign

    If you think this latest statement reveals something about where our president actually stands on this or any other issue, don’t hold your breath. As I said, “politics as usual.”

  76. So, this Letter To The Editor includes in it’s title, “Intolerance we should not ignore”.

    That being the case, I always find it interesting that those who support gay marriage, or push the notion that homosexuality is normal and acceptable, are always on cue, right in there preaching about intolerance.

    Yet look how intolerant they get the second anyone has the nerve to disagree!

    As with most liberals and the social re-design agendas they push, they reek of hypocrisy.

  77. …Funny too, that they always, without doubt, drag out the tired, pathetic arguments about slavery, racism, women voting, or anything they can to distract from the issue at hand, simply because they cant offer a convincing argument that homosexuality is normal. As we well know, distraction is another well used ploy of the left.

  78. XBJ98N, the difference in your description of “intolerance” is that people who support gay marriage do not force others to adhere to their beliefs though laws that deny equality.

    Just think if gays were actually being intolerant and said that gay amrriage is the only legal type of marriage. Then that would actually meet the definition of intolerance.

    Not allowing gays to marry and forcing them to marry someone who they do not choose, if they do get married, is intolerance.

    Equality under the law is a Constitutional ideal, not a “tired” argument. The problem is that you cannot come up with any argument to support a claim that gays are not humans, just as equal to civil rights as you are. To say otherwise is proving your bigotry.

    As a test, come up with one solid scientifically proved fact that shows gays are not normal human beings. Can’t do it, because there is no such evidence, only Nazi-style propaganda.

  79. 1. “As a test, come up with one solid scientifically proved fact that shows gays are not normal human beings. Can’t do it, because there is no such evidence, only Nazi-style propaganda.”

    Okay tuddo, for your “test”..You go ahead and round up 100 regular, everyday people. Oh make sure its a nationwide thing, so the results are not lopsided with Western Washington Politically Correct, Warm and Fuzzy Feel Good. Get a good cross section…Then tell me how many HONESTLY think homosexuality is normal. Sorry tuddo, but the average majority of people will never think men doing men, and women doing women is normal. Its never going to happen. So much for your “test”

    2. “Not allowing gays to marry and forcing them to marry someone who they do not choose, if they do get married, is intolerance.”

    So tuddo, this is a new one on me. Did I see you write that gays are being FORCED to marry someone they did not choose?

    You know, if you people are ever going to get any real support, youre going to have to keep a close eye on the things you say! :D

    Hate to break this to you, but the majority of people in this country still see homosexual acts as completely unnatural.

  80. What I find funny is the way people have been fussing and fawning over the fact that Obama suddenly (during an election year where he needs all the support he can get!)has his “evolution” to where now he thinks gay marriage is all fine and dandy.

    And then the liberal masses bow down with praise, peeing all over themselves because Obama said so! Like, who is HE? Someone important?

    You’d think the Pope himself just made a world changing revelation or something.

  81. “the majority of people in this country still see homosexual acts as completely unnatural.”

    And yet, a majority approve of gay marriage: http://www.gallup.com/poll/147662/First-Time-Majority-Americans-Favor-Legal-Gay-Marriage.aspx

  82. Well “ehill” first of all polls are what they are, and not all that accurate.

    At any rate, according to your poll, its only a few small points. I wouldnt call that a groundswell of support for gay marriage. And then we have to ask, what demographic was the poll conducted with? Was it a fair cross section of America, or was the question asked primarily to the young ( brainwashing will get you what you want over time), or conducted in more liberal enclaves of the country?

    All that being said, we still have to see that due to political correctness, there are many people who just go along so as not to offend, but privately they still see it as degenerate behavior.

    And did the poll offer a simple “yes” or “no”..or was there an “i don’t care” option? And if there was that option, did the poll takers assign all the ‘i dont cares’ to the ‘yes I support it’ column?

    You can take all the polls you want and twist the result till the cows come home, but you get the average American in a truthful moment, and I’ll bet the huge majority still thinks homosexuality is at best unnatural, deviant at worst.

    Ill base this on my own experiences with people I know, and I know a lot of people of varying opinions. And when it comes to this issue, I only know one who truly believes homosexuality is normal.

  83. “according to your poll, its only a few small points. I wouldnt call that a groundswell of support for gay marriage.” — ROFL, guess you didn’t read the text. Here: “This year’s nine-percentage-point increase in support for same-sex marriage is the largest year-to-year shift yet measured over this time period.“.

    “And then we have to ask, what demographic was the poll conducted with” — Man, you need to learn to read the links. The methodology is clearly identified a few paragraphs down from the chart.

    “did the poll offer a simple “yes” or “no” — Yet more proof that you didn’t bother to read the link. If you had bothered to actually read it, you would have found a link to the actual question asked.

    I suggest you start actually reading the links provided. It’ll save you a lot of embarrassment.

    But, to save you all that effort, here’s the actual question: Do you think marriages between same-sex couples should or should not be recognized by the law as valid, with the same rights as traditional marriages?. The available answers were “Yes”, “No”, and “No opinion”, and the “No opinion answers were tabulated separately.

  84. normajean says:

    Everyone in this country should have all the same rights regardless of state. Whether or not everyone approves should be irrelevant. Don’t approve of gay marriage, well fine. You will never be forced to attend a gay wedding or union. I have read all of the above and it boils down to fear & prejudice of what one was calling ”unnatural”. So are body piercings, facial tattoos etc. Some people actually believe that homosexuality is a choice which of course is in itself ignorant to think so. But there are all kinds of people who put their own spin on it & voila stupidity reigns. I am a married woman who believes in equality for all

  85. littleroundtop says:

    Appears to me the fear and prejudice becomes very selective in where it comes from . Don Simon has a little of that hatred and intolerance in most of his letters he writes . Perhaps one can say he is just reflecting the ahte he has seen in his own life , but regardless that can be an excuse either side of this issue can claim .

    Science and common sense tells us the Biological Mom and dad make the best parents . The difference in genders is not just physical , but that is important also . Even the brain functions of males and females are different . Social scientists havedata show the differences in bonding and other aspects that both genders offer. Of course homosexuals can be good parents , as far as single parents , and I guess polygamous familes work inside their religious or cultural boundries at times . What is best for kids , if that is part of the debate , is a mom and dad . Homosexual marriages determine that the very BEGINNING there will no possibility for children to have thediversity and better effective parenting for all their concerns and nurturing by a male and female .

    Hence a lesbian married to a homosexual statistically would be better then a divorced male and straight female. The real issue is not homosexuality , its practability . Because the Don Simons scream bigot , it caught on I guess. Nothing to get self righteous about from either side in my view .

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