Letters to the Editor

Your views in 200 words or less

DEMOCRATS: Admit that you were lied to

Letter by Matthew F. Philichi, Gig Harbor on Dec. 29, 2010 at 2:54 pm with 202 Comments »
December 29, 2010 2:59 pm

Admit it, Democrats, you have been lied to your whole lives and you just keep believing it.

You were told by President Obama that the reason for our poor economy was because George Bush cut the taxes on the rich. Obama just signed a bill to keep the taxes at the same level. You were told by President Roosevelt that his “New Deal” would end the Great Depression. It made it last longer and longer. You were told by President Lyndon Johnson that his policies would end poverty in America. There are more poor people now than ever.

Now we are stuck with all of their stupid programs. We are stuck with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, They have just about bankrupted us. We are stuck with Social Security and Medicare that will bankrupt us. We are stuck with every stupid government program, like the Department of Agriculture and the department of Education, and we just can’t get rid of them.

I can understand older folks voting for these people to continue these Ponzi schemes. However, young Democrats? Give me a break. You are the ones that will be stuck with the bill.

Tags:
Leave a comment Comments → 202
  1. That bill is currently $45,000 for every person in the county– and that’s just for the debt the guvment admits to. And in Social Security, Medicare, and Obamacare and…you don’t want to know.

  2. redneckbuck says:

    Progessives see no problem with what they are doing. They will tell you that we need to grow the programs and raise taxes. They confuse me.

  3. First_Lefty says:

    “You were told by President Obama that the reason for our poor economy was because George Bush cut the taxes on the rich.”

    Please cite the day of this alleged quote.

  4. freakwater says:

    Bush said Saddam had nukes now we are stuck in Iraq. Where are the Nukes? Where are the Bio? Where are the Chem? Where are the WMD that we were promised?

    And why are we still stuck in Afghanistan? Why didn’t the Bush/Cheney Chickenhawk team ever catch Osama bin Laden? They let that guy run free for almost eight years! For that reason alone, the draft-dodging junta of Bush/Cheney should be in federal prison.

    I think Osama bin Laden paid Dick Cheney not to shoot him in the face. Dick Cheney only shoots lawyers in the face. I guess he does have some good points!

  5. First_Lefty says:

    “redneckbuck says:
    December 29, 2010 at 4:04 pm
    Progessives see no problem with what they are doing. They will tell you that we need to grow the programs and raise taxes. They confuse me.”

    Yes, redneck, you are confused. Easily, it appears. Due to the economic challenges and needs of our citizenry, cutting programs is not the answer for the majority of Americans. Raising taxes so that people can eat and have a place to get out of the rain is important, since the wealthy people are not hiring even though they have enjoyed the tax breaks that supposedly provide jobs for over 8 years.

    I suppose the other answer is for the Americans to move to where their jobs were outsourced.

  6. Gee Matthew, your ramblings are on the same caliber of financial advise that you give out for Morgan Stanley !

  7. “Please cite the day of this alleged quote. ”

    “President Obama opened his “fiscal responsibility summit” at the White House on Monday by condemning “the casual dishonesty of hiding irresponsible spending with clever accounting tricks” that he said the Bushies used to conceal the mushrooming deficit. During his speech, Obama also said he’d slice the $1.3 trillion federal shortfall, which he believes he inherited from Bush, in two during his first term even though about a quarter of the deficit comes from Obama’s stimulus package.”
    Politico – Feb 2009

    Wasn’t too hard to find by the way… Basically it is harder to find a day he hasn’t slammed Bush… or the GOP… or Wall Street… I have bets on the day he slams the Boy Scouts.

  8. “Obama just signed a bill to keep the taxes at the same level.”

    Do you need any sources for this one???

  9. truthbusterguy says:

    Mr. Philichi, great letter and truer words have never been said. He speaks to the young people out there correctly, WAKE UP dummies. Don’t you see the bill coming your way. Stop blindly following these idealist democratic fools.

  10. redneckbuck says:

    freakwater you are changing the subject.

  11. redneckbuck says:

    Programs only make people dependent on government. It will be tough to ween people off of the programs at first much like a junky off of crack.

  12. redneckbuck says:

    The author brings up the point that the left wanted the country to move toward a socialistic state. Obama mades some promises that led them to believe that he would. In recent days Obama has gone back on a few of the key promises he made during the campaign. It is obvious and is foolish to deny this. I did not vote for Obama but would consider it in 2012 if he continues to move to the center. I voted for HWB once and then voted for Clinton after HWB lied about raising taxes. The left needs to realize that if they get their way here their guy will face certain defeat in 2012.

  13. I was told that I am not a crook, it would trickle down, read my lips.

  14. redneck-I thought the subject was lies?

  15. Late August 2005 a storm the like we had not seen on modern times was making its way towards a city in Louisiana. It was known it was coming but the government both local, parish and state did not do enough to implement a plan that was designed to provide for the safety of its residents. With just over 24 hours before landfall, the mayor of that historic city finally ordered a mandatory evacuation. Too late for many.

    In general, if you some form of self-sufficiency then you were able to help yourself, leave the city and increase your chances of survival. If you were dependent on the government, in whole or in part… well, we know what happened.

    Life can suck, life really sucks if you are dependent on government for anything…

  16. MarksonofDarwin says:

    Sure, the Democrats have been lied to.
    And, the Republicans have been lied to as well.
    I wouldn’t have used the same examples that freakwater did, but I guess I’m changing the subject as well.

    Just take a few moments and think about many of the things Republicans have done that you, as a Republican felt betrayed on. The whole “well they were RINOS”, or DINOS is simply a deflection of the truth that BOTH the Ds and Rs go against their core philosophy for one reason or another.

    You can’t point to the Dems. dishonesty without acknowledging the Reps. dishonesty. Many times it’s short sightedness of the unintended consequences…other times, it’s simple political expediency, but they both fall short, and I wish more people would hold them accountable instead of making excuses for them.

  17. redneckbuck says:

    Marks the answer is the center, we are always pointed to the center.

  18. olbluedoc says:

    During last year’s campaigns the Republicans were screaming about deficits and Obamacare. When they won, the only thing they screamed about was their precious tax breaks for the top 2% in this country.BTW, the top 2% are the only people they represent. They got the tax breaks and guess what? Nothing. Not a peep from them on anything, including deficits and health care. Why? Because they don’t care. And if you think that they have your interests in mind then you are nothing but morons.

  19. redneckbuck says:

    The republicans know the 2% savings really don’t amount to much.

  20. What is the center?

    How do we reconcile pro-choice vs pro-life… gun-rights… immigration issues… is universal health care a centrist position? interpretation of the Constitution, is it absolute? or is it a living document?

    Just curious

  21. First_Lefty says:

    rr – whatever you do, ask for help when you pick out apples at the store, otherwise you’ll come home with oranges…..

    My question – “You were told by President Obama that the reason for our poor economy was because George Bush cut the taxes on the rich.”
    Please cite the day of this alleged quote”

    Your answer?

    “President Obama opened his “fiscal responsibility summit” at the White House on Monday by condemning “the casual dishonesty of hiding irresponsible spending with clever accounting tricks” that he said the Bushies used to conceal the mushrooming deficit. During his speech, Obama also said he’d slice the $1.3 trillion federal shortfall, which he believes he inherited from Bush, in two during his first term even though about a quarter of the deficit comes from Obama’s stimulus package.”
    Politico – Feb 2009″

    there is no place in the citation you provided that Obama said the economy was because of tax cuts

  22. First_Lefty says:

    “rr98411 says:
    December 29, 2010 at 5:53 pm
    Life can suck, life really sucks if you are dependent on government for anything… ”

    I’m guessing that you were educated in a public school……

  23. Lefty – are you really being that literal?

    Dude, where have you been the last few years? Pick any day in 2007 and 2008, it was a classic Bush bashing Obama talking point leading up to the election. You can add any week since the election.

    How about this one from the Huffington Post… they are a little peeve at the President in this article.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/07/obama-bush-tax-cuts-video_n_793123.html

    Do you have a point or is your come back going to be that Obama did not literally say that… really, is that all you got.

    The point of the post is that Democrats have lied to you… Mark make a very good point that you can add Republicans to the mix… Defending one party over another is a lose-lose proposition.

    Face it, we all have been lied to…

  24. “I’m guessing that you were educated in a public school…… ”

    wow, I am feeling a little spanked… oww… really dude…

    Anyway, does my response at 8:04 add anything to the thread for you? If not, maybe the author can find the exact quote for you and then we can move on.

  25. the3rdpigshouse says:

    Anyone – young or old – who remains a member or a supporter of the socialist democrat party is part of the problem. The socialist democrat party should be identified an agent of an anti-American agenda and therefore should be declared an enemy of the State and outlawed!!! Then we can start the corrective actions required to put our nation back on course!!

  26. First_Lefty says:

    Obama did not blame Bush’s tax cuts on the economic problems of the US. That was the statement that I questioned.

    Obama did blame the Bush Administration for our financial ills. He was correct. Two wars with no funding does not make for a balanced budget.

    2+2 still equals 4, regardless of what the Conservatives say.

    As to your “spanking” – the majority of Americans DEPEND on public education and then complain about DEPENDING on the government.

    Hypocrisy at its best.

  27. Red – yes it is difficult to wean people off support programs. However it is embarrassingly easy to wean them of jobs by sending our jobs overseas so the corporations and other big businesses can make more profit for the rich to buy more things while the worker and middle classes can’t hold on to what they have.

    The middle way is usually the best way, especially if the government, business, and labor start working together for the good of the country and all its citizens.

