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NUKES: Protesters trying to save us from ourselves

Letter by Fletcher Taylor, Tacoma on Dec. 14, 2010 at 2:20 pm with 42 Comments »
December 14, 2010 2:20 pm

Last year, five anti-nuclear war protesters broke into the Kitsap-Bangor Sub Base, where they put up banners for peace. Their intent was to challenge the legality and morality of the storage and use of nuclear weapons of mass destruction. Now, in Tacoma’s federal court, a jury has found them them guilty for their action.

Their action was both a civil disobedience and an effort to save us from ourselves. Each of the eight Trident subs at Bangor house up to 24 Trident II D5 SSBN missiles, each missile with eight WW88 atomic warheads, each warhead with 475 kilotons of explosive power. The bomb that erased Hiroshima was only 15 kilotons.

In recent congressional hearings, scientists such as Dr. Alan Robock presented their calculations of the effects of limited nuclear warfare on our world’s climate. Extrapolated, their findings showed that the equivalent of two Trident II D5 class missile deployments could significantly change the global climate for the next 10 years. These scientists use words like “global nuclear winter” and “famine” to describe what would happen to our once green planet.

Our nation’s efforts to disarm have been slowed because the U.S. is hesitant to set an example by being first to disarm. What is the risk in disarmament? That we do not use atomic weapons to defend ourselves from foes that would use theirs? Even in such a scenario, there are no winners, and the Earth loses.

Leave a comment Comments → 42
  1. Ohhh! The Earth!

  2. Dr. Robock is deserving of a prize. I’m Thinking the annual Neville Chamberlain prize for naivete and spinelessness might be appropriate. Lacking that the Nobel Peace Prize. Obama didn’t save the world, but he made a good speech. Perhaps Robock can borrow his teleprompter.

  3. lgcnelson84 says:

    Pretty sure they were found guilty of Trespassing among other things because they tampered with government property by disregarding No Trespassing signs and cutting through the chain link fence, which comes out of our tax dollars to fix.

    Instead of being authentically peaceful and respectful by holding their protest outside the bases fence, they took it upon themselves to force their way in. They were self serving, unwilling to have a discussion with those from other points of view, and they were acting illegally.

    There are plenty of other perfectly acceptable ways of getting their message across and working toward making a change. They knew that what they were doing was illegal.

  4. Yawn.

  5. nwcolorist says:

    There are many legitimate ways of making a point. This was not one of them.

  6. pazzo242 says:

    “Dr. Alan Robock presented their calculations of the effects of limited nuclear warfare on our world’s climate.”

    I wonder if this is one of the same guys who predicts Global Warming or maybe one of those back in the mid-70’s who predicted the coming Ice Age? Things that make you go Hmmmm.

  7. the3rdpigshouse says:

    Hey Fletcher – please fly to North Korea and cut threw the barbed wire surrounding Kim Jong ILL’s nuclear development facility and let us know how well you are received!

    Don’t expect to be getting a field report from ole Fletcher any time soon!

  8. sumner402 says:

    The predictable right wing first to show up and spew their hate and venom.
    Someone tried to claim they, the right wing were happy, contented, positive and just nicer people.
    How wrong can a person be?

  9. JudasEscargot says:

    Let’s spend as much money as possible on nuclear arms and pretend like we control the world.

    Oh wait…..we are already doing that and it doesn’t work.

  10. Here’s the thing about civil disobedience. One of the reasons one makes the calculated decision to BE disobedient, he/she must be prepared to accept the consequences of that action.

    Protection of our military bases is essential for our safety and the safety of the world.

    As for nuclear weapons, would that we did not have them or need them. They are here to stay, and often in the hands of highly irresponsible people like the leaders of Iran and N. Korea. While we’re all for responsible stewardship of the planet, we need to deal in reality.

    This is our reality.

  11. Sorry for the messy opening sentence above… I jumbled two thoughts together and came up with nonsense!

    It should read:

    Once one makes the calculated decision to BE disobedient, he/she must be prepared to accept the consequences of that action.

  12. sumner402 says:

    We need to cut defense spending by 40%, to start.
    We need the republicans to ratify the new treaty and hold off on their much loved and wanted new cold war.
    The Bangor base commander should be brought up on dereliction charges.