    3pig –

    Would you classify shipping American jobs overseas as pro- or anti-American?

    How about stiffing free speech and the right to have an opinions counter to what the Government, the Churches, or anyone else tells us to believe?

  28. “… – the majority of Americans DEPEND on public education and then complain about DEPENDING on the government.”

    One of the duties of the State of Washington is to provide for basic education of it citizens. Through the many taxes I have paid to the feds, the state and the city I did, with little guilt, send my son through the school system. When it can time for college, I paid for it… all of it, no government help.

    Now that he is a man, he is gainfully employed and in turn, pays taxes to support the system. He is doing his share as he should. My belief is that he will continue to be employed, pay his fair share of taxes and NEVER depend on the government for anything that he can do for himself.

    I can only speak for myself but my experience has shown I am not alone…

  29. First_Lefty says:

    “When it can time for college, I paid for it… all of it, no government help.”

    Which private school did he attend?

  30. “Which private school did he attend? ”

    If I tell you Harvard – will you believe me or am I lying?

    If I tell you UW – will you believe me or am I lying?

    If I tell you TCC – will you believe me now? Is it not enough that I was able to pay for it… and I did, regardless of amount. My son learn an important lesson about paying for things when you can and not depend on anybody.

  31. Merry Christmas Piggie. You really should go for help before what is left of your brain melts.
    Your comments are really numbing for their incoherence and over-the-topness. They do get attention once in a while, but it is the kind of attention most normal folks would rather not have.
    Did you ever know what reasonable meant? Or have you always been obtuse? Do you know the word for baseless or excessive suspicion of the motives of others? It all fits according to what you write.

  32. First_Lefty says:

    “rr98411 says:
    December 29, 2010 at 9:03 pm
    “Which private school did he attend? ”

    If I tell you Harvard – will you believe me or am I lying?

    If I tell you UW – will you believe me or am I lying?

    If I tell you TCC – will you believe me now? Is it not enough that I was able to pay for it… and I did, regardless of amount. My son learn an important lesson about paying for things when you can and not depend on anybody.

    If you tell me Harvard, you might be correct in your previous statement about no government help.

    If you say UW or TCC, you are wrong – both are government funded schools.

    Your problem is that you don’t even realize what government help you’ve gotten. You’re too busy trying to be “right” in the argument to know the difference between right and wrong.

    The difference between Harvard and UW is taxpayer funding.

    You need not be defensive. Just learn the difference and be thankful that we have had leadership in this country that knew the value of government supported education.

  33. First_Lefty says:

    “My belief is that he will continue to be employed, pay his fair share of taxes and NEVER depend on the government for anything that he can do for himself.”

    No one is forced to go to a state school. Everyone has the choice of forking up $40K a year for a nice private college.

    Isn’t that the Conservative’s creed?

  34. First_Lefty says:

    Isn’t it facinating that The Socialist Marxist Obama went to Columbia and Harvard – both private schools not funded by taxpayer dollars?

  35. bobcat1a says:

    Matthew, write your republican representatives and tell them you want to end the Dep’t of Agriculture and Social Security and Medicare and see how quick they introduce a bill to do either. They talk but they know they will never do anything to end them. Too many republican voters depend on both of them. Remember the Tea Party rant from summer before last, “keep your government hands off my Medicare.”

  36. FL – Their are very few schools that do not receive government funding in some form, whether fed or state. What is your point and/or what does that have to do with the subject?

    “Your problem is that you don’t even realize what government help you’ve gotten.”

    Define “government help” – paying my son’s way through TCC or even the UW is not using government help in my books.

  37. bobcat1a says:

    Mr Pighouse, your statement, “The socialist democrat party should be identified an agent of an anti-American agenda and therefore should be declared an enemy of the State and outlawed!!!” reminded me of something. It happens to be pretty reminiscent of the program of the National Socialist Party in the late twenties and early thirties.

  38. First_Lefty says:

    “Define “government help” – paying my son’s way through TCC or even the UW is not using government help in my books.”

    Both of those schools are funded by taxpayer dollars. If they were private your cost would have increased significantly. I thought I made that quite clear in my previous statement.

    3rd Pig – Newsmax? Please. Quote the National Enquirer instead.

  39. “No one is forced to go to a state school. Everyone has the choice of forking up $40K a year for a nice private college.”

    What does have to do with Dems/GOP lying to us?

    “Isn’t that the Conservative’s creed? ”

    Again, What does have to do with Dems/GOP lying to us?

    Read more: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2010/12/29/admit-it-you-were-lied-to/#ixzz19ZkmlEiW

  40. “Isn’t it fascinating that The Socialist Marxist Obama went to Columbia and Harvard – both private schools not funded by taxpayer dollars? ”

    …not funded by taxpayer dollars… really, Columibia is #10 on a list of federal fund recipients. Do you want to clarify?

  41. First_Lefty says:

    “FL – Their are very few schools that do not receive government funding in some form, whether fed or state. What is your point and/or what does that have to do with the subject? “

    The entire Ivy League does not get government funding. That’s just for starters. PLU and UPS are right in your backyard. Seattle U? Gonzaga? How many more do I have to name?

    You just don’t know the difference and are arguing from an ignorant position.

  42. First_Lefty says:

    “Columibia is #10 on a list of federal fund recipients”

    Please cite the list.

  43. “Both of those schools are funded by taxpayer dollars. If they were private your cost would have increased significantly. I thought I made that quite clear in my previous statement.”

    Are you that much of a purist? I paid the stated tuition without receiving government assistance. Their is no hypocrisy.

    Again, What does have to do with Dems/GOP lying to us?

  44. First_Lefty says:

    “http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbia_university

    Just read the facts.

  45. donjames says:

    First_Lefty says:

    “Obama did not blame Bush’s tax cuts on the economic problems of the US. That was the statement that I questioned.”

    Uh-humm:

    Obama believes that there is no such thing as a “jobless recovery.” When millions of Americans aren’t working, neither are the Bush Administration’s economic policies. As US Senator, Obama will champion policies that get our economy moving and people working instead of short-sighted tax-cuts for the rich that have failed to spark a recovery.

    Source: Campaign website, ObamaForIllinois.com May 2, 2004

    http://www.ontheissues.org/Celeb/Barack_Obama_Budget_+_Economy.htm

    Obama said, “Domestically, our national debt and budget constrain us in ways that are going to be very far-reaching. And I think whoever is elected in 2008 is going to be cleaning up the fiscal mess that was created as a consequence of the president’s tax cuts.”

    Source: The Improbable Quest, by John K. Wilson, p.155 Oct 30, 2007

    http://www.ontheissues.org/Celeb/Barack_Obama_Tax_Reform.htm

    You’re so… on the ball.

  46. First_Lefty says:

    Again, What does have to do with Dems/GOP lying to us?

    Geez….why don’t you tell us. You brought up the subject of “government dependency”……..LMAO

    “rr98411 says:
    December 29, 2010 at 5:53 pm
    Life can suck, life really sucks if you are dependent on government for anything… “

    Are you by chance, drinking while trying to argue your point?

    “I paid the stated tuition without receiving government assistance. Their is no hypocrisy.”

    Without the government funding, you couldn’t have afforded the tuition that you would have had to pay. You are exercising what is known as intellectual dishonesty.

    And as a sidebar….I think the word you are wanting is “there” as opposed to “their”. Check with the college grad, as I could be wrong.

  47. First_Lefty says:

    WOW Donny….reaching back to 2004, four years before the market crash of 2008. THAT is really in context to the subject.

    Since you like John K. Wilson, you’ll probably enjoy this writing of his:

    John McCain has made the distant connections from years ago between Barack Obama and “unrepentant terrorist” Bill Ayers a centerpiece of the McCain-Palin campaign.

    But McCain has much closer, more direct, and more recent connections to terrorists who committed acts far worse than Ayers, yet McCain’s links to “unrepentant terrorists” are completely ignored by the media. And although Obama has forcefully condemned the past actions of Ayers, John McCain has never denounced his terrorist friends.

    In the 1980s, McCain personally funded a guerrilla group (the Contras) that engaged in terrorist acts. Just last year, McCain expressed how “proud” he was of an ex-felon who urged shooting law enforcement agents in the head (G. Gordon Liddy). And earlier this year, the McCain campaign trumpeted the endorsement of a man who illegally provided weapons and money to terrorists; when a reporter questioned this, the McCain campaign refused to even criticize this criminal (Oliver North).

    The 2007 quote from Wilson is also over a year before the market failure that created the economic instability. Obama’s quote was obviously directed at the deficit created by (1) Iraq, (2) Afghanistan and (3) tax cuts (aka unfunded)

    According to you, Obama must have been clairvoyant about an economic crisis that happened in September 2008 to have made such quotes in 2004 and 2007.

    So, tell me….how do you like Wilson NOW?

  48. “The entire Ivy League does not get government funding. That’s just for starters. PLU and UPS are right in your backyard. Seattle U? Gonzaga? How many more do I have to name?

    You just don’t know the difference and are arguing from an ignorant position. ”

    You sure??? With few exceptions, most universities receive some form of government funding…

    http://health.usf.edu/nocms/publicaffairs/now/pdfs/Federal_Expenditures_Rankings_2009.pdf

  49. “Without the government funding, you couldn’t have afforded the tuition that you would have had to pay. You are exercising what is known as intellectual dishonesty.”

    I paid the stated tuition without receiving government assistance. Their is no hypocrisy. Sorry you don’t see the difference.

  50. MarksonofDarwin says:

    rr98411,

    It’s possible that you’ve never encountered an internet troll.

    If not, it appears that you have just encountered your first! It’s frustrating and annoying, and I guarantee that you will NEVER find this conversation illuminating or satisfying in any way.

    I know you just started posting here, and I don’t want you to think that this is the way that we all conduct ourselves in this forum. There are disagreements nearly everyday, but you will find a couple posters who are only interested in picking out an insignificant portion of one of your posts, and blowing it out of proportion…..and this IS textbook, typical troll behavior. I’m just letting you know this in case you weren’t aware that you are being trolled.

    If you ARE aware, and are having fun…then have at it!
    Cheers!

    P.S.
    I hope that you are able to read this before the troll goes snivelling to the board nanny and has this removed.
    It’s a curious thing here….but the trolls are protected and coddled for some bizarre reason.

  51. pazzo242 says:

    Matthew–as a conservative and ususally vote republican i can assure you both sides lie. lie, lie—-have you forgotten “Tricky” Dick Nixon. Anything any politician says should be taken with a large grain of salt..Dems, Repubs or independants. They all lie to get elected and then tell you (sometimes) why they can’t do what they promised.

  52. Let’s see what are the good things GW did for us. Hmmmmm let’s start with the first thing he did as president which was collect months pay before his first day on the job. Now what was the first thing after 9-11 oh yea let the family of mastermind of the tragedy leave freely. What great thing he did do next? Hmm what it’s called ? Oh yea he lied to congress and America about Iraq being a threat to the U S due to weapons of mass destruction & to be training terrorist. Which neither were found, damn things must have been invisible.I guess that makes a great President. One final thing if President biggest lie is about the taxes then I can handle it better than the lie about Iraq.

  53. This thread kind of reminds me of the truism when editing sound or video tape: “Garbage in, garbage out”.

    The letter was stupid partisan blather, almost all of the posts on this thread have followed suit.

    MoD’s first post should have ended the thread: Dems lie, Repubs lie. This isn’t a new revelation.

  54. Fun… a little of both, Internet trolls – oh yeah, seen my share. Sometimes I’m in the mood and ignore them, sometimes I just feelin’ a little frisky. I guess I was a little frisky.

    Board Nanny – I like that. Had a run in with them in a previous thread. They deleted my post twice and (a little frisky that day) on the third try I specifically asked what the issue was with my post… it stayed.

    Take care

  55. First_Lefty says:

    Internet trolls = a statement made by those that can’t finish the arguments they start.

  56. First_Lefty says:

    rr98411 says:
    You sure??? With few exceptions, most universities receive some form of government funding…

    http://health.usf.edu/nocms/publicaffairs/now/pdfs/Federal_Expenditures_Rankings_2009.pdf

    Again….apples and oranges. Your cited pdf was research and development grants, which have virtually NOTHING to do with tuition. Those government grants are issue on application to perform services. In other words you EARN a grant. I’ve been responsible for writing grant applications and reporting during my career.

    Did you go to college?

    Pssst…….Markie – THIS is an example of trolling – constant out of context references to argue against simple known points.

    As the moderator of a blog, I report no one nor would I delete a person’s argument, no matter how ignorant the basis is. I believe in Freedom of the Press. If you’ve had moderation problems, you’ll have to blame someone else – possibly yourself. The TNT publishes their very simple rules.

  57. First_Lefty says:

    Mark – to further explain my position, after being chided by a TNT moderator because I told a certain “troll” to “shut the hell up” when they tried to tell me I don’t know my own county auditor’s name, my response to the moderator was that I found this “person’s” actions rather childish to be caught with their hand in the cookie jar (in this case foot in mouth) and then whine to mommy about someone taking them to task.

    The moderator told me they depend on commenter reporting for moderation. I said “no thanks”.

    I guess you’ll have to find another boogeyman.

    Meanwhile, I recognize the TNT’s right to moderation, afterall THEY own the website, maintain and manage it. Calling their moderator a “nanny” would reflect acknowledgement that you are acting childish, as nannies discipline children.

  58. First_Lefty says:

    sorry beerBoy, I hate to disagree, as we rarely do, but the letter makes assertions about alleged “lies” that never took place.

    To say a Democrat, Republican or Independent lied and then prove they lied is one thing. To paint all with a broad stroke brush is another.

    In this case, the letter writer IS as partisan as they come, thus my demand for citation of his allegation of a supposed Obama quote (which was never made). To accuse Obama of lying about something that he never said is unfair. It would be equally unfair to level the same at Sarah Palin.

  59. Lefty – I acknowledge that the poster can be taken literally. I would ask that accounting for literary license does his premise hold some truth.

    When politicians make promises and pledges to not do something and they do it anyway, does that not give you pause to think that they have “lied” to you?

    It may not be something as specific as “read my lips…” but still…

    The Democrats premise is that social programs will cure the ills of society… have they really?

    Just asking….

  60. First_Lefty says:

    rr – we’ll never know where this country would have been without FDR’s “social programs”, but for me, I’ll say “I don’t want to know”

    What would have been accomplished by not creating the New Deal and leaving the public hanging out to dry financially for maybe a decade or three? What point would that prove? Do you think FDR kept getting re-elected because the populace was not happy?

    For the “greatest country in the world” we really suck when in comes to compassion and comprehension of society’s ills and the impact that is created. Of course, we are but the step-child of European ancestry that didn’t take too well to the monarchy rule (consider the social implications).

    But what do I know…..I’m just trolling….remember?

  61. rr – it is the Republicans’ premise that unrestricted markets will cure the ills of society….have they really?

  62. First_Lefty says:

    As to quote accuracy and lies……

    If I said – “Sarah Palin said she could see Russia from her front door and that’s a lie…”

    Would that be a fair accusation?

    Of course not. Sarah Palin never really said that. It was a comedy line by Tina Fey.

    Hold Obama responsible for what he DID say, not what he DIDN’T say.

  63. Continuing with FL’s comment about FDR. There is a very strong case to be made that the New Deal, especially social security, created the Middle Class in America – that prior to that the economic power was concentrated in the top 2% with at least 1/3 of America being in low income or poverty levels (just like it is today after 30 years of Supply Side voodoo).

  64. First_Lefty says:

    “You were told by President Roosevelt that his “New Deal” would end the Great Depression. It made it last longer and longer.”

    Now THERE is a perfect example of a baseless assertion. There is no possible way to prove such a thing.

    “You were told by President Lyndon Johnson that his policies would end poverty in America. There are more poor people now than ever.”

    This mixed message is a real doozy! Not only did the GOP disassemble as much of Johnson’s programs as possible – from Reagan to GWBush – the population has increased significantly since 1964.

    The letter writer has demonstrated a proclivity for Republican talking points, at best.

  65. hansgruber says:

    First_Lefty says:
    December 29, 2010 at 4:18 pm
    “You were told by President Obama that the reason for our poor economy was because George Bush cut the taxes on the rich.”
    Please cite the day of this alleged quote

    PARMA, Ohio | Wed Sep 8, 2010 9:54pm EDT
    (Reuters) – President Barack Obama, fighting to keep Democrats in charge of Congress, said on Wednesday the United States could not afford to extend Bush-era tax cuts for the rich and accused Republicans of being fiscally irresponsible.

    In September John Boehner said that if faced with a choice between extending only the middle-class tax cuts or no cuts at all, he’d suck it up and vote for the White House’s preferred option. Obama campaigned in 2008 on allowing the Bush tax cuts for top earners to lapse—it was a central plank of his platform. The deficit hysteria provided a useful rhetorical tool to highlight the budget-busting cost of those cuts—$700 billion over ten years—and also allowed Obama to make a basic case for equity. According to The Huffington Post, Obama had “described the Bush-era program that he’s now adopting as his own as ‘tax cuts for millionaires and billionaires’ no fewer than 50 times.”
    http://www.thenation.com/issue/december-27-2010

    Q: So, you want to just eliminate the Bush tax cuts?
    A: I want to eliminate the Bush tax cuts. And what I have said is, I will institute a middle-class tax cut. So, if you’re making $75,000, if you’re making $50,000 a year, you will see an extra $1,000 a year offsetting on your payroll tax.
    Q: Define middle class.
    A: Well, look, I think that the definitions are always a little bit rough, but if you’re making $100,000 a year or less, then you’re pretty solidly middle class, and you deserve relief right now, as opposed to paying higher taxes. But people who are making over $200,000 or $250,000 have benefited the most from economic growth.
    Source: CNN Late Edition: 2008 presidential series with Wolf Blitzer May 11, 2008

  66. First_Lefty says:

    hans – you are closer….although still mixed metaphor.

    The issue is, and has always been, that tax cuts for the rich sustain the DEFICIT. They have nothing to do with the ECONOMY.

    Obama did not blame the economy on tax cuts for the wealthy, which is what the letter writer contends.

    I quote: “You were told by President Obama that the reason for our poor economy was because George Bush cut the taxes on the rich.”

    Read more: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2010/12/29/admit-it-you-were-lied-to/#ixzz19cDdrM6L

    You can have a healthy economy and still have budget deficits.

  67. MoD – I recall you giving me a mild slap on the hand for suggesting that there were a few folks here who, though not actually trolls, sometimes engage in troll-like activities. Then you provided one example of one person who you considered a troll.

    It seems your definition of troll has broadened considerably since then.

  68. First_Lefty says:

    “rr98411 says:
    December 30, 2010 at 7:29 am
    When politicians make promises and pledges to not do something and they do it anyway, does that not give you pause to think that they have “lied” to you?”