  13. spotted1 says:

    They must accept the consequences of their civil disobedience. Yes, they chose to break in to the base to bring light to the fact that nukes are their. That act was illegal. Their are consequences for those actions. Which is jail or prison time.

    The issue is not the nuclear weapons, it is the crime that they committed while bringing attention to them. If you are not prepared for the consequences, do not commit the crime.

  14. I like the Phrase,being disobedient, as opposed to Breaking The law.This sounds much more Politically correct,wouldn,t you say?But don,t worry,the lenient society we live in,will probably see the Judge, sentence the criminals to either house arrest for 1 month or give them a Suspended Sentence!This will tell other criminals that we have a mouth,but no Teeth!

  15. JudasEscargot says:

    “Instead of being authentically peaceful and respectful by holding their protest outside the bases fence, they took it upon themselves to force their way in. They were self serving, unwilling to have a discussion with those from other points of view, and they were acting illegally. ”

    Dang TEA Partiers! The original ones, that is….

  16. JudasEscargot says:

    “we need to deal in reality”

    The next nuclear strike will probably be the end of mankind.

    There’s reality.

  17. JudasEscargot says:

    “We need the republicans to ratify the new treaty and hold off on their much loved and wanted new cold war.”

    I’m glad two of us figured that out. I was afraid I was becoming paranoid. (pun intended)

    Nothing the GOP loves more than fear. It rallies their base.

  18. Everyone has to have a silly “cause” Sheesh.

    Here is the deal. Violence and war is the nature of humans..Weve been beating up on our neighbors since we were living in caves. That will never, ever change, regardless of how bad the rose colored glass wearing flower smelling peacefreaks want it to happen.

    The way you maintain PEACE….is by building, maintaining and letting the world know you have it, an overwhelming weapon of defense, designed to OBLITERATE anyone who would choose to attack you, and making it crystal clear that you have no qualms about USING it.

    Make the other guy TERRIFIED to lift a finger against this nation. We did it for decades and it worked.

  19. “probably be the end of mankind.”

    Doubtful, but if it serves the purpose to put fear in the heads of the mindless then carry on.

  20. “The next nuclear strike will probably be the end of mankind”.

    “Nothing the GOP loves more than fear. It rallies their base.”

    LOL… took less than 3 minutes to illustrate you are 180 degrees out of phase.

  21. Roncella says:

    Fletcher, You are living in a dream World. The only thing Communist leaders and Socialists leaders and Dictators undersand is Power and strength.

    They do not respect weakness or humility.

    You need to read some history on the build up to the second World War, you could learn much about why Germany and Japan did what they did to Europe and America.

  22. sumner402 says:

    The way you maintain PEACE….is by building, maintaining and letting the world know you have it, an overwhelming weapon of defense, designed to OBLITERATE anyone who would choose to attack you, and making it crystal clear that you have no qualms about USING it.

    20 guys on airplanes with box cutters proved that to be what it is, BS.

  23. JudasEscargot says:

    When will they ever learn?

  24. JudasEscargot says:

    “Dcr628 says:
    December 15, 2010 at 9:53 am
    Make the other guy TERRIFIED to lift a finger against this nation. We did it for decades and it worked.”

    which decades were those?

  25. Escargot…How about the 40s the 50s the 60s and 70s….That attitude was a big part in tearing down the Soviet Union and it kept them in line all that time…It was called DETERRENCE, but I doubt some of you are old enough to remember that.

    No one can argue that it wasnt succesfull…Well I should rephrase that….plenty will argue it, but they wont be successful at it and they will look like the fools they are.

  26. So Judas, you’d like the nukes in the hands of rogue leaders like Ahmadinejad and Kim Jong-il?

    As to your quoting the flower song…”they” will never learn. If history teaches us nothing else, it seems clear that someone somewhere will always be ready to threaten the well-being of others to achieve power. It is the nature of man I’m afraid.

    I’ve debated for decades with a friend about that who seems to think we can ultimately educated people to be peaceful. Nice idea, just like John Lennon’s song “Imagine” is a nice idea, but if education worked we wouldn’t have unwanted pregnancies, junkies OR the tobacco industry. So much for nice.