    You mean like Rand Paul saying he would filibuster the debt ceiling and then when McConnell schooled him on the ramifications, he backed down?

    Sometimes the ignorance of the candidates best promises get in the way of functional governing

    I really glad that Rand Paul lied about that.

  69. First_Lefty says:

    beerBoy – I think Mark’s accusation of me being a troll was just a frustration of the inability to mount a real argument on the issue.

    Sort of trolling about trolling……LOL

  70. jtarleton says:

    Yes I am disappointed in Obama. He compromised to much and as you mention didn’t live up to his campaign promises. But he did get a few things accomplished and you have to take into account the economic situation he was left with. Would I vote for him again,,,,You Bet , because the option would have been McCain and Palin. Those two would have broke this nation.
    PS. I would have voted for McCain intially (Not Palin) until he refused to denounce the torture being practiced by our security forces. Seeing as he was tortured in N. Vietnam you would have thought he would have been decidely against it. That’s when he lost my support.

  71. First_Lefty says:

    jtarleton – The 2008 John McCain is a shadow of the 2000 John McCain that I once respected. He sold his soul.

    By allowing Bush carte blanche with the South Carolina whisper campaign about his “black daughter” McCain demonstrated that he was part of the problem and not part of the solution.

  72. Roncella says:

    Matthew, You left out one of the most bankrupt bills ever passed through a Congress with only dems. voting to get it passed, ObamaCare.

  73. First_Lefty says:

    radec is my internet stalker. For more of radec’s stalking see Olyblog.net

    You’ll note radec’s primary complaint about me is a blog I moderate and radec is too much a coward to apply for membership because it would require disclosing who radec really is.

    fberg – sorry, as I said yesterday, I never watched the Smurfs. That was for my children, which tells me that you are not old enough to even be on the same intellectual level with me.

    sozo – you make the trifecta.

    Hey, Marks……are you paying attention???? Trollsgalore!!!!!!

    “Also notice that he frequently has to use bold text. That is because his words are so much more important that anyone elses. It’s kind of sad really.”

    Thanks radec. I thought my use of bold face was to differentiate from the copied and pasted test. When I use italics for others am I saying their’s is more important?

    I’d say that “sad” is making up rules of font usage for comments sections.

    LMAO

  74. First_Lefty says:

    Roncella – how much money has been spent on health care reform since the legislation passed?

  75. First_Lefty says:

    “he almost shut down another local newspaper comment section all by himself.”

    Dang…..I’m powerful. The newspaper in question is slowly, but surely being eliminated from existence. If you want to read the content of said newspaper, all you have to do is read the News Tribune, you get the same news, better comment threads (with obvious exceptions) and moderation that makes the Conservatives whine (therefore, it MUST be fair…..LOL)

  76. First_Lefty says:

    You know……I remember at the newspaper whose name shall not be mentioned, the Right Wing Extremists used to complain that the Progressive Liberals were responsible for their comments being deleted.

    Funny how the more things change, the more they stay the same…..LMAO

  77. First_Lefty says:

    “radec says:
    December 30, 2010 at 11:28 am
    FL said
    “which tells me that you are not old enough to even be on the same intellectual level with me.”

    LOL and there it is, straight from the horses mouth (or perhaps another part of the horse!) Yes, we cannot be at the same intellectual level as the great and wise FL. Talk about illusions of grandeur!”

    Sorry, radec. I should know that extensive cartoon knowledge is essential in discussing politics. I guess my lack of Smurfisms disqualifies me to discuss letters to the editor in a local newspaper. :::::eyeroll:::::::

    (note: I b/f’d your comment to make you feel important)

  78. It’s pretty sad when one gets banned from posting on a newspaper website (as FL did). Then he complained so much to the moderators that they got sick of him and refused to listen to his vacuous complaints. So he went north to irritate a whole new crowd of people. It won’t be long before he will be posting at the Fairbanks Daily News-Miner!

  79. MarksonofDarwin says:

    bB, I guess I will attempt an example of what I’m talking about:

    My imaginary troll:
    You can’t possibly believe what you just wrote. You need more help than I originally thought. If you pulled your head out of that leftist “brain” of yours, you could educate yourself on the New Deal and really see what FDR did. 1/3 of all Americans needed help? Prove it.

    Within 5 minutes comes the next (5) post(s) from like minded or the same person:

    My imaginary troll:
    Still waiting bB. You people are so stupid and it’s very easy to show you for the baffoon that you are.
    Ahhhhh. I could do this in my sleep.

    You make the mistake of answering me with links and evidence, and you have discovered to your chagrin that the real number is really 11% of the population. You try to explain that really wasn’t your point, but I can be very persistent.

    My imaginary troll:
    See? You’re so oblivious that you don’t even realize that I have proven you wrong. Again. I win every time with you, and I don’t understand why you even bother.

    I will then proceed to post about 20 posts trumpeting my victory over you.

    The End

    I don’t quite have the finesse or nuance down, but you get the drift.
    There’s no real exchange of ideas because I’m too busy with the insignificant portion of your thoughts that can be twisted into a mis-characterization of your point. And then declare myself “winner” with several victory laps to boot. Now THAT’S intellectual dishonesty.

    Frankly, I couldn’t care less what anybody does on this forum. I do however enjoy new and fresh ideas. I often wonder how many people stay away from here because of the hostility….and the sheer number of identical postings from a handful of people.

  80. First_Lefty says:

    Marks – so you must really be annoyed with the comments of radec, sozo and fberg….right?

  81. First_Lefty says:

    Oh geez…..I’m sorry…..this thread is about cartoon characters.

    How terrible of me to go off subject.

  82. First_Lefty says:

    Oh…and radec….

    In the past three months I’ve posted dozens of times on said newspaper thread. You just don’t know who I am. Muaahahahahahahahaha

    It’s really difficult to stalk someone when you don’t know who they are…..kinda frustrating, isn’t it?

    Frankly, why should I read a second class online newspaper, when I can get the most up to date news right here?

  83. First_Lefty says:

    radec….we don’t hate anyone. We LOVE those fools that provide us fodder for our humor.

    Thanks for being you.

  84. First_Lefty says:

    From the “Hate Blog”:

    Bristol Palin, 20-year-old daughter of Sarah Palin, has bought a home in Maricopa, an outlying Valley suburb in Pinal County.
    Aside from the celebrity buyer, the political family and Dancing With the Stars, the purchase of the five-bedroom house represents a typical real-estate saga in Arizona.
    Public records show the home was built in 2006 and bought for $329,560. It went into foreclosure in January of this year.
    Read more: http://www.azcentral.com/ent/celeb/articles/2010/12/24/20101224bristol-palin-buys-home-in-arizona.html#ixzz19QRMrSDE

    nasty……frightening……also published in azcentral.

    LOL

  85. Oh I know you’re still there at the other paper, in fact I just posted about it to cedar the other day! It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure that out!

  86. I see you edited out your snide remarks, making fun of a young single mom just for buying a home. Yeah that’s what we need more of.

  87. First_Lefty says:

    OK……I have errands to run.

    I’ll leave the pleasure of radec’s stalking posts to those of you that hang around. It’s quite good reading.

    radec’s last obsession with me increased our blog readership by almost 100% in the past month. We’ve had about 20,000 views in the past year.

  88. First_Lefty says:

    “radec says:
    December 30, 2010 at 11:53 am
    Oh I know you’re still there at the other paper, in fact I just posted about it to cedar the other day! It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure that out!

    Actually, I haven’t posted there since October, but that just proves I’ve got you obsessed and guessing.

    hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahathump
    (just LMAO)

  89. First_Lefty says:

    “radec says:
    December 30, 2010 at 11:55 am
    I see you edited out your snide remarks, making fun of a young single mom just for buying a home. Yeah that’s what we need more of. ”

    You want my editorial comment?

    I think that all unwed mothers should have the same opportunity as Bristol Palin to purchase a house of that value for cash.

    (an important statement, so I b/f’d)

  90. First_Lefty says:

    radec….

    I’m a liar.

    Am I lying?

    Come on…I have things to get done. Quit being my pigeon for humor.

  91. freakwater says:

    Careful, you don’t want to agitate the grunting, knuckle-dragging Fox News viewer by offering him facts. When he is finished beating his wife he will turn that hatred and anger on you!

  92. Yeah another compassionate liberal saying I beat my wife. Must be an Olyblog poster, common theme over there.

  93. freakwater says:

    You assumed that I was talking about you. It must be your guilty conscience.

  94. Doesn’t matter if it was directed at me or not, saying that about anyone or any group of people is sick. Not that you care.

  95. Roncella says:

    First_Lefty, Come on you know as well as I do that most of the money for ObamaCare does not get spent until 2014.

    Hopefully the Majority Conservatives in the House will have destroyed Obamacare before that and re-wrote a new Health Care bill with truthful discussions by many, not behind closed doors, without wheeling and dealing to get it passed through the Congress.

  96. fbergford says:

    hahahahahaha I didn’t realize that got First Lefty’s panties in a knot! hahahahaha Well I suggest you should watch a Smurf’s episode because you fit Brainy Smurf to the “T”!

  97. sharkie69 says:

    someone appears to have a crush on someone else

  98. First_Lefty says:

    “Roncella says:
    December 30, 2010 at 11:11 am
    Matthew, You left out one of the most bankrupt bills ever passed through a Congress with only dems. voting to get it passed, ObamaCare.

    Roncella says:
    December 30, 2010 at 12:14 pm
    First_Lefty, Come on you know as well as I do that most of the money for ObamaCare does not get spent until 2014

    Now mind you, dear readers, these are the people that call Obama a liar.

    Read more: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2010/12/29/admit-it-you-were-lied-to/#ixzz19d1lsBFr

  99. freakwater says:

    The tea partiers suffer from acute cognitive retardation that is the result of prolonged exposure to the deadly radiation of the Fox News Stupid Ray. They grunt for more government spending, more global empire, and less personal freedom while claiming they are “conservative.”

    William F. Buckley and Barry Goldwater would be Democrats if they were alive today. Hell, old Ronnie Raygun would too, if he could see the subterranean Sarah Palin-level of brainpower that represents the modern GOP voter.

  100. First_Lefty says:

    Freak…

    I have some very good Conservative friends and we debate frequently.

    This crew is like playing marbles with yourself.

  101. Fibonacci says:

    radec
    I have read your back and forth with Old_Lefty and all I can say is grow up man. Your remarks are like and elementary student saying “I know you are but what am I?”

  102. Fibonacci says:

    Sorry that was First_Left not Old Lefty.

  103. “I have some very good conservative friends..” Where have I heard that before? Those are the made up friends in his mind that he debates with, notice how he can’t get 1 single conservative to join his blog, even though they have tried! Gee, I wonder why?

  104. chip98404 says:

    Did the New Deal work? A poll of the top economists in this country are nearly split right down the middle. In 1995, economist Robert Whaples of Wake Forest University published a survey of academic economists that asked them if they agreed with the statement, “Taken as a whole, government policies of the New Deal served to lengthen and deepen the Great Depression.” Fifty-one percent disagreed, and 49 percent agreed. But almost all agreed that, while flawed in many areas (especially the National Recovery Act which was quickly repealed), the New Deal was an experiment that was worth trying. And most agree that it reduced unemployment from the high of 24% far faster than if nothing had been done.

    Did Lyndon Johnson’s “Great Society” work? Almost all of the aims of this program saw immediate and lasting gains. Civil rights was the cornerstone. We saw legalized segregation come to an end. While there is still work to be done, this part was a resounding success. Has the goal of increasing the number of college educated Americans increased? The percentage of college graduates today is greater than the percentage of high school graduates when LBJ took office. You cite “poverty” as the biggest failure. The adjusted poverty level in 1960 was 22 percent. At the end of Bill Clinton’s second term, it was 7.2%. Looks like a success to me!

    So, the very basis of your editorial fails on inspection. It might pay to do some real in-depth research of your own before citing “facts” instead of just taking the words of people you already agree with, just to support your own opinion.

  105. Awesome letter. Same idiots engaging with the same stupid stuff….but what is to be expected. At least young people are becoming more and more conservative in droves. This nanny state is not good, and will lead to the downfall of this nation if not corrected. Obama’s over his head, he had no experience, he is merely a puppet for his speechwriters. It was interesting, and it proves conservatism. Let’s look forward to the natural correction that will occur in 2012, and enjoy the correction that just occured November 2nd. Happy new years everybody! Here’s to a generation of personal responsibility and conservative values. Still the greatest nation on earth in spite of Obama and his outspoken self-avowed Communist “role models” he acknowleges as shaping him in his own books.

  106. Roncella says:

    freakwater, Let me remind you that your views are extreme leftest/liberal and represent a small minority of the public.

    The tea Party folks represent a large portion of America, from all parts of America, remember they helped elect 63 conservatives to the House.

    If there is retardation anywhere its in the lack of reasoning and understanding that would describe most Liberals/progressives to a Tea….

  107. chip98404 – don’t think your facts are straight. Try reading ‘More Welfare, More Poverty” – Michael D. Tanner – Sept, 2006. The poverty rate in 2005 was 12.6%. Since LBJ declared War on Poverty in 1964, the poverty rate is about the same. LBJ’s War on poverty failed and we spent over 10 trillion dollars. An article in the TNT recently stated the poverty rate has gone up to around 14% (I’m sure due to the recession). Money can’t solve the problem but Democrats come up with more programs every year so they can buy then keep the low income vote. (if you are up on things – Lisa Brown – D pushed two new programs through our Legislature but there wasn’t enought money to fund them. Last year she said she would fund them this year – out of touch?)

    Social welfare programs have helped seniors. Seniors have gone from around a 20% poverty rate to around a 10% poverty rate. They are better off than many because of Medicare and Social Security.

  108. I imagine that this generation didn’t understand Bullwinkle……

  109. First_Lefty says:

    “Roncella says:
    December 30, 2010 at 2:00 pm
    freakwater, Let me remind you that your views are extreme leftest/liberal and represent a small minority of the public.

    The tea Party folks represent a large portion of America, from all parts of America, remember they helped elect 63 conservatives to the House.”

    Roncella…..please!!!!!!!!!!! The “TEA Party” is a minority segment of the Republican Party formerly known as the Christian Conservatives. They are people mostly over the age of 65 that complain about the government as they cash their government checks and use Medicare.

    If they had so much power, why did their obvious leaders (as opposed to those using them for votes) lose – Sharron Angle and Christine O’Donnell? I’m a Democrat and I think Harry Reid is the weakest excuse for a Senator in the entire nation and Angle lost to him. The TEA Party actually assisted the Democrats in holding the Senate, thank you very much.

    Did you notice how fast Scott Brown deep sixed the “TEA Partiers” as soon as he was elected. He has crossed the isle several times to help Dems get a majority since his election not quite a year ago. He knows he’ll never win in Massachusettes again with only that support.

    Enjoy celebrating the mid terms which were not a whole lot unlike previous mid term elections. The best is yet to come. The GOP has to actually govern in Congress. No more excuses. No more blank pages on the budget.

    That loud thud you hear is the TEA Party getting dropped on their collective butts now that the GOP got the majority of the House.

    And not even a kiss goodnight……

  110. MoD – not sure who you are describing but radec seems to fit the bill.

    Being persistent may be annoying, or being persistently annoying, or being unwilling to see what is so clear to you, but none of those things – in and of themselves – makes one a troll.

  111. First_Lefty says:

    TMell – I think you missed a couple of Conservative talking points in your comment. You failed to mention that Obama was born in Kenya and is a Muslim.

  112. First_Lefty says:

    “notice how he can’t get 1 single conservative to join his blog, even though they have tried! Gee, I wonder why?”

    Oh, that’s easy! Anyone that wants to look on the archives of the blog will see that a few Conservatives posted in the beginning, when it was open posting. Unfortunately they were the kind that just wanted to cause trouble and play namecalling games and that was why the newspaper’s comments were being shut down on a daily basis.

    If the TNT doesn’t mind – http://thurstonblog.blogspot.com is the blog in conversation. Take a look and make up your own minds. It is an adult blog and not intended for children. Certain words and images may not be suitable or may offend of the weak of constitution.

    Attention TNT moderators- if posting that site was a violation of your terms, it is not intentional. I just figured since radec needs to bring it up constantly, we might as well let the readers check it out and make up their own minds. In my eyes, it’s no different than posting a site for resource, but I’ll let your actions be the final word.

  113. First_Lefty says:

    “chile74 says:
    December 30, 2010 at 3:06 pm
    The poverty rate in 2005 was 12.6%. Since LBJ declared War on Poverty in 1964, the poverty rate is about the same. LBJ’s War on poverty failed and we spent over 10 trillion dollars.”

    That’s an interesting take, Chile74. Who is to say that poverty might not have been worse if not for Johnson’s programs?

    If spending money is the issue, what did we get for all the money that we are spending in Iraq and Afghanistan?

    Back to poverty. How much dismantling of Johnson’s programs was done during the Reagan, Bush 1 and Bush 2 Administrations? How can a program that is not consistantly applied be termed a failure?

  114. First_Lefty says:

    Fberg – just for fun, why don’t you try to comment on the letter to the editor?

  115. Since when is a comment about the size of a poster’s head censorship-worthy?

  116. First_Lefty says:

    So Fberg – you agree with the assertion that Obama said “that the reason for our poor economy was because George Bush cut the taxes on the rich”…

    …..even though he said nothing of the sort?

    I’m impressed with your critical thinking.

  117. Why comment on it Brainy Smurf?

    Are you even aware when you are being disingenous? radec brought up the cartoon character and you posted (more than once) who brilliant that post was.

    You and radec are the reason why the comments on Brainy Smurf are here.

  118. Hey Matthew,

    QUICK! What’s 2+2?

    You, like so many pathetic brainwashed pukes I lovingly refer to repukeicans, will most likely suck off the system and benefit greatly when you retire. but it is all a sham, right? a ponzi scheme? then don’t accept it, or medicare when it’s your turn. live it brainiac. cat food is pretty cheap.

  119. BTW-

    I have no conservative friends. I stay away from idiots.

  120. tmell,

    do you do stand-up comedy? Nanny state? Really? Tell that to the 40 thousand AMERICANS that die each year to a lack of health care. I am sure your sage wisdom will be very comforting to them in the great beyond. you repukes like that sky god crap stuff, right?

  121. First_Lefty says:

    beerBoy – fberg’s lack of ability to appropriately use a comma confused the entire statement.

    What we’ve learned today from fberg is that he isn’t much of critical analysis of politics, but knows a lot about the characters on a children’s cartoon series from the 80s.

    Hopefully he was a child in the 80s, as was my son who was born 38 years ago today. Actually, by 1980, he was out of the Smurf thing and his little brother was into it.

    If fberg is older than about 34, we have an interesting topic to discuss as a sidebar.