  27. sumner402 says:

    That attitude was a big part in tearing down the Soviet Union and it kept them in line all that time..

    Except for those times all trough out the 50’s 60’s and 70’s when it didn’t keep them ‘in line’.

  28. sumner402 says:

    So much for nice.

    You should at least try being nice once before you dismiss it outright.
    who knows you might like it.

  29. “Except for those times all trough out the 50’s 60’s and 70’s when it didn’t keep them ‘in line’.” So sumner402, just as I expected, you (and ‘m sure those like you) missed the point.

    So educate us Sumner, when “during those times all throughout the 50s, 60s, and 70s” did the Soviet Union attack the United States? In fact other than decimating their military in Afghanistan (will that be repeated with us?) in the 1980s, and keeping an iron glove on their own citizens and a few satellite nations, and attempting some funny business in Cuba, which was quickly withdrawn as a result of our DETERRENCE factor, when did they really get out of line?

    I don’t expect a valid response from you. I made the conclusion long ago that sharing ideas with most people here is simply a finger exercise on my keyboard and little else…I certainly don’t expect a reasonable response! The sad thing is, with so many who have either forgotten the Cold War, or were never taught about it, dont get it, or think national defense is a dirty word, that our door is left wide open and our rear ends are hanging out in the wind.

  30. Dale – one example of many of how the Cold War – while avoiding overt MAD clashes between US and USSR – was hot and we are still paying for it.

    To subvert the USSR effort in Afghanistan the US covertly supported/trained some “freedom fighters” led by a guy named bin Laden…..

    What people who otherwise have deified every action ever taken by Ronald Reagan have forgotten is that his support for START I helped Gorbachev deal with the hard-liners in the Party and paved the way for serious reform, and ultimately, dismantling of the Communist Party/Soviet Union. Far from the delusion that the Berlin Wall collapsed under the weight of Reagan’s willingness to outspend the Commies on military and his “evil empire rhetoric – it was the opposite – Reagan’s movement from MADness towards sanity that catalyzed the end of the Cold War.

  31. A lawful gathering outside the fence would have disappeared silently into the gaping yawn and this thread would not exist.

    By trespassing the protestors got the coverage they wanted/needed to have their protest have any impact.

    Complaining that they got arrested seems a bit disingenuous.

  32. Here is the problem with posts like this beerboy…people take one idea and run off on tangents with it.

    the fact remains that deterrence worked. when you have a big stick AND are NOT afraid to swing it, people leave you alone.

  33. actually beerboy, the simple design of the communist theory and socialism in general is that economically it is doomed to fail.

    regardless of that fact, it remains a truth that the soviet union, our ONLY real threat at the time, never attacked this nation because of deterrence.

    that FACT can not be argued against.

  34. sumner402 says:

    So educate us Sumner, when “during those times all throughout the 50s, 60s, and 70s” did the Soviet Union attack the United States?

    Korea
    Cuba
    Vietnam
    Central America (remember Iran contra?)
    Afghanistan

    You just have to think about things and not swallow the party line.

  35. Africa (several times)

    Just look who is using AK-47’s and you will see a country where USSR and or Red China attacked western and third world nations.

  36. when you have a big stick AND are NOT afraid to swing it, people leave you alone.</I.

    Except, of course, when they are armed with box cutters…..

  37. its no use….its like talking to a brick wall….Ill stand by my argument and let the rest of you carry on….you dont/wont get it anyway. ;)

  38. and I have a solution to the “box cutter threat” as well that only a barry goldwater would understand that I wont post as it would distract the journalism staff who would have to take valuable time to delete it as offensive ;)

  39. MAD “worked” because there were two nuclear superpowers that actually were sane.

    Now there are many with nukes and their sanity is questionable.

  40. How do people know there are nukes at Bangor?

  41. Roncella we no longer have to fear the big bad commies. The enemy de jour is Muslin Terrorists against whom nuclear weapons are a complete waste of resources.

  42. Good one “coldone” ;) I remember a time when I knew for a fact there were nukes in places where no one ever thought about. ;)

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