    Of course, he could have followed the comic strip in Belgium during the late 1950s, until they hit American TV.

  122. First_Lefty says:

    emoo –

    Don’t hold back. You’re on a roll.

  123. First_Lefty says:

    “sozo says:
    December 30, 2010 at 5:06 pm
    Since when is a comment about the size of a poster’s head censorship-worthy?”

    Check the date underneath your moniker for the answer to your question.

  124. MarksonofDarwin says:

    It’s OK bB. I wasn’t talking about being persistent. Nothing wrong with that at all.

    I see some of the same posters trying to provoke an emotional response as their only Raison d’être on this forum. If you don’t see that, and don’t even know who I’m referring to, I’m happy to just leave it at that. There are many more interesting subjects for us to spend our time on.

  125. 125 comments to a letter with ridiculous content says something. There is more to an assertive statement the more it rules out. Mr. Philichi’s letter rules out reason perfectly. Congratulations Matt! You win the prize.

  126. First_Lefty says:

    radec says:
    December 29, 2010 at 5:38 pm
    snore, snore, zzzzzzzzz. Reading FL’s post works better than Ambien!

    Read more: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2010/12/27/state-run-casinos/#ixzz19iGM62zR

    says it who follows me all over the internet.

    Can you imagine making repeated return trips to a blog that supposedly offends you so much? Sort of like asking the obscene phone caller to call you back when you are not so busy.

  127. Roncella says:

    emoo, There is no reasoning with lib/progressives like you.

    Most Conservatives are positive about the future, no matter whats happening at the moment.

    Many of the liberals I am friends always see the glass as haft empty, while conservatives see the glass as haft full.

    Two Presidents who fit this explanation clearly,

    President Carter, Liberal, bitter, unhappy, even to this day. (sounds like emoo)

    President Ronald Reagan, Happy upbeat, positive about so many things, feel good man who restored confidence back to Americans when they needed it the most.

  128. First_Lefty says:

    “radec says:
    December 31, 2010 at 12:08 am “

    lurks in the middle of the night to avoid the moderators

  129. First_Lefty says:

    I guess the moderator must have dumped radec’s claim to be monitoring our blog much like the FBI monitors terrorists.

    I’m sure radec monitors the porn sites on the internet to report back on them also.

    Does anyone else remember than Sheriff Andy Taylor only allowed Barney Fife to have one bullet and he had to keep it in his pocket?

  130. First_Lefty says:

    “Roncella says:
    December 31, 2010 at 10:01 am
    emoo, There is no reasoning with lib/progressives like you.

    Most Conservatives are positive about the future, no matter whats happening at the moment.”

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    One needs only to drift back about two months before the 2010 elections to see how positive Conservatives were…..

    Roncella…..please….don’t ever change. We need the laughs you provide.

  131. First_Lefty says:

    This is a comment from the link that radec provided. It is a great insight into the “mind” of my stalker:

    ” Vaticano 12/12/2010 08:45 PM

    I’m not concerned about homosexuality. I’m a Christian, I do not believe that homosexuals chooses to be homosexuals but I also do not believe that Homosexuals were born that way either. But, if a homosexuals wants to convince themselves that they were born that way, fine. If a homosexual wants to continue to live that way, fine. As along as it does not interfere with the definition of marriage.

    Read more: http://www.theolympian.com/2010/12/12/1471516/time-to-let-gays-be-who-they-are.html#disqus_thread#ixzz19iL6EgqP

    Nothing like a well thought, well written, concise comment that has nothing to do with facts. Remember folks, radec posted it.

  132. President Carter – Habitat for Humanity, actively working to find a solution to the I/P conflict

    President Ronald Reagan – did nothing of any significance after his office….most likely due to the effects of Alzheimer’s.

  133. First_Lefty – I find radec to be a stalker and a troll and a general waste of time who should be banned from this site. However, when you respond to in-kind you just degrade the conversation further and provide ammo for those who wish to disparage you.

    Stop. Both of you. Please.

  134. “Stop. Both of you. Please.”

    I second that request.

  135. MarksonofDarwin says:

    I concur.
    Can we get a consensus?

  136. First_Lefty says:

    beerBoy:

    You are right. I’ve overdone my fun.

    It was nice to see “Marks” concur that radec is a stalker and troll (wasn’t it Marks that was calling me a troll before radec appeared? Oh well…)

    and since “rr” has jumped in with a limp concur, I must really quit.

    Earlier in the thread I recall “Marks” and “rr” having a conversation about the entertainment value of trolls…..

    If you ARE aware, and are having fun…then have at it!
    Cheers!

    P.S.
    I hope that you are able to read this before the troll goes snivelling to the board nanny and has this removed.
    It’s a curious thing here….but the trolls are protected and coddled for some bizarre reason

    Kinda funny how a real troll upsets “Marks” and “rr”…..gosh…I was just – what was Marks’ phrase? Oh…yeah….HAVING FUN!

    I must not have gone snivelling to the “board nanny” as accused

    OK….enough…I’m off my soapbox.

  137. I’ll have you know that I have popped a Viagra to salute the new year in…

    No limp anything here !

  138. JudasEscargot says:

    too much information, rr

  139. JudasEscargot says:

    One thing is clear. First_Lefty isn’t going to take any crappola from anyone.

  140. Dude – this isn’t about taking crappola, this is about the ability to play in the discussion board sandbox…

  141. waaaay too much information rr.

  142. MarksonofDarwin says:

    Yea, it’s ALL about taking crappola. *rolls eyes*

    “The ugly and the stupid have the best of it in this world. They can sit at their ease and gape at the play. If they know nothing of victory, they are at least spared the knowledge of defeat.”
    Oscar Wilde

    With that I’m done with this conversation.

    Oh wait….TMI rr!

  143. Good grief. This is pathetic. I recently attempted to lure an intellectual friend of mine onto this site to add a comment or two from time to time. He visited a few times, then said, “And why would I want to waste my time in conversations such as these?”

    Good question, though I have found a few posters to be quite interesting, and I have appreciated those who counter my opinions…meaning of course those who actually engage as opposed to those who simply like to hear their own voices.

    The censor clipped a note I sent to FL the other day in which I said I hoped he’d been able to find a pillow big enough to accommodate his head. . Let’s see if they 86 this one.

    This thread really deteriorated into puerility though, so I probably won’t bother coming back to check.

  144. JudasEscargot says:

    Dude, I read over the entire thread and the first thing I noticed is that Lefty handed you your gluteous maximus on the subject of the letter. I haven’t seen as much dancing since Palin’s kid on TV. Since you claim it’s about “playing in the discussion board sandbox” – on the purity of the content of the letter in question, Lefty was spot on and you played as much dodgeball as a middle school boys gym class. I wish I would have been around during the discussion to toss in a few before the troll/stalker took the thread to crapland.

  145. JudasEscargot says:

    sozo – what would an intellect see in your companionship? Your only contributions to this thread were an attempt to insult Lefty and a complaint when the online editor dumped your trashy comment. If your intellectual friend has nothing more to offer than what I see from you, we’ll live without their input. Here’s a tip – you can’t hear your voice on an internet blog.

  146. JudasEscargot says:

    sozo commented – “The censor clipped a note I sent to FL the other day in which I said I hoped he’d been able to find a pillow big enough to accommodate his head. . Let’s see if they 86 this one.

    This thread really deteriorated into puerility though, so I probably won’t bother coming back to check.”

    I’d say snarky comments about pillows and head size contribute to puerility quite well

  147. Concernedfather says:

    So, can we admit that we have ALL been lied to, regardless of party affiliation?
    Or is it too hard to get past the US vs. THEM game that politics perpetuates to distract the masses?

    I have news for you, party matters NOT, the puppeteer cares not who is at the end of the strings; and they are ALL at the end of the strings.

  148. I don’t know if reading Judas defend Lefty is cute, or pathetic. I will have to sleep on it to decide…….

    I wonder if radec knows about Judas?

  149. JudasEscargot says:

    Oh….3rd Pig….I mean Roll_On……

    sleep on this……

  150. Do you have a point that adds to the discussion MOD? And is your sniveling comment alleging the board nanny is unfair designed to manipulate and undermine the system? Or is it, so you can become coddled, protected and gain an advantage?

    A troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages disrupting discussion, which fits your comment perfectly.

  151. Roll_On says:

    Good morning. Well, I slept on it, and I decided pathetic.

    As far as 3rd Pig, hate to burst your bubble, but we are not the same.

    Since this is the first day of a brand new year, I have decided to end my “obsession” of who uses what name and just play the game.

    Truce?!

    Happy New Year everybody!!!!!

  152. Well, I DID return this morning, forgetting momentarily the nature of this thread.

    Judas, I have no idea why my intelligent friends like to hang around me; perhaps I’m their token Philistine And you’re absolutely right, I went south regarding Lefty because I find him to be so gaseously egocentric and tiresome I took a shot at him. I won’t be doing it again.

    Apologies to the rest of you for my tumble to the bottom step.

  153. JudasEscargot says:

    well sozo – I knew you couldn’t resist checking in to see what your handywork would bring.

    A read of the thread, if your comprehension is decent, would demonstrated that Lefty was mounting a logical argument, but in Conservativeland, that is frowned upon.

    By the way, you just took another shot at Lefty while you were saying you wouldn’t.

  154. JudasEscargot says:

    Roll_On – I give you less than a week.

  155. beerBoy says:

    sozo – it is apparent that condescension doesn’t annoy you when it is used in service of viewpoints you support……

  156. First_Lefty says:

    Here is the initial post that got the Rabid Right all upset:

    First_Lefty says:
    December 29, 2010 at 4:18 pm
    “You were told by President Obama that the reason for our poor economy was because George Bush cut the taxes on the rich.”

    Please cite the day of this alleged quote.

  157. First_Lefty says:

    Morning, beerBoy!

    As you can see, I’ll give them another chance to argue the point of the letter.

  158. First_Lefty says:

    Here’s another chance:

    “You were told by President Roosevelt that his “New Deal” would end the Great Depression. It made it last longer and longer”

    Demonstrate proof, please.

  159. First_Lefty says:

    “You were told by President Lyndon Johnson that his policies would end poverty in America”

    Again, cite the quote, date and place.

  160. First_Lefty says:

    Now, watch the insults reign.

  161. sue1234 says:

    Matthew..
    Bush lied about iraq and murdered american soldiers on purpose.
    Bush allowed 911 to happen
    Bush grew the size of govt by 42%
    Bush increased spending by 104%
    Bush did not put the wars in the budget
    Bush borrowed money from China and DID NOT PAY ANY OF IT BACK
    Bush left the country in an economic mess.
    Bush’s ownership society allowed subprime loans and the subsequent housing crash.
    41% of what Obama has spent has been on BUSH’S debt.
    Matthew the lies come from the GOP, which is nothing but a cult.
    You GOPcultmembers put your sociopathic ideology BEFORE whats good for America. Then like good brainwashed cultlings like you are.. you blame the democrats.
    Matthew you just project your vile ideology and actions onto democrats. It is the GOPCULT that has brought America to its knees. Republicans are not fit to call themselves American.

  162. Roncella says:

    sue1234, You really need to get professional help in treating your Bush Hate syndrom.

    If you are getting your information from MSNBC, Mr. Ed, or Keith Olbermann, Chirs Mathews, Rachel Maddow, do yourself a favor and turn them off to clear your mind. NPR, soros supported, Link T.V. take a break, from these twisted programs before your reasoning ability is totally gone.

  163. sue1234 says:

    Roncella.. i get my information from the congressional record. Its so funny what you gopcult members DO NOT KNOW. You only know what your cult wants you to know. Interesting that you dont have the facts. I suggest you read outside your gopcult and really learn what is going on.. Roncella.. some more facts you dont know:
    Reagan increased our deficit by 189%
    Reagan increased taxes many times
    Reagan negoitated with terrorist
    Reagan was a babykiller
    Reagan cheated on his wife
    Roncella smart people want facts… all you are are the lies myths and delusions of the gopcult. Wallow in your cult ignorance, trust me the gop elite love that you vote against your own best interests. its why they keep you as ignorant as you are.

    Roncella. you know dont you, that FOX NEWS won a lawsuit in which they argued it was their right to lie and distort news to their viewers. Also, the 5th university study came out that agreed with the previous 4: FOX NEWS viewers are GROSSLY MISINFORMED.
    Sure is a lot you dont know… eh?

  164. First_Lefty says:

    “fbergford says:
    January 1, 2011 at 1:47 pm
    Oh great we got Brainy Smurf commenting again! ”

    Proof that they are not capable of having a logical discussion on the subject.

  165. First_Lefty says:

    sue – Roncella’s problem is avoidance of reality based news broadcasts.

    Ed Schultz (if Roncella would watch or listen) is a perfect example. He says “yes, I’m entitled to my opinion and I’ll share it, but I’m not entitled to my own facts”

    I wonder if Roncella can even come close to getting his alleged mind around that statement?

  166. First_Lefty says:

    Oh..and National Public Radio is not a reliable source. They were formerly called “educational radio”.

    It’s amazing how the Conservatives will attack anything that has an intention of providing the public with truth.

  167. Roncella says:

    sue1234, Anyone that can believe the tripe that you swallow has to be angry and mad and sad all the time.

    Anyone that can admire and believe in the likes of Bill Clinton, Jimmy Carter, Barb Boxer, Barney Frank, Al Frankin, Nancy Pelosi, so many others, is disappointing.

    Sue, I guess you figure your smarter and wiser than millions of Amercians across the Country who voted 63 new Conservative house members in to change the direction the Country has been going, especially the last two years.

    break out of your circle of hate and twisted opinions.

  168. sue1234 says:

    Roncella I can see you cant comprehend well what you read. It’s all in the official usa govt documents you fool. You can lie to yourself all you want,Roncella. it wont make the facts untrue. Funny that you dont know all these facts and second, like a cultmember, you just dismiss any information that is contradictory to your cults lies myths and delusions. Please stop trying to imply you are the educated rational person. You are nothing but a sad cliche of the abused and exploited cultmember or republican rank and file member. Keep voting republican im sure you will get rich eventually..lolol

  169. First_Lefty says:

    Sue –

    Read Roncella’s comment on this thread –

    http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2010/12/30/reductions-continue-at-weyerhaeuser/#comments

    then you will understand how utterly hopeless Roncella is.

  170. First_Lefty says:

    “I guess you figure your smarter and wiser than millions of Amercians across the Country who voted 63 new Conservative house members in to change the direction the Country has been going, especially the last two years”

    The humor here is that said house members haven’t had to govern one day yet. It’s easy to get elected, but difficult to govern. Rand Paul has already proven that.

    I remember the “Contract with America” that got a bunch elected and did absolutely nothing in terms of governing the country. Most of them are gone.

  171. sue1234 says:

    First Lefty, ok everything is crystal clear now!

  172. First_Lefty says:

    sue – brainwashed, isn’t he?

  173. whatIdo says:

    “it is the Republicans’ premise that unrestricted markets will cure the ills of society”

    strawman or false dichotomy?

    anyone???

  174. beerBoy says:

    pithy but hardly witty.

    your choices provided “strawman or false dichotomy?” is just like: “have you stopped beating your wife?”

    Demonstrate that my statement, while admittedly a stereotype that doesn’t hold in all circumstances, isn’t based in the rhetoric of the Right.

    Gotta love this for projection:
    break out of your circle of hate and twisted opinions.
    Hard to believe that someone could be so self-unaware.

  175. JudasEscargot says:

    “it is the Republicans’ premise that unrestricted markets will cure the ills of society”

    strawman or false dichotomy?

    How about a third choice? Accurate statement

    “Numerous studies show that nations create more jobs and more prosperity the more they free their economies.” – Heritage Foundation.

    Who speaks more for The Republicans than the Heritage Foundation?

  176. JudasEscargot says:

    Oh, I forgot, they didn’t cite the “numerous studies” Not one.

  177. Roncella says:

    First_Lefty, I’m certain Sue got a good night sleep last night, now that you have become her spokesperson, in denfending her hateful, bias posts.

    You are the King of Bias Posts in my humble opinion.

  178. beerBoy says:

    And the soot-covered pot, upon seeing his reflection in the pristinely polished kettle exclaimed, “You are the King of Bias Posts in my humble opinion.”

  179. “Here’s a tip – you can’t hear your voice on an internet blog.” — Judas

    My apologies…I presumed readers here had at least a wee measure of understanding of the literary. Perhaps you can go back and back in your mind to a lit class when your teacher tried to teach you about “voice?” I’ll bet you were the kid in the back of the room who snorked out something brilliant then too.

  180. Judas – your quote “Numerous studies…” I believe comes from a piece in the Washington Times dated January 28, 2010. From that opinion/analysis piece I found the following:

    The Author of the piece
    The organization he represents
    A study (title) – Index of Economic Freedom
    Sponsors – Heritage Foundation and the Wall Street Journal
    A research source – National Bureau of Economic Research

    The piece provided an analysis of 6 of 10 factors used to calculate the economy’s overall level of freedom, a summary of what and why.

    A search of the title found the document itself as well as a link to the Executive Highlights, Economic Freedom in Uncertain Times – Chapter 1, the data itself (rankings and scores), a link to the Jobs and Freedom site, a listing of the top 10 countries per the study, a FAQ, Q.3 provides an overview of how economic is measured. They source data appears to come from the World Bank Doing Business Study. At the bottom of each individual factor is a paragraph labeled: Sources.

    Thanks for the link, looks like an interesting read.

  181. whatIdo says:

    Demonstrate that it is.
    One or two quotes where anyone advocates for “unrestricted markets” or where they have stated they would “cure the ills of society” will suffice.
    But, as usual, I will not be holding my breath.
    .
    How do you like this one???

    beerBoy says:
    December 1, 2010 at 5:34 am
    your gross generalization about… is what is known as a strawman argument as you have made a claim that can’t be supported.

    Kooky huh?

  182. beerBoy says:

    In addition to JE’s attribution from the Heritage Foundation

    How Free Markets Would Make Our World A Better, Friendlier, and Safer Place
    http://www.squidoo.com/freemarket

    Cooperation: How a Free Market Benefits Everyone
    http://mises.org/daily/3015

    In a Truly Free Market, BP Would Be Toast
    http://c4ss.org/content/2685

    The Free Market: Cornerstone of a Free Society
    http://www.fffa.us/position-papers/the-free-market-cornerstone-of-1/

    How Capitalism Will Save Us: Why Free People and Free Markets Are the Best Answer
    http://books.google.com/books?id=KQsLxskq3xsC&pg=PA321&lpg=PA321&dq=free+market+benefit+of+society&source=bl&ots=9tzQwjfH8X&sig=sdJEXuS03vrtJxH08GmR6kKo0kI&hl=en&ei=H_8gTdCtGIiqsAOVzfimDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CC0Q6AEwBDg8#v=onepage&q=free%20market%20benefit%20of%20society&f=false

    Where The Free Market Reigns, People Benefit
    http://www.proudprofiteer.com/2010/04/where-the-free-market-reigns-people-benefit/

    Moral Views of Market Society
    sociology.berkeley.edu/profiles/fourcade/pdf/ARS%202007.pdf

    How a Free Society Could Solve Global Warming
    http://www.google.com/search?q=free+market+benefit+of+society&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a#q=free+market+benefit+of+society&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=ZCs&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=ivns&ei=8gAhTaSOKZC-sQPl7KngCg&start=150&sa=N&fp=83f87efc6f926f13

    There’s more, but what’s the point. WhoJimmWhat isn’t really interested in ideas, just a continuation of his ad hominem stalk.

  183. sue1234 says:

    Roncella
    Thirty of the U.S. states reap more in federal spending than their citizens
    contribute to the federal government in taxes
    .The other 20 states provide more in taxes than they receive in spending.
    In the 2000 U.S. presidential election, George W. Bush
    won most of the states that are net beneficiaries of federal spending programs, while Al Gore won most of the states that are net contributors to federal spending.
    Tell me why blue states are supporting red states with our tax dollars.

  184. Roncella says:

    sue1234, Say what you will about who pays and who gets according to colors on a map, But the top 2 % pay the most in Federal Taxes, and the bottom 50% get to use the government programs paid for by the top 2%.

    You can slice and dice all you want with grafts and colors on maps but the folks in the lower income brackets are not paying much in Federal Taxes.

    In fact many are receiving help from their state or the Federal Government. Many get food stamps, or housing or some other program they can qualify for.

    The Class Warfare that has been provoked by President Obama and some of the Dems. in the Congress helps no one, it only causes hate and jealously between the citizens.

  185. whatIdo says:

    Tought I’d pop in for a minute and see what’s shakin’.
    Thanks for the links B (finally) I looked at the first 2… couldn’t find anything close to “unrestricted markets will cure the ills of society”.

    Nice try tho. I hope you didn’t waste too much time. If you’re anything like me, your time is valuable.

    So, strawman it is.

  186. beerBoy says:

    beerBoy says:
    January 2, 2011 at 2:52 pm
    There’s more, but what’s the point. WhoJimmWhat isn’t really interested in ideas, just a continuation of his ad hominem stalk.

    Read more: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2010/12/29/admit-it-you-were-lied-to/#ixzz19ylVtHf4

  187. whatIdo says:

    Ideas? Are you saying making patently false statements constitutes an idea?
    .
    Anyway, I won’t bother now with a copy/paste, but if you review just this thread you’ll find another 2 perfect examples of why I started filing…. it has to do with condescention and stalking.

    Later.

  188. sharkie69 says:

    Roncella says:
    January 2, 2011 at 3:45 pm
    sue1234, Say what you will about who pays and who gets according to colors on a map, But the top 2 % pay the most in Federal Taxes, and the bottom 50% get to use the government programs paid for by the top 2%.
    Read more: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2010/12/29/admit-it-you-were-lied-to/#ixzz19zW95jqn

    Roncella says:
    January 1, 2011 at 10:48 am
    The top 1% of income earners pay 40% of the taxes in the Country.

    Most of the folks paying loads of money to the Federal Government are Republicans.
    Read more: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/letters/2010/12/30/reductions-continue-at-weyerhaeuser/#ixzz19zWPKXnw

    If you keep throwing things at the wall, Roncella, something might stick

  189. JudasEscargot says:

    rr – my post had nothing to do with anything in the Washington Post. It came from the Heritage Foundation website.

    Bottom line – Conservatives DO say “unrestricted markets will cure the ills of society”

  190. sue1234 says:

    Roncella you didnt answer the question. Tell me why the Blues states have to support the Red states with our tax dollars? Are you unable to understand the question form?

  191. fbergford says:

    First lefty I’m a democrat….down with republicans, I just don’t like you! I don’t like your smug attitude! Have you seen the Southpark episode where all the smug people in the world fart in wine glasses and smell it…it’s a pretty funny episode, but you remind me of them too!

  192. FirstLefty – It appears that whatido just said that I am being condescending because he thinks my stalker is of a higher caliber than your stalker.

  193. Roncella says:

    Sue1234, Almost all the big city/state governments that are in the worse shape have been controlled by lib/dems for years. Examples, L.A., Chicago, Detroit Boston,New York, New Jersey, Calif, Mass, Il., etc.

    The Federal Government adds to the misery for the states financial condition, by passing the expense of special programs back onto them to pay for. (Most of the programs have been approved by Dem.Controlled Congresses/and the President)

    As far as why red states get some benefits from the taxes collected by blue states, thats the way the system of taxation is set up for the Country.

    Surely you being a very intelligent & knowledgeable teacher for many years, should be able to understand how the tax system works Nationally..

    A foot note : The last congress has spent More than the last 100 Congresses have, (a democratically contriolled Congress).

  194. beerBoy says:

    As far as why red states get some benefits from the taxes collected by blue states, thats the way the system of taxation is set up for the Country.

    Really ron……are you saying that the taxation is set up to punish liberals and reward conservatives? So why are the conservatives always whining about taxes?

  195. rr98411 says:

    Judas – My response was to your post 1/2 – 0946 & 0947. My belief was that your statements were a broad brush approach that is typical in partisan discussions. Never said your post had anything to do with the WA Times, I was countering you broad brush statement that “they didn’t cite the “numerous sources” It was an opinion piece that typically does not cite specific references but cite general sources for the basis of their opinion… typically.

    I am interested what sources you refer to with your bottom line statement – Conservatives DO say “unrestricted markets will cure the ills of society” ‘unrestricted’… that belief seems more in line with libertarians. The study seems to suggest that free markets tend to do better that restricted markets. And that is a good thing because Obama seems to agree…

    “Contrary to the claims of some of my critics and some of the editorial pages, I am an ardent believer in the free market.”
    Barack Obama

  196. whatIdo says:

    beerBoy says:
    January 3, 2011 at 12:10 pm
    …. he thinks my stalker is of a higher caliber than your stalker.
    ……..
    beerBoy wrote on 04/24/2010 06:06:36 AM:
    Someone who thinks he knows how others think is a fool.

    :) fishy fishy fishy….

  197. JudasEscargot says:

    rr – I was quoting the Heritage Foundation’s website. They claimed:

    “Numerous studies show that nations create more jobs and more prosperity the more they free their economies.”

    – yet, they didn’t cite one of the said “numerous studies”.

    Now, for me to say that Conservatives make the claim that free market will cure the ills of society isn’t a broad brush, since I provided a quote, and considering that beerBoy provided about a half dozen more to substantiate our claims.

    Finally, Barack Obama’s claim to be an ardent believer in free market is all fine and good, but doesn’t negate the issue that several Conservative sources said precisely as we stipulated.

    Now, if you’d like to tie Barack Obama to Conservatives on the basis of a common belief in free market, be my guest.

  198. JudasEscargot says:

    Roncella – you make claims about the fiscal condition of all these major cities and yet try to dodge the point that the of the top 10 states receiving federal funds in excess of their contributions, 80% are Conservative voting states.

    You’ve got more moves that Leon Washington.

  199. JudasEscargot says:

    Read it and weap, Roncella. These are the 2004 figures and I’m not going to chase down the more recent because demographics of this kind don’t change drastically, other than maybe in a select state that hit a jackpot:

    States Receiving Most in Federal Spending Per Dollar of Federal Taxes Paid:

    1. D.C. ($6.17) (Now this is a no brainer – it’s not a state and relies on federal taxes)

    2. North Dakota ($2.03)
    3. New Mexico ($1.89)
    4. Mississippi ($1.84)
    5. Alaska ($1.82)
    6. West Virginia ($1.74)
    7. Montana ($1.64)
    8. Alabama ($1.61)
    9. South Dakota ($1.59)
    10. Arkansas ($1.53)

    In contrast, of the 16 states that are “losers” — receiving less in federal spending than they pay in federal taxes — 69% are Blue States that voted for Al Gore in 2000. Indeed, 11 of the 14 (79%) of the states receiving the least federal spending per dollar of federal taxes paid are Blue States. Here are the Top 10 states that supply feed for the federal trough (with Blue States highlighted in bold):

    States Receiving Least in Federal Spending Per Dollar of Federal Taxes Paid:

    1. New Jersey ($0.62)
    2. Connecticut ($0.64)
    3. New Hampshire ($0.68)
    4. Nevada ($0.73)
    5. Illinois ($0.77)
    6. Minnesota ($0.77)
    7. Colorado ($0.79)
    8. Massachusetts ($0.79)
    9. California ($0.81)
    10. New York ($0.81)

    Note that for all your caterwauling about California, they only take back 81 cents on every dollar they pay to the Fed.

  200. JudasEscargot is First Lefty

  201. ronniew says:

    sue is sumner

  202. Well…..maybe my stalker isn’t a higher caliber after all. I mean, there was that whole bit where he kept insisting that I was moderate and his neverending joy being able to show the world that I used arts as a screen name from work in the County. Kinda the same as the previous two posts. But then, I like to think that he is better…..I mean, after all, he is so proficient at copy and paste and he is organized in being able to call up various quotes at a moment’s notice from a folder on his desktop…..

*
We welcome comments. Please keep them civil, short and to the point. ALL CAPS, spam, obscene, profane, abusive and off topic comments will be deleted. Repeat offenders will be blocked. Thanks for taking part and abiding by these simple rules.

JavaScript is required to post comments.

Follow the comments on this post with RSS 2.